New member with questions/advice

[oldfox]

This is my first post.  I am from Maine and a retired cabinet maker.  Going on 75, I wanted to get back into a bit of fine craftsmanship.  I must commend you in the quality of work that I have seen in the articles that have been posted.  Back 25 years or so ago, I did a bit of stock work, but haven't done any since then.  I have never done a longrifle and this forum has perked my interest in this art.

I have done a little research on different models and styles.  One that has caught my eye is the John & Caleb Vincent half stock.  I have been looking at the kit on TOTW and a few days ago I sent for the plan, just to see what was involved and if it was beyond my abilities.  I have noticed that a lot of you start from scratch, instead of the semi inleted stocks. I recall when I did a semi inleted stock on a modern rifle sometimes they would be over inleted, which created an eyesore and very difficult to cover up.  So my guess would be that an uninleted blank would be what is recommend?

I would appreciate any and all information that you guys can offer.  In the meantime I will be roaming this forum..so far it has been an interesting journey

[Dennis Glazener]

Welcome to ALR Old Fox. Sounds like you fit right in. Glad to hear the forum is performing its task of being an attraction for those interested in craftsmanship, traditional longrfiles and their accouterments, that's our goal. Make yourself at home.

In regards to kits, the quality of kits are all over the place, some will make you pull your hair out, others will teach you how to properly orient the various components. You will have to decide for yourself which way to get started. Good luck.
Dennis

[galamb]

Before I started in this hobby I had done some cabinet work and wooden boat building.

Like you I initially thought a pre-carved/pre-inlet stock would be the way to get my feet wet. I found however, as I did more reading/research that the "least daunting" part of building the rifle would be the work on the stock itself (given my relative comfort in working with wood and a pretty decent wood shop).

Working from plans or patterns you are probably more than capable of carving out a stock from a "chunk of wood" (given your background) and will most likely find it one of the more enjoyable parts of the building process - it's the "metal" that I personally find more challenging.

So my vote for you is - get a nice piece of Maple, pattern it out and have at her.

[gunmaker]

2nd to galamb.....Tom

[oldfox]

Before I started in this hobby I had done some cabinet work and wooden boat building.

Like you I initially thought a pre-carved/pre-inlet stock would be the way to get my feet wet. I found however, as I did more reading/research that the "least daunting" part of building the rifle would be the work on the stock itself (given my relative comfort in working with wood and a pretty decent wood shop).

Working from plans or patterns you are probably more than capable of carving out a stock from a "chunk of wood" (given your background) and will most likely find it one of the more enjoyable parts of the building process - it's the "metal" that I personally find more challenging.

So my vote for you is - get a nice piece of Maple, pattern it out and have at her.

Thanks galamb...  Would you have any suggestions on a good place to look for some nice maple?  I see that TOTW sell stock blanks or do you have a better resource?  BTW, I also did a bit of boat building, mainly strip built Rangley skiffs

[galamb]

Many of the gun building suppliers have some very nice blanks already cut to somewhat resemble a rifle. I find most of the prices fair but once you tack on the shipping it becomes expensive.

I use a couple different local wood suppliers - not like home depot, but specialty wood places. I prefer that because you get to touch/feel and select the exact (board) that you want.

I have found I can get two full stock blanks OR a full stock and two half stock blanks out of a single board if I get a piece of 8/4 or 10/4, 9-10" wide and 5' long (which is roughly 7-8 board feet) often for about 60 to 80 bucks (for curly red maple dependent on the amount of curl - the cost goes up by 25% if I want sugar maple and almost doubles for figured walnut).

In comparison, Track of the Wolf wants over 100 bucks for a single curly maple full stock blank and it would run you a further 40 to 60 bucks for shipping (depending where you are).

So if you can find a local source of specialty woods - have a band saw of a jig saw (and patience), I would source my own wood - save you a bundle.

I have just cut up a piece that cost me $63 that yielded a Maryland full stock (42" barrel) and a Hawken full stock (34" barrel - yes Fred, I'm getting it cut) - and it's a super curly piece of wood. 30'ish dollars a blank is about a cost effective as you can get unless you grow it yourself

[oldfox]

Many of the gun building suppliers have some very nice blanks already cut to somewhat resemble a rifle. I find most of the prices fair but once you tack on the shipping it becomes expensive.

