Straight barrels on squirrel rifles

[stuart cee dub]

What techniques should be used with straight barrels to make a nice stock that is not overly skinny though the breech when using 13/16th or thinner barrels
when making a squirrel rifle ?

Backround :I have been working on a late period flint long rifle  that is using  a straight 13/16th barrel ,40’’ long ,.40 caliber using a late Chambers Ketland.
The weight is almost as good as a swamped barrel  but not being swamped the skinny area through the breech takes a bit more thought and there is little room for error .
While I am well on my way through this project, I started thinking about how I would do this differently next time besides just using a swamped barrel .
Here is what I have been thinking about ....

1)Fudge the ramrod hole through the forestock favoring the lock panel molding opposite the lock side so the mainspring will not intrude into the ramrod hole .
2) Use a tapered ramrod
3)Soft solder a bolster, possibly tapered , on the lock side to bump the lock out making the breech area a bit thicker.

The skinny straight 13/16th barrels did not exist in the late period from what I’ve read so perhaps this is a problem only for contemporary builders .
Straight barrels while correct  on small caliber late rifles were quite thick .Originals I have handled while nicely proportioned
handled more like car axles for off- hand shooting. Using a thick barrel just doesn’t make for a good carrying woods rifle.
 
The thin breech area is what concerns me most .
I did not want to file the bolster on the lock itself .I had tried that once before some years ago but did not get sufficient flair,
and that drove the mainspring into the ramrod channel .

Elsewhere ,some members suggested adding material to the lock bolster and frizzen but those are metal working skills and equipment not readily available.
Another member suggested the bolster idea which seemed a good solution .

Has anyone done that ? Any other thoughts or ideas ?

Stuart Cee Dub

[bgf]

You can solder steel to the left and right barrel flats and taper it down if you want the "flare".  You can add a metal sleeve all the way around the barrel for a few inches, also.  There is a rifle by Bob Harn that did that and it looks good (he decorated it some, also).

PS. Here is the link to the Bob Harn rifle on the Contemporary Makers Blog:
http://contemporarymakers.blogspot.com/2010/09/bob-harn-rifle.html

[Old Bob]

I brazed a piece of hacksaw blade onto the bolster of the lock on my first piece which had a straight 13/16" barrel. I was using a precarve stock that already had a lock mortise and was flared out. I did the same to a halfstock  last year, only I used a piece of brass. Neither of mine had to be real thick. In either case, braze or solder the piece on, then file a taper into it afterwards to fit the barrel flat.

[WadePatton]

Some don't cut the bolster part of the mortise all the way to the bbl, leaving a few 32's of wood there.  I'm told it helps keep the lock clean, sandwiching that sliver of wood between the bolster and bbl.  The builder who taught me this has made 170+.

There's your no-metal-work option, probably late in this case.

[Paddlefoot]

Buchle showed a shim in there. I suppose you could do that and stick it on with crazy glue until you were sure you liked it.

[stuart cee dub]

 When I started on the gun stocking thing I was using the book
 ''Recreating the American Longrifle'' which came with a neat drawing on the inside back cover .
I recalled in that, Buchele (sp?) et al. showed the filed lock bolster .Not a good idea in practice .I'm going to go back and reread to see about the shim.That still remains my go to book. The crazy glue test idea too Paddlefoot. Try before you buy .

I like the idea  a soft soldered steel shim will be they way to go forward on the future and happy to find out someone has already tried this.
 
Has anyone tried profiling it to the lock  the pan and the frizzen to the shim make a visual hide or am I'm overthinking this?
 
There is  a piece of wood sitting there in the corner for the 2.0 version .Might even have a straight Goodoien barrel lurking in the corner  for it as well .I think just the lock side would be fine as well to keep it simple..

Having built a number of half stock percussion guns I find the simplicity of a flint refreshing and am enjoying the build a lot .

[David R. Pennington]

My last build was a straight 42 inch 13/16 -.45. I left the side plate side panel just a little thicker than the lock side panel. This gave me a little more thickness without adding to the bolster. It makes it look wider and so far no one has noticed it's not symmetrical. (Or at least no one has said it.) I think I would solder a spacer on the bolster if I had to do over though. I used a smaller lock so the mainspring clearance was OK. I tapered the fore stock down and flared it out just a bit at the muzzle. Made my nose cap with a slight flare and tapered my ramrod wider to almost bore size. I've had several people pick it up and ask if that was a tapered and flared barrel. The illusion is effective.
I have a 48 inch straight barrel waiting to be stocked. Might be a little more difficult to make the illusion with that one.

