Author Topic: thompson center twist rate  (Read 17550 times)

ramrod

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thompson center twist rate
« on: October 08, 2013, 02:21:26 AM »
did t. center ever make a bbl.with a twist rate other than 1 in 48 inches in a kit gun ?  have a bbl in excellent condition cant find a load better than about 4'' at 50 yds .  just curious.

Hivernant1962

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2013, 03:21:56 AM »
If you can find them Green Mountain made drop in barrels for TC hawkens/renegades. Cut rifled with roundball twist (1-70 I think) or fast 1-28 twist for conicals.

Offline moleeyes36

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2013, 04:06:40 AM »
I'm not certain that they put them in any of their kit guns, but they made fast twist and slow twist (round ball) barrels, in addition to the 1:48 twist, for some of their side lock guns.  You'll see them come up for sale quite frequently on gunbroker.com.
 
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Offline smylee grouch

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2013, 04:10:37 AM »
I thought TC made a 1-60 twist for some of their guns at one time.

Offline smokinbuck

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2013, 04:30:45 AM »
TC's typical ROT is 1-48. They did / do make a faster twist barrel for conicals and they did make a run of RB barreled Hawkens with 1-66 ROT.  I have one Green Mountain drop in, 15/16 X 32 in .40 caliber with a 1-48 twist. All of them, TC or Green Mountain can shoot a $#*! of a lot better than 4" at 50 yards. You need to keep working on your loads.
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Offline Standing Bear

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2013, 04:38:35 AM »
What is your load?
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Offline WadePatton

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2013, 05:34:49 AM »
and what is your twist? and prb combo? wiper?
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ramrod

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2013, 08:09:47 AM »
should have mentioned this in original post . i have 2 other t. c. bbls. , a 45& a 50 both bbls i shoot .015 ox yoke patches and .440 &.490 r. balls  into 2'' groups at 50 yds.   about as good as my 62 year old eyes can do anymore.  but with this bbl. i have to pound .015 patch & .490 ball down the bore .  bore looks good no rust or pitting and a snug cleaning patch goes down smoothe. have tried various lubes always the same , tight . going to try .480 balls if track has them. as always ready to try anything reasonable &any suggestions. thanks all

Offline LRB

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2013, 02:24:31 PM »
  I was given a T-C kit Hawken to build around 1990. It had a T-C marked 1-66 cut rifled barrel, and was longer than 28". 32" I believe.

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2013, 07:34:42 PM »
Barrels of 1-48" rot can shoot prb very well.  I'd say that in general they work splendidly.  The fact that some barrels of this rot do not shoot prb very well is just an affirmation of the old adage that each barrel is an individual.  The particular load - patch thickness, lube, ball size - can also play a major roll.
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Offline WadePatton

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2013, 08:19:03 PM »
Did you ever measure the twist?  What do patches look like?

Why limit yourself to TOW offerings?

the TC Kit gun i had grouped fine, but i have no recollection or record of actual components used.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2013, 08:20:39 PM by WadePatton »
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Offline smokinbuck

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2013, 09:13:10 PM »
LRB,
The 1-66 TC round ball barrels were 1" X 32".
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Offline The Original Griz

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2013, 12:15:48 PM »
If I remember correctly;
the hawkin barrels were 1-48" twist and
the Pa. hunter have the 1-60" twist. I am certain about the Pa. Hunters cause I have 2 of them.
I think the renegades were 1-48" also. As far as I know the only barrels they wondered away from the 1-48 was the few years they made the Pa. hunters.
Both will shoot PRB well, but I do think the slower twist in the 1-60 shoots a RB just a tad better.
I gad the same problem with on e of mine, may I suggest trying a .495 Round Ball with the .015 patch.
and as always, this is just my opinion and is probably wrong:)
« Last Edit: October 09, 2013, 12:16:39 PM by The Original Griz »
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Offline The Original Griz

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2013, 05:34:32 PM »
ah crud, I just saw the "kit" part of your post, sorry about my last post. I still need to get reading lessons.
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Offline Dphariss

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2013, 10:36:58 PM »
did t. center ever make a bbl.with a twist rate other than 1 in 48 inches in a kit gun ?  have a bbl in excellent condition cant find a load better than about 4'' at 50 yds .  just curious.

The accuracy problem is not the twist if its 48".
What do the recovered patches look like?
How much powder?
Etc etc.

