Revival Of Our 200 Yard Round Ball Match With Added 50 & 100 Yard Matches

[Standing Bear]

For the first Baby Boomers among us, thanks for the peep rule. 
TC

[Kermit]

Apertures, but no underhammers? If it's the direct ignition cap locks that are out, are mule ears still okay? Are all targets/ranges to be shot with the same rifle/smoothbore?

[Candle Snuffer]

Kermit, I changed the wording to;

'Traditional Flint or Cap Lock Muzzle Loading Firearms'

This should cover under-hammers as well.

The matches are individual matches, and can be shot with any traditional muzzle loading firearm using the round ball.  If a person wanted to shoot, say the 100 yard match with a flintlock, and then again with a cap lock, whether smoothbore or rifled bore, that is up to them and they could post scores for both, or even up to four 100 yard matches;

100 yards
Rifled Flintlock
Smoothbore Flintlock
Rifled Cap Lock
Smoothbore Cap lock

[Vomitus]

Just rifles?

No guided missiles. 

Thx Aker, I'll drag my SAM batteries out to the range. I guess I'll just have to disarm the warheads tho.

[WadePatton]

caplocks?  caplocks!  oh my what has we done?   


Shoot 'em if you Got 'em! 

I gotta get a deer or two to stand in front of me before i get back to targets.   

[Scout]

Count me in, sounds like fun.

[Candle Snuffer]

caplocks?  caplocks!  oh my what has we done?   


Shoot 'em if you Got 'em! 

I gotta get a deer or two to stand in front of me before i get back to targets.   

Same here Wade.  I'll be on the hunt in December with the ol' flintlock, so I can't do anything until muzzle loading deer season is over.

[Candle Snuffer]

Count me in, sounds like fun.

It'll be fun, Scout!

[Kermit]

Candle--thanks for the clarification.

[Candle Snuffer]

You are welcome Kermit.  I don't always get things typed out the way they should read.  Sorry for any inconvenience.

[Artificer]

Candlesnuffer,

I am wondering if I could interest you in trying a couple of things when next you shoot at 100 and 200 yards?  We have discussed some theory and conjecture and I believe it would be very interesting to test them out in the real world.

First, I wonder if you could get your 100 yard sight setting and then try using the bottom of the front sight and align that with your rear sight as you normally do on the rear sight and aim at the target that way?  This test is to see how far it raises the strike of the bullet.  This may or may not be useful for 200 yard shooting, but it seems no one has actually tried it to see if it would work.  Might also be good to try it at 300 yards, if you can do that. 

Second,  Bob in the woods suggested raising his eye over the rear sights to gain elevation on the strike of the bullet.  I'm not sure where you put your cheek on the stock, but if you could raise where you normally put your cheek on the stock and still be on the stock, that would also be a neat thing to see how much it raises the strike of the bullet.

I would really like to try these things myself, but my astigmatism and needing cataract surgery the VA won't consider until at least April, keeps me from doing it.  Thanks for considering it.

Gus

[Candle Snuffer]

Sure Gus, I will give it a try.  Probably won't be for awhile as old man winter has set in for at least an extended 10 more days.  Even then I don't know what the long term forecast is, but when I get a chance, I'll give what you ask a try.

Don't know if I can help you out at 300 yards, but we'll see.

It's going to be awhile before I get to the Range.

[bob in the woods]

My cheek stays on the stock. The position is stable, and repeatable. 

[Artificer]

Sure Gus, I will give it a try.  Probably won't be for awhile as old man winter has set in for at least an extended 10 more days.  Even then I don't know what the long term forecast is, but when I get a chance, I'll give what you ask a try.

Don't know if I can help you out at 300 yards, but we'll see.

It's going to be awhile before I get to the Range.

Thanks CS,

I appreciate whatever you can do.
Gus

[Artificer]

My cheek stays on the stock. The position is stable, and repeatable. 

GOOD info !!  Thanks for clarifying that Bob.
Gus

[Candle Snuffer]

Morning Gus,

After sleeping on this request of your's (which I'll do when time and weather permits), I really don't see it producing any new information on 200 yard shooting, as I believe without a doubt that there is no "set" way for a rifleman to shoot 200 yards.  

