Author Topic: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit  (Read 22429 times)

Offline Chris Treichel

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Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« on: February 07, 2014, 10:35:42 PM »
I have been doing a lot of research and came across this picture which is one of the few dating to the period that actually shows a Rifleman in detail... note the rectangular pouch, horn and canteen.  This picture came from Neal Hurst's research paper and is labeled A watercolor image of a Virginia Rifleman during the Philadelphia Campaign wearing a fringed hunting shirt (Richard St. George Collection, Harlen Crown Library.)


Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2014, 10:47:13 PM »
Thanks Chris.  Great picture.
Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2014, 10:59:07 PM »
I recently came across a Day Book of William Crise from 1840 - 1890.  It contained a letter from
James C. Clark, State Senator of Westmoreland County PA written early in his campaign on May 8, 1863.  This bit of "art" was on the back of the letter.  I know it's off topic, but thought I would share it.

« Last Edit: February 07, 2014, 11:00:05 PM by Shreckmeister »
Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Offline Artificer

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2014, 11:30:40 PM »
What "got me" when I found this photo when we were discussing Rifleman's Shirts was the pouch strap seems to go over his right shoulder (under the cape) and the canteen strap seems to go across to his left shoulder (though it is covered by his arms and the rifle), but what is the last strap under his right hand and on the left side of his body supposed to be - his belt, perhaps?   Also, it is interesting that the person who drew it got "Death or Liberty" on the powder horn as well as "U.S." on the canteen.  .
Gus

Online James Rogers

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2014, 11:46:55 PM »
No strap on the right shoulder running under. It's the buttplate of the rifle gun. ;D
« Last Edit: February 08, 2014, 12:16:53 AM by James Rogers »

Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2014, 11:47:55 PM »
Who is A. Redoubt?  Top left of the photo.

Oh, A Redoubt is a fort.....duh.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2014, 11:50:35 PM by Shreckmeister »
Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Offline Artificer

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2014, 11:51:23 PM »
No strap on the right shoulder running under. It's the buttplate of the tifle gun. ;D

LOL!! Thanks James.
Gus

Offline alyce-james

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2014, 12:27:35 AM »
Great find Chris. Thanks for sharing with ALR forum. Have a great week end. AJ.
"Candy is Dandy but Liquor is Quicker". by Poet Ogden Nash 1931.

Offline mr. no gold

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2014, 03:25:53 AM »
Great find! Thank you for bringing here to enlighten us. Lots of good data in this little sketch and it may result in some changes in my planning to put together an outfit for that period.
Dick

Offline Longknife

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2014, 06:19:31 PM »
Nice Picture of a Rifleman,,, I have been studying this for a few days and it is very close to the outfit that I wear. I am having trouble with the rifle he is holding though...It sure looks.... like.... an....INLINE??????..... ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!
Ed Hamberg

Offline Artificer

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2014, 10:38:40 PM »
What also gets me is it looks like the Rifleman is wearing fringed trousers and not leggins?
Gus. 

Offline Bill of the 45th

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2014, 04:44:11 AM »
If it's the Revolutionary War, Why would the canteen have "U.S." on it?  I would hazard it's a War of 1812 drawing.  Just a thought.  Cool pick though.

Bill
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Offline Artificer

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2014, 08:28:29 AM »
If it's the Revolutionary War, Why would the canteen have "U.S." on it?  I would hazard it's a War of 1812 drawing.  Just a thought.  Cool pick though.

Bill

Though both "US" and "U.S." marked canteens were used during the Rev War, you are correct they were not nearly as common as the War of 1812. 

However and generally speaking, this does not look like the hunting shirt and pants worn by even U.S. Militia in the War of 1812. 

Gus

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2014, 02:29:26 PM »
What caught my eye as well as others was the powder horn saying and the canteen.Since this is a rifleman and not a uniformed  Continental ,would he be wearing an issued canteen or would he be carrying his own accouterments e.g. powder horn?

Offline Chris Treichel

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2014, 04:04:30 PM »
The hunting shirt was general issue in the Revolutionary war. Here is an orderly book excerpt:
HEADQUARTERS, 6TH VIRGINIA REGT., April, 1776. "The Captains of the 6th Battalion, together with the other Officers, are immediately to provide themselves with Hunting Shirts, short and fringed, the men's shirts to be short and plain; the Sergeants' shirts to have a small white Cuffs and plain; the Drummers' shirts to be with dark Cuffs. Both Officers and Soldiers to have Hatts cut round and bound with black; the Brims of their Hatts to be two inches deep and cocked on one side, with a Button and Loop and Cockades, which is to be worn on the left. Neither man nor Officers to do duty in any other uniform. The Officers and Soldiers are to ware their Hair short and as near a like as possible."
By Order Of Mordecai Buckner, Colonel, Commanding

Trousers where what poor folks wore as it did not require socks, and the extra buttons required by knee breeches. There is only one definitively traceable hunting shirt remaining to the Revolutionary War and that is the Capt Duryea shirt but it is an officers coat and so as you can see by the above coat would not have had fringe on it if it was being worn by an enlisted chap. Not saying that all units wore them that way....