I use a couple different local wood suppliers - not like home depot, but specialty wood places. I prefer that because you get to touch/feel and select the exact (board) that you want.

I have found I can get two full stock blanks OR a full stock and two half stock blanks out of a single board if I get a piece of 8/4 or 10/4, 9-10" wide and 5' long (which is roughly 7-8 board feet) often for about 60 to 80 bucks (for curly red maple dependent on the amount of curl - the cost goes up by 25% if I want sugar maple and almost doubles for figured walnut).

In comparison, Track of the Wolf wants over 100 bucks for a single curly maple full stock blank and it would run you a further 40 to 60 bucks for shipping (depending where you are).

So if you can find a local source of specialty woods - have a band saw of a jig saw (and patience), I would source my own wood - save you a bundle.

I have just cut up a piece that cost me $63 that yielded a Maryland full stock (42" barrel) and a Hawken full stock (34" barrel - yes Fred, I'm getting it cut) - and it's a super curly piece of wood. 30'ish dollars a blank is about a cost effective as you can get unless you grow it yourself

Thanks galamb...I will do some checking

[JCKelly]

With a kit you get to live with someone else's styling mistakes, in a skinny piece of wood inlet for the wrong lock, the wrong barrel & just plain wrong.

Get a rough blank of good wood.

[Thom]

I have only built a few rifles, but it seems that a Vincent would be quite a challenge for a first rifle. At least to build a "proper Vincent".
Thom

[wmaser]

Whether you choose to start with a kit, build from scratch or anything in between, there are a lot of folks on this forum who will help you through the project. Keep us updated on your progress.

Here is a series of photos of my first attempt at building a "Vincent like" rifle from scratch. The photos are from a short lock building tutorial I posted a couple of years ago. The finished rifle is at the end of the slideshow. This rifle cost me about a dollar or two. I wasn't making my own wood screws yet and used a few store bought ones

http://s1176.photobucket.com/user/wmaser/slideshow/Facebook/building%20a%20gun%20lock

[oldfox]

I have only built a few rifles, but it seems that a Vincent would be quite a challenge for a first rifle. At least to build a "proper Vincent".
Thom

Thanks for you input Thom.  Could you explain why you think the Vincent would be too much of a challenge?

[oldfox]

Whether you choose to start with a kit, build from scratch or anything in between, there are a lot of folks on this forum who will help you through the project. Keep us updated on your progress.

Here is a series of photos of my first attempt at building a "Vincent like" rifle from scratch. The photos are from a short lock building tutorial I posted a couple of years ago. The finished rifle is at the end of the slideshow. This rifle cost me about a dollar or two. I wasn't making my own wood screws yet and used a few store bought ones

http://s1176.photobucket.com/user/wmaser/slideshow/Facebook/building%20a%20gun%20lock

Great slideshow Bill!  That's what I call building from scratch!  Well done!

[blaksmth]

Old Fox ,

 A blank stock in my opinion is a lot easier to work with than a pre carved stock, I will get the stock close to the dimensions that I want especially on the lock area,  but I will leave the fore arm flat sided until  I have put in my barrel pins- wedges , it is a whole lot easier to drill and locate the pins- wedges in the fore arm when working off of 90 degree angles than a round surface.

 They make jigs for drilling  this stuff but I don't own them.

 

[oldfox]

Thanks blaksmth for that bit of info..  I think you all have convinced me to stick with a solid blank. 

[galamb]

You should pick yourself up a book or two on rifle building.

Two of the most popular for starting builders (and those that have built a few for that matter) are "The Art of Building the Pennsylvania Longrifle" and "The Gunsmith of Grenville County".

I own the latter publication and it literally walks you through every aspect of the building process.

A good book and a good plan/pattern = significantly better chances of success - plus the this forum of course, because you always have "another question".

[oldfox]

Thanks galamb..  I will definitely be getting one if not both of those books...

[oldfox]

You should pick yourself up a book or two on rifle building.

Two of the most popular for starting builders (and those that have built a few for that matter) are "The Art of Building the Pennsylvania Longrifle" and "The Gunsmith of Grenville County".

I own the latter publication and it literally walks you through every aspect of the building process.

A good book and a good plan/pattern = significantly better chances of success - plus the this forum of course, because you always have "another question".

I took the plunge and got both of them...  Now for some serious reading!  Thanks galamb..