[Dphariss]

There is a lot of stuff out there that is not properly thought through. Some of it done by people that one would think would know better.
The leaving a wood strip between the lock and barrel is right up there though.

Dan

[JDK]

......and if somebody is tempted to solder a shim on the lock bolster they will have to find a way to do the same or similar to the frizzen.

I only mention it because that part always seems to be left out of these discussions.  Enjoy, J.D.

[Domtomac]

I ran into the same problem building a 36 cal., 13/16" barrel.  I bought one of the pre-inletted stock and bedded the barrel then started on the lock.  I kept going deeper and deeper and the pan still wasn't touching the barrel!  I realized (thankfully before it was too late) that there wouldn't be any wood left!  I also had read in "Recreating the American Longrifle" about soldering a spacer to the lock and was considering that. 
I then did a web search and found this forum and was reading up on some the ideas and thoughts.  "JDK" brought up a good point on adding a spacer to the lock - "what about the frizzen?"  That was something I didn't consider reading the book until he mentioned it - the pan would be wide open, even when closed because of the space between the frizzen and barrel.  I'd need to add to the frizzen too, and I doubt solder would hold up there.  I'd have to weld material too it.
Then I looked at the link to the Bob Harn rifle - what a beauty!  And a great idea to get more thickness at the lock without a swamped barrel.  However, looking at the metal work (and wood) I could see Mr. Harn's skill (and patience) is way beyond mine. 
But he did give me an idea – solder a spacer to the barrel itself!  I did this and a happy with the results.  It is tapered – it is about .120 at the back and .085 at the front.  This will allow me to keep the original profile of the pre-inletted stock and looks good so far (at least to me!).  I’ll try to attach a few pictures.

[A.Merrill]

     Take a look at a M&G lock at TOTW they call it Classic European lock. Tip Curtis first showed it to me and pointed out the wider bolster , he told me how much wider but that was 2 years ago. The width of the lock plate is .87 the same as the small Siler but the M&G is longer 5.17, compared to the small Siler at 4.78.          The M&G lock will give you more width in the breech area and best of all a longer, slimmer look in your lock panels. A good lock for 3/4 and 13/16 barrels and it throws a shower of sparks.  Do a search here for Landcaster Barn Gun, that's a M&G lock I used on that rifle with a 13/16 barrel. The buyer and I was very well pleased with that lock. R.E. Davis also sells this lock with a brass pan or a brass plate. Good luck.   Al

[kaintuck]

just file the lock spring slightly....
or, using a slightly diffucult technique...angle the RR hole off to the left...

[Kermit]

     Take a look at a M&G lock at TOTW they call it Classic European lock.

Davis sells this lock also. I have the brass pan version on one of mine and am quite pleased with it

[Pete G.]

Pay close attention to the pan cover fit. If you file the bolster the pan cover needs to be cut also. If you shim the bolster you may be creating a situation than cannot be fixed short of welding and re-shaping.

[flehto]

My first build has a  .040 shim soldered to the lock  bolster and a taper filed on. The shape of the pan was filed in after soldering w/ no problems. A hole had to be drilled in the shim for the head of the frizzen pivot screw.

Took the hardened frizzen to a welder, stuck the frizzen striking surface in a Delicious apple heat sink and he added the weld. The welding heat didn't soften the frizzen striking surface at all. Filed the welded mat'l to shape and haven't had any problems since 1978 when the LR was built. "Kicked out" the lock panel nicely....Fred

[ken]

I have a gun that the builder soldered  a brass plate to the barrel flat at the bolster to move the lock out a bit. Gave a good profile of the panels and wrist and you do not really see it . It did not change the way the gun proforms and looks good.   ken

[Sawatis]

There is a lot of stuff out there that is not properly thought through. Some of it done by people that one would think would know better.
The leaving a wood strip between the lock and barrel is right up there though.

Dan

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing when I read it Dan...that looks like a problem waiting to happen...between the flash in the pan and ret from the touch hole.
John