Goex vs. Ole Eynsford fouling comparison

[Scout]

The targets are not meant to compare accuracy but a record and observation of conditions. I went out with ONLY GOEX 3F to see how it shot in my .45.

I had received 5 lbs. of the 3F OE a few months back and have been very pleased with the results so far in the .45 so I wanted to see for myself if there was any noticeable difference between the two.

The first target was shot over a month earlier, hotter at 78 degrees and more humid ( I did not record the %) at 50 yds off bags with 65 grns. of OE. Relatively low pan fouling and easy loading.

The second more recent target was shot at 30 yds.( to sight in for a new lower front sight/ lower rear sight) and 3 shots at 100 yds. ( It was getting hard for me to see the front sight so I only shot 3 at 100 ) using 70 grns. of GOEX. The humidity was only 25% and a cool 66 degrees and I noticed how much more fouling was in the pan after each shot as well as it being a bit harder to load than the OE. I would figure it would have fouled less due to this cooler/drier condition.

The same patch, lube, ball and 4F priming powder was used on both days.

Next time out I'm using OE at 100 yards and I will report the results as far as accuracy. As far as I'm concerned I'm sold on the OE. I have never had the opportunity to shoot Swiss or any other high dollar powder so I can't compare them to OE but I'm sure it would give them a run for their money.

[ken]

Do you feel it was the weather or was it the increase in powder that caused the increase in fouling?    Very good targets!!      ken

[drago]

I expect it was the powder, Everyone says the Old E burns cleaner with higher velocities so you use less powder than regular Goex. I had'nt thought about in the pan though.

[smylee grouch]

Different days, different yardages, different placement of gun on your rest, too many variables are different. Do your test over on the same day and change only one variable at a time and see if the results are the same.

[Candle Snuffer]

Different days, different yardages, different placement of gun on your rest, too many variables are different. Do your test over on the same day and change only one variable at a time and see if the results are the same.

I agree. 

[PPatch]

Quote: "The humidity was only 25% and a cool 66 degrees and I noticed how much more fouling was in the pan after each shot as well as it being a bit harder to load than the OE."

I had this happen recently in cool dry weather. In contrast to warmer more moist conditions of two days earlier the Goex FFFg was harder to load between shots. Seems the dry weather caused the fouling in the barrel to set up quicker thus making it noticeably more difficult to move the ball down the barrel even with a sopping wet spit patch. A few breaths down the barrel with a flexible plastic tube made it much easier to load (said trick related to me by Acer).

dp

[smallpatch]

Gentlemen,

This is exactly how all the old wives tales get started. Right now, all we have is personal preference, based on how one person "perceived"  that it loaded easier and shot cleaner.  Two different days, and conditions, different front sights, different distances, etc., etc.

I know we mean well when we post this kind of thing, but the only real conclusion is....... I prefer Old Eynsford.

by the way Scout...... this is some pretty @!*% nice shooting.

[Standing Bear]

Different days, different yardages, different placement of gun on your rest, too many variables are different. Do your test over on the same day and change only one variable at a time and see if the results are the same.

I agree. 

x2

[Scout]

Different days, different yardages, different placement of gun on your rest, too many variables are different. Do your test over on the same day and change only one variable at a time and see if the results are the same.

That's my next test.


Personal preference? I guess.  I'm just reporting what happened so far but I am leaning towards the OE.

Oh yeah, I like Ballistol to ! 

[hanshi]

It appears OE is living up to the hype and then some.

[dagner]

 shot a bunch of 2ff  goex and couple lbs  2ff of old e. the old e burned much cleaner .no doubt about it. it seemed to shoot a tad tigher than the goex.
dag

[Candle Snuffer]

I don't know...  After taking another look at the 50 yard 'OE' target with mild cross wind, and the 100 yard target with a 12 mph wind?  I can't judge one way or the other.  I will except the conclusion that 'OE' burns cleaner as several have alluded to this in other post.  I expect I'll stick with Goex regardless of any findings simply because that's what I use and have used for a very long time.  But I'm always interested in how other black powders perform.  Doesn't mean I'll ever change unless forced to through production stoppage.

[Standing Bear]

X2 Snuffer. Besides I have very few cleaning issues now. If I need to see noticeably less cleaning ill use the .30-06.

Now if it were noticeably cheaper I'll try it but doubt I'll find it at 25% less.
TC

[Black Jack]

The OE price differential really doesn't seem to be very much to get Goex powder manufactured to a higher standard of consistency. Probably wouldn't matter to much if all you need is "minute of deer" accuracy, but if you're punching paper occasionally it seems worth it. After all, some of us need all the help we can get! J&J Pyrotechnic charges an extra $1.10 a pound for mail order, and only 40 cents a pound for pick up.

[Standing Bear]

Maybe if he's shooting bench w a 50 lb howitzer.

I can't out shoot Goex FFg off hand yet and I've won 5 state championships in Texas plus 2 more and 4 national territorials.

Don't see a reason to even look at anything else. I'm just an old hot rodder and "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" applies. Y'all are certainly free to experiment and good luck to ya.

[Scout]

Maybe if he's shooting bench w a 50 lb howitzer.

I can't out shoot Goex FFg off hand yet and I've won 5 state championships in Texas plus 2 more and 4 national territorials.

Don't see a reason to even look at anything else. I'm just an old hot rodder and "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" applies. Y'all are certainly free to experiment and good luck to ya.