Offline Robby

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2014, 07:15:05 PM »
molon labe
We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution. A. Lincoln

Offline Artificer

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2014, 07:41:09 PM »
What caught my eye as well as others was the powder horn saying and the canteen.Since this is a rifleman and not a uniformed  Continental ,would he be wearing an issued canteen or would he be carrying his own accouterments e.g. powder horn?

Powder horns were at different times issued either as raw horns or sometimes as basic complete horns, when available.  There are at least two or three recorded instances of units ordering that the men's names be "engraved" on them, so that seems to have been at least somewhat common if not very common by the fact it just made sense when the horns were filled and returned to the men.  However,  there seems to be no orders against inspirational or patriotic writings, nor even other engravings or decorations - except in the cases where some (and we don't know haw many were done that way) issued Rifleman's power horns were scraped thin enough to be somewhat translucent so they could be held to the light to check the quantity of powder inside.  .

Riflemen brought various types of wood, gourd, leather "bottles" and some other types of canteens with them when they joined.  However, when they were damaged in use or by combat loss/destruction - then new canteens would have been issued to them even if they came from those who had been seriously wounded or killed.  So a wooden canteen would have been pretty normal to see for a Rifleman and if it came from Continental Stores, may/would have had US marked on them or it added at perhaps by Quartermasters, Artificers or Regimental Units.

Gus.   

Offline Chris Treichel

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2014, 08:52:03 PM »
Here is the link to Neil Hurst's paper on the American Hunting Shirt. There is some really good documentation in there including patterns off several shirts datable from the Revolutionary War through post 1812 war.
http://www.academia.edu/3336557/_kind_of_armour_being_peculiar_to_America_The_American_Hunting_Shirt

My current study was to get down to the nitty gritty on what would have been appropriate for the 1st Virginia Regiment during the Revolutionary War.

Offline Artificer

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2014, 01:11:18 AM »

http://www.academia.edu/3336557/_kind_of_armour_being_peculiar_to_America_The_American_Hunting_Shirt
.

This is an excellent source for Hunting Shirts in the different time periods.  

The one problem I have with the information is that it is a little unclear as it bounces back and forth in the time periods and a lot of the information seems to have been repeated twice or more.  

I got a bit confused on the length of the shirts in the different time periods.  I may have this wrong, but it seems to me it went something like this:

1. Early to Pre Rev War length, Mid thigh to Knee and maybe a bit longer than that.

2.  Rev War length, got a bit shorter and this seems to be supported by the Original Sketch at the start of this thread and other information as well.  Also, making them a bit shorter allowed more of them to be made from the same amount of cloth during war time normal supply problems.

3.  Post Rev war through the end of the 18th Century, went back to a bit longer perhaps mid thigh or so?  Stated reason it was easier to get more cloth.  

4.  War 1812 length mid thigh to knee though MAY have been a bit shorter as pants' waists were cut higher in this time period and suspenders were often worn with civilian pants?

There is another reason Hunting Shirts may have gotten shorter in the Rev War and that is because civilian coats, sleeved weskits and regular weskits were shortened from what we may think of as the French and Indian War Period.  IOW, it could have been copying the STYLE of both civilian and military clothing being a little shorter starting around 1760-1770.  

Of course, something else that is not usually thought of as to the length of Hunting Shirts was WHAT were the breeches, pants, trousers or breech clout the person preferred to wear UNDER the Hunting Shirt.  

If one was wearing Indian Leggins, I imagine one would want their Hunting Shirt to be long to cover exposed skin at the sides of the hips down the thigh a ways to cover the tops of the leggings?  

If one was wearing Breeches, Breeches and Leggins, or pants/trousers/overalls – the Hunting Shirt need not have been as long because there is no exposed skin to cover?

Bottom line is now we have much better information on the rest of the “cut” of the Hunting Shirt at different time periods and the length of even Rev War Hunting Shirts MAY have been a little longer if the men were wearing breechclouts and Indian Leggins?

Gus  

PS  Back in the 70’s when Friends of mine and I often volunteered at Historic Fort Wayne in Fort Wayne, IN; we decided to “do” a Militia Uniform for the 1812 period Special Events Weekends.  So we chose “Brush’s Separate (or Independent) Company of Ohio, Militia" because their uniforms were very plain Lined Hunting Shirts and Pants that definitely were cut different than Rev War period examples.  The most expensive thing we had to procur was a rather specific Black Hat, though not that expensive.  