I truly believe that either you can or you can't, and those that can have used their own method's - from hold over, to walking the front sight, to raising their cheek weld.  It's their method of shooting and what works for them because it is the method they practiced and relied on.  What works for Bob - works for Bob because that's what he's practiced.  What works for Centershot - works for Centershot because that's what he's practiced.  What works for me - works for me because that's what I've practiced.  Trying to shoot using someone else's technique that you're not use to using will most likely cause more misses then hits until you master that "new to you" shooting technique, and the end result may very well be no more helpful then the technique you've always used with success.

I guess what I'm getting at is that what you asked me to do, will not be conclusive in any way as I don't shoot other's techniques.  I shoot my own techniques that has become my method - burned into my shooting methods for nearly 40 years.    

[Artificer]

OK, CS,

I understand.  Maybe  my eyeballs will get repaired enough by next summer that I can try out the different techniques. 
Gus

[Daryl]

Gus - I'm aiming at the 200yard target in this picture. Note the cheek weld. As Bob said- it works.  If I did not have a 200yard leaf sight, I would see the bead over the rear sight due to my elevated head position - but, my head is still hard against the stock. For 300yards shooting, my cheek is still on the stock's comb.  My rifle is driving a .684" round ball at approximately 1,450fps.
There is a bit of a dip ahead of the firing point of a couple feet, but it comes back up and the range itself is very flat compared to where I am standing.

According to the computer program with sight height 3/4" above the bore axis, my total drop at 200yards is 53.32". Zero'd at 200yards, the ball has a maximum height of 10.39" at 50 yards and 15.53" at 110 yards. and 12.47" at 150yards (using .089 as the ball's B.C.)

[Vomitus]

   I've seen that same cheekweld! ...On a Sambuca bottle!

[heelerau]

Heelerau,

Here are the Yank measurements for our targets ...

*** TQ-4 Practice target may be used in lieu of A-25 target for informal club shoots. ***

100 Yard Small Bore Single
Bullseye
Official NRA Target

X ring....   1 inch
10 ring...   2 inch
9 ring....   4 inches
8 ring....   6 inches
7 ring....   8.inches
6 ring....   10 inches
5 ring....   12 inches


   
http://compete.nra.org/documents/pdf/compete/RuleBooks/SBR/sbr-book.pdf

Cheers,
Smoketown

Smoketown, thanks mate for the dimensions.

Cheers Heelerau

[Artificer]

Daryl,

Thanks for the photo and description/clarification. 

Unfortunately for me with my astigmatism, I don't think that technique will work as I have to REALLY crowd my rear sight to shoot well.  When shooting M1's or M14's, I had to put my cheek on the receiver heel to see the sights the best.  On M16's, I had to put the left side of the charging handle in the corner of my mouth.  (Shooting an 03 or A3 slams the rear of the striker rod into my cheek and that is NO fun.)  YES, I always got "a fat lip" from shooting these rifles, but that's the way I shot best.  FORTUNATELY there is nothing like that on a Flintlock or Percussion rifle, so that makes them even more fun to shoot. 

STILL, I am going to try this technique after the VA gets my eyeballs repaired.

Thank you,

Gus

[Candle Snuffer]

Just kicking this back up towards the top with the new year.  Who knows, with the weather starting to look like Spring for the next 10 days in some areas, someone may want to shoot this?  All info is in the first post of this thread.

[Daryl]

   I've seen that same cheekweld! ...On a Sambuca bottle!

 

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

It's going to be some time before we can get to the range for this...was out there yesterday, and got stuck - high centred on a snow drift.  I'm lucky there was another shooter there with a 1 ton and a good tow rope, 'cause he got me out.  The temperature is good - just a little below freezing, but the snow is hip deep.  I'm not the guy I was forty years ago.

[Candle Snuffer]

It must have been around 1:00 pm today, wind was calm so I loaded some stuff up to go out to the range.  Set down on the couch with my rifle and dozed off until about 2:15 pm.  Woke up and the wind was howling... Go figure...   Well, I'll try for Wednesday.