I agree, I can't out shoot any of the GOEX since I started using it in the mid 1970s BUT I'm not about to give away what I have or not use it anymore either. I like the OE, I also like GOEX. I have shot very well with GOEX over the years with no issues. Will the OE make me a better shooter ? I doubt it but with all that said and done the OE doe not foul as much as the GOEX. Does that mean much to most folks? Perhaps not but it will to some.
In the past I have not had or didn't know of any other options beside pyrodex and I never used it. Since really getting back into muzzleloading over the last 3 years I see there are options in powder, Like you I consider myself "old school" with the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it " attitude. I never tried Swiss, or anything else except OE and the reason for that is it's made by GOEX in the USA, a brand that I have trusted over the years.

I am not giving up on ole reliable by any stretch, just checking out my options to maybe improve my shooting and the whole black powder experience.

Oh yeah, I'm having a blast ( no pun intended ) doing my impromptu powder comparison and just getting out to the range to shoot on my days off from work. 

[moleeyes36]

Many BP shooters are really strong advocates for the brand of powder they use.  Some get really worked up on the subject if they think you're calling their baby ugly.  Unless it's a matter of only few choices in brands of powder in a particular area, people generally shoot what works best for them.  Over the years I imagine most of the shooters on the forum have a few times been beaten by shooters using just about every brand of powder available.  And at other times they've beaten other shooters that were using just about every brand of powder available.

So in the end it doesn't matter if you shoot GOEX, Swiss, KIK, Ole Enysford, Schuetzen, Wano or deer droppings & dynamite, if that's what works best for you why would you want to change?

     

[dagner]

  ken -weather can change fouling around real big. same gun same load one day dont even have to scrape bone dry -next day you have to scrape every 3d shot and day after you scrape soup out of bottom.

[Candle Snuffer]

Just to clear up my last post on this subject.  One reason I wouldn't switch powders (at this point) is that I don't want another brand of powder I may very well have to work with and re-zero my rifles.  Even if I got down to one or two pounds of powder (Goex), I still wouldn't change as I don't want to introduce a different powder to my smoke-poles that I may have to tweak.

I'm glad that there is a new black powder on the market.  I'm sure the beginner, or those who are wanting to switch powder's will find it acceptable and the market will be good for it.  I simply have no desire to switch, unless like I said before - I'm forced to.

[Ranch13]

 You guys do know that Olde Eysnford is Goex powder  made in the same plant, slightly different recipe ?

[rhbrink]

My take on the OE yes it is a good powder I have shoot some not enough to make me want to switch from my standard of GOEX 3F and 2F. It does burn cleaner and seems a bit faster at least the groups bumped up a bit on the target. But GOEX and now Hodgdon in the past have introduced a new brand of blackpowder and it worked great but then in a few years the discontinued the brand. I ran into this twice in the past shooting in another blacpowder sport involving black powder cartridge rifles. So my take is set back and use what I have and wait to see what they do this time. I hope that OE sticks around it seems like a great powder time will tell.

RB

[necchi]

You guys do know that Olde Eysnford is Goex powder  made in the same plant, slightly different recipe ?

Yes, Thank you.

[Dphariss]

You guys do know that Olde Eysnford is Goex powder  made in the same plant, slightly different recipe ?

The recipe is the question I have. But I lack the chemical ability to do it. There is a chance that "something new has been added" since they have not told us they have found a source for better charcoal that is about the only option other than increasing the milling time which word improve the powder to some extent. Remember these are the same folks that make Pyrodex and 777 and 777 (at least) has an ingredient that would boost BP from reliable reports. IF its used. Until someone takes the powder apart, looks at the chemical makeup and the charcoal particle size its all guess work. But from what I have been told and read it would be difficult for Eynsford to equal Swiss with the components available.

Dan

[Ranch13]

You guys do know that Olde Eysnford is Goex powder  made in the same plant, slightly different recipe ?

The recipe is the question I have. But I lack the chemical ability to do it. There is a chance that "something new has been added" since they have not told us they have found a source for better charcoal that is about the only option other than increasing the milling time which word improve the powder to some extent. Remember these are the same folks that make Pyrodex and 777 and 777 (at least) has an ingredient that would boost BP from reliable reports. IF its used. Until someone takes the powder apart, looks at the chemical makeup and the charcoal particle size its all guess work. But from what I have been told and read it would be difficult for Eynsford to equal Swiss with the components available.

Dan

Dan it has been analyzed, the ATF says it's blackpowder, and I don't know why anybody would think Hogdons would be dumb enough to try and mislabel a powder in that matter, for the first thing that's going to happen the ATFE is going to rain all $#*! down on their heads for doing so. The second thing if it's not a blackpowder, then they would be stupid for not selling it as a sub, because it is a sporting grade blackpowder explosive, keeps it off every big box store's shelves along with 98% of the local slobber shops...
 They are using a different dryng technique, but the recipe is basically the same as Express was, and they are now using the exact same screen size as Swiss, so the small screen size accounts for a bunch of the velocity.
 It also stands to reason that as many powder companies as Hogdon's now owns they have access to just about every blackpowder recipe ever used...
 You really ought to get some and try it, you might like it.

[hanshi]

Simply processing the powder further than regular Goex (similar to what Swiss does) is milled will result in higher quality.  Maybe they use a different charcoal or better processed charcoal or maybe they don't.  Doesn't matter; OE is still black powder and not a sub.  If one doesn't like OE or Goex just start buying Swiss and stop complaining that OE isn't a "real" black powder.