Author Topic: excessive fouling  (Read 6532 times)

ramrod

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excessive fouling
« on: June 03, 2013, 05:06:48 AM »
on friday i received 2 green mountain i.b.s. barrels both in 40 cal..  today at range my son and i got to shoot them. load was 40 gr. 3f goex , .017 thick ticking and.395 r. ball . my sons bbl. loaded as easy on shot #30 as on #1, my bbl however i could barely seat ball on #30. upon cleaning when at home my bbl. was noticably more fouled than his. the question i guess is athicker patch the way to go?          any ideas will be greatly apperiacted.

Offline SCLoyalist

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #1 on: June 03, 2013, 06:12:08 AM »
Interesting situation.

What were you using for patch lube?    Any cleaning regimen in either barrel during the 30 shots?  Were all the .395RBs cast from the same mold or drawn from the same box?

Next time, you and he swap guns and see if the fouling difference follows the barrel or follows the shooter.

P.S. I'd try SleepyHills' suggestion about the tight patch on a rod to see if you can detect any differences between the two bores.   Back on the range, you might try recovering a couple of patches from each barrel and see if one barrel treats patches worse than the other with respect to holes in the patches, signs of scorching, burning, etc.     
« Last Edit: June 03, 2013, 05:52:43 PM by SCLoyalist »

Offline hanshi

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2013, 06:24:25 AM »
If both of you used the same components the difference is probably the barrel.  The bore may be slightly larger.  If it is, a thicker patch may be the solution.  Along with a good lube, a good, snug patch cleans the bore with each loading; a looser patch will not and often results in a fouling buildup. 
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SleepyHillBarrels

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2013, 06:33:45 AM »
you mite tell us what length the barrels are .a good place to start is after you cleaned
both barrels did you put a tight patch on the rod and slowly push it down the bore.
in this way you mite feel a rough place or a lose spot or some other difference from one
bore to the other. check each bore with a new tight fitting patch don't use one and pull it
out and push it into the other barrel this wont tell you if there is a difference  in the two
barrels. some barrels are cut deeper in the groves most ml barrels are not gauged closer
than .002 since they don't think it matters after all it is just shooting a rag and a round
ball so they tell me. it mite shoot in after 100 shots or so. you can pull the plugs and slug
the bores and lap the finish if you need to. like I said production barrels don't mean they
are the same it just means they have more lea way before they cull a barrel.
good luck     unleaded :o

ramrod

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2013, 07:43:32 AM »
forget to mention patch lube is hoppes #9 plus bore solvent. i use the same in my 45 cal. forpatch .017 ticking &hoppes #9  lube with .445 dia. ball & shoot all day no wiping in a 32" green mountain bbl . but do agree , 2 bbls. from same company can be different.also no wiping during session. barrels are 32".

ramrod

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2013, 09:32:35 PM »
bbls. are  32" green mountain ibs . lube is hoppes #9 plus  tried .023 ticking patch with same results . bore feels smoothe all the way down. going to try o15 patch next. and the fun continues.


alsask

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2013, 02:36:32 AM »
 I have found fouling issues are more a result of the lube used than anything else.  For hunting I use Crisco, as multiple follow up/repeat shots are not an issue.  Target shooting I get very good results from Hoppes Plus.  I used to use Crisco target practicing but I found the bore would quickly foul compared to Hoppes.

I tried out mink oil and it was comparable to Hoppes except for the price.

2lookindown

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2013, 05:39:10 PM »
Ramrod, Do you and your son both use spit as any moisture for the patch either in loading or cleaning... If so that may be the difference  ???

ramrod

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2013, 12:54:43 AM »
we both used hoppes #9 . i have since tried .021 patch with tc bore solvent 27 shots , no wiping in between and had very little fouling. clean up was a snap, couple of wet patches dry the bbl. & oil . although i had extreemly good results , first shooting session was almost 90 degrees and low humidity and session two was about 65 degrees and very humid. to sum up i wont say i am happy yet . will try this combo. again when hotter.

Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2013, 05:41:23 PM »
 Out here on the left coast, using Crisco for patch lube is a one way ticket to a forest fire. I have found nothing that burns faster,and retains a spark longer, than Crisco. I now use home rendered tallow. Venison, or mutton, work best ( they have the highest flash point) beef works, but not as well. In the winter I dilute the tallow ( because it gets too stiff to use) with a little bear oil, or even olive oil.
 Two weeks ago, the Konocti Rod and Gun Club, put on our Family Fun Shoot ( a shoot open to the public, to encourage non-shooters to give it a try). I loaded a cut down TC 45 cal. Hawkens for the kids, seventy seven consecutive times, without swabbing, or cleaning, in hundred degree temperatures. the lube I was using was donated by a club member, as was the powder, and balls. The lube was TC bore butter, which got pretty loose as the day got hotter, and from previous experience can be pretty stiff on cold days, but it sure didn't catch fire, or even leave a smoking patch.

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Offline Dphariss

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2013, 06:30:05 PM »
Has anyone read the accounts of ML firearms discharging while the load is being pushed down with the rod?
The the first one I remember was back in the 1960s when a shooter at Friendship put the rod and ball through his wrist while loading a pistol. Examination showed excess fouling in the breech held enough heat to light the powder. The other I remember was a shotgun shooter shooting trap as Friendship, again excess fouling in the breech. There have been others but these are the ones that come to mind.
Its something people need to consider before thinking shooting a long string of shots with no cleaning is cool. Its not really safe.

Dan
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Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2013, 08:33:11 PM »
Dan;

  Go to the want ads in the latest Muzzle Blasts, and read the ad for the "Amazing Fire Piston". Same science, bigger parts. If premature discharge could be traced to fowlings in the breech, some of the inlines would shoot you every time you loaded a second shot. Same would be true of the early chambered breech plugs.

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ramrod

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2013, 03:27:48 AM »
changed lube much better results . 42 shots and no fouling problem at all .  clean up took no time . thanks to all who helped .

Offline Gene Carrell

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #13 on: June 15, 2013, 04:24:13 PM »
Lube is of great importance, but so is loading a tight combination. A loose ball/patch will foul greater than tight. Always, IMHO.
Gene

Offline Daryl

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #14 on: June 15, 2013, 07:26:04 PM »
Lube is of great importance, but so is loading a tight combination. A loose ball/patch will foul greater than tight. Always, IMHO.

and start fires due to the blowby igniting the patch - even with straight water for lube.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2013, 07:27:41 PM by Daryl »
Daryl

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Offline Leatherbark

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I can set off 90% achohol with my ramrod
« Reply #15 on: June 17, 2013, 12:34:07 AM »
I can squirt some 90% rubbing alcohol in my Early Va with a Colerain barrel and put a patch on the ramrod and push it down hard and "KAPOW" out the touchhole.  I"ve only done it once , but everyone asked "What the heck happened?" Must have diesel'ed.


Bob

LIBERTY

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Re: excessive fouling
« Reply #16 on: June 27, 2013, 09:15:50 AM »
I HAVE FOUND IN LIFE THAT IT IS NOT A GOOD IDEA TO COMPARE ANY TWO OBJECTS THAT ARE SUPPOSED TO BE THE SAME.DONT COMPARE YOUR BARREL TO ANYONE ELSES!!!! TREAT IT LIKE WHAT IT IS A INDIVIDUAL BARREL THAT IS GOING TO TAKE ITS OWN LOADING DATA TO GET THE BEST OF IT. IF ALL BARRELS WERE THE SAME WE WOULD ONLY NEED ONE LOAD PER CALIBER.