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Offline moleeyes36

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #15 on: October 09, 2013, 11:54:34 PM »
Yes the problem is not the 1:48 twist.  I was shooting a .54 cal. TC Renegade today that I built from a kit many years ago.  It has a 26" barrel with a 1:48 twist.  I used a .530 ball, .015 patch, 80 grains of 2fg
Swiss powder and a path lube I use for hunting which is a paste of olive oil and bees wax.  From sand bags at 50 yards I was getting groups of from 1 to 1 1/2 inches.  From sand bags at 100 yards I was getting groups from 2 to 3 1/2 inches.  This gun gives me sufficient accuracy for hunting in heavy cover and is one I often carry in situations where I'm likely to get it banged up a bit, like tree stand hunting. 

With better sights you can do much better than that because with a dead center hold the bead on the TC front sight completely covers a 9 inch pie plate at 100 yards.  Sharper, younger eyes wouldn't hurt either.  After all, there is a reason I'm called Mole Eyes instead of Eagle Eyes. 
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Offline Daryl

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2013, 06:45:18 PM »
When I shot a TC 48" twisted rifle - 40 years ago - I found I could not load a tight enough combination that would shoot well (patches cut on loading, then mostly burnt marks when fired) until I re-crowned the muzzle.

 I did that by smoothing the tool cut angled corners.- rounding them.  After 'fixing' the sharp crown, and with further testing I found a .495" PURE lead ball and 'brushed' denim patch worked best - spit for lube for target and bear grease for a hunting lube. The 'brushed' denim I measured at .022".  Since I do not have that very same material today, I cannot tell you what it measures with today's methods - suffice to say - it sure as heck wasn't .015".  That barrel, with my young eyes and NEW homemade GOOD sights, thick patches, .495" pure lead balls off a bench, would put 5 into an inch and one half on centres at 50yards - no wiping needed. seems to me, it took 80gr. to 100gr. of the GOX or GOEX as well as Curtis and Harvey 2Fpowder to shoot well.  It did NOT like 3F of any make, it seemed.

After I pulled that button rifled TC barrel off and installed a Bauska .50 barrel, cut rifled and also 48" twist I'm sure, I was able to shoot 1" and tighter groups, 5 into a single ob-long ball hole with the same ball/patch/load combinations. Even then, guys at the NMLRA were using different loads for different ranges and doing a LOT of wiping. I strove to match what their "Buffalo" cross stick contests were producing for accuracy and pretty much succeeded doing that, but not shooting off cross sticks - only from a bench.

 Ned Robert's book noted that if the rifle is properly loaded, one should be able to shoot all day without having to wipe the bore - the next one loaded, cleans the last one shot idea - we learned what we had to do, as to ball and patch combinations, to do exactly that.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2013, 07:44:03 PM by Daryl »
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Offline Candle Snuffer

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #17 on: October 13, 2013, 01:53:41 AM »
In my old TC .54 Hawken (1/48 twist) the best load I came up with for accuracy at 50 yards was 65 grains2f Goex, .018 bore butter lubed patch, and a .530 Hornady round ball...  Not exactly what I had in mind for a hunting load, so I gave up some accuracy for an 80 grain 2fg load.  Didn't really effect me hunting as most my shots are under 75-80 yards.

Years ago, the late Don Davis who was an avid cross stick competitor related a story in the old NMLRA book (Shooting With Champions) I believe it was called,,, made mention of the 1 in 48 twist and that he did get good accuracy from the one he had, but if I remember correctly, it was not his "go to" main round ball rifle, preferring something with a slower twist.  I'm guessing his barrel with the 1 in 48 may have been a Green River, or Douglas...  It's possible that someone here who knew Don Davis could fill in the voids.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2013, 01:54:57 AM by Candle Snuffer »
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ramrod

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2013, 06:31:58 AM »
ramrod here, well finally got back to range sunday . after a super bbl. cleaning to remove what i beleive was plastic fouling barrel shot much better.  load was 60 gr. fff goex 490 lead ball .021 ticking hoppes#9 bore solvent lube. accuracy vastly improved . 5 shot group off bags 1 3/4 inch cen. to cen. at 50 yds more work to do as this was only load tested. but major improvment loads much easier now.

Offline WadePatton

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2013, 06:48:09 AM »
all's well that shoots well!  ;)

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Offline Frizzen

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Re: thompson center twist rate
« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2013, 10:22:04 PM »
I knew Don, His one in 48 twist barrel he used was made by a guy named Kahuen or something like that.
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