Brush’s Company was composed of Waggoner’s and Cattle Drovers who followed the American General Hull’s forces.  However, they never quite caught up to them for any of the major battles and most just turned around and went home when Hull managed to get his clock cleaned even though he had numerically superior forces to the Canadians he opposed.  IOW, he went to rather fantastic lengths to wrestle Defeat from the Jaws of Victory.  Grin.

« Last Edit: February 11, 2014, 08:13:30 PM by Artificer »

Offline Elnathan

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2014, 05:45:51 PM »
Artificer, I don't think we have enough information to know how the length changed or whether it changed in an orderly fashion. Your suggestion about the difference between a hunting shirt intended to be worn with trousers and one intended for use with a breechclout is a good one, though Doddridge's comments about  young ladies distracted from their devotions suggests that not everyone who wore a clout covered it up.  :o
A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition -  Rudyard Kipling

Offline Artificer

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2014, 08:11:16 PM »
Artificer, I don't think we have enough information to know how the length changed or whether it changed in an orderly fashion. Your suggestion about the difference between a hunting shirt intended to be worn with trousers and one intended for use with a breechclout is a good one, though Doddridge's comments about  young ladies distracted from their devotions suggests that not everyone who wore a clout covered it up.  :o

ROTFLMAO!!!  Good humour, Elnathan !

Perhaps we don't have enough information on how the lengths may or may not have changed during the different periods.  Length of the hunting shirt may/would also have been up to the man who wore one and who sewed it up for him, if he did not do it himself.  I do think the user's desires were most important, but I also feel that fashion had something to do with it as they seemed more fashion conscious back then.  .   

 At least we have a very few examples of hunting shirts and other information that show how construction changed over the different periods. 
Gus

Offline Chris Treichel

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2014, 10:01:58 PM »
As to length... during the Revolutionary We do have records from orderly books and receipts that the shirts are short and that the stores were paid extra to add cuffs and capes (collars).

“…a hunting shirt well made and short just to come below the waistband of the breeches…” Orderly Book of the 6th Virginia Regiment, 26 March 1776 to 26

6TH VIRGINIA REGT., April, 1776. "The Captains of the 6th Battalion, together with the other Officers, are immediately to provide themselves with Hunting Shirts, short and fringed, the men's shirts to be short and plain; the Sergeants' shirts to have a small white Cuffs and plain; the Drummers' shirts to be with dark Cuffs.

Morgan came with his regiment of riflemen either with Washington or soon after his arrival. The uniform of Morgan’s regiment was a short frock made of pepper and salt colored cotton cloth like a common working frock worn by our people, except that it was short and open before, to be tied with strings. Simeon Alexander 1832 Private in 5th PA Regt

Offline Stophel

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2014, 05:35:26 AM »
"Death or Liberty" is standard British anti-American cartoon propaganda.  It was probably always rendered this way as an insult.  This picture was drawn by the enemy.   ;)
When a reenactor says "They didn't write everything down"   what that really means is: "I'm too lazy to look for documentation."

Offline Artificer

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2014, 06:17:02 AM »

“…a hunting shirt well made and short just to come below the waistband of the breeches…” Orderly Book of the 6th Virginia Regiment, 26 March 1776 to 26


Chris,
This is excellent information on the length of their hunting shirts.   That certainly is a short length for hunting shirts and would seem to only barely cover their weskits, when/if they wore them? 

If my poor research on them is correct, they were raised in late December 1775 and formed in February 1776?  Though the modern climate might be colder than then, my 39 years in Virginia strongly suggests they needed a weskit under their Hunting Shirt and over their regular shirt in that time period, especially as the Regiment was raised with both rifle companies and musket companies from different counties.  Perhaps they just wore a heavier shirt over their regular shirt and under the Hunting Shirt? 

The dates they were raised and formed coincides with the trend for shorter civilian and military coats.  It may also show they were trying to save material when raising the Regiment so quickly?  Is there any documentation on that?

Thanks,
Gus

Offline Elnathan

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Re: Revolutionary War Rifleman's kit
« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2014, 07:19:27 AM »
I thought that there were several references to military hunting shirts as 'short," but I couldn't find them except for the last one, which I believe is meant to indicate that Morgan's shirts were short in relation to a workman's smock - i.e., less than knee-length.

Can we take the fact that shirts that went only to the hips are described as "short" as indication that hunting shirts were usually longer?

Incidentally, I believe that Silas Deane described hunting shorts as being long enough to hang below the knee in when writing to his wife in June 1775, so perhaps it varied by unit or region, or the short shirt was a military style, perhaps to save cloth or as a matter of fashion - perhaps a nod to the wearers' role as light infantry?
A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition -  Rudyard Kipling