stock finish drying

[little joe]

I have a hard maple stock that I put the finish on and it will not dry. My finish is one third poly, one third tung and one third turpintine with some japan dryer in it. As it would not dry totally I steel wolled it down with turpintine and wool and added more dryer and refinished agine with not very good results. The stock is in the80- 90 percent drying range but still  has a slightly tacky feeling. Any suggestions appreciated.

[smart dog]

Hi Joe,
How long are you letting it dry and what tung oil did you use?

dave

[Old Ford2]

Hi,
A light brush with a heat gun several times an hour apart will dry your coating.
Some dryers work best in sunlight.
Fred

[little joe]

Dave and Fred I,m ignorant as to different kinds of  Tung oil however this can came from Porter Paint, in the past  I,v had good luck with this can. I,v let it hang several days and this entire process is 3-4 weeks along now. I did hang it out 1 day and will try a heat gun. I,m in southern Indiana and it is pretty humid here.

[wet willy]

I suspect something in the mixture you applied and the previous finish is incompatible. This has happened to me, and despite weeks of drying, the finish remained sticky. Stripped everything off and started anew from bare wood. This might be you last, best choice.

[eddillon]

I find that a liberal dose of sunshine works wonders.

[bob in the woods]

Why so much turp ?   I don't use it at all . 

[David R. Pennington]

I have had some of the same issues. My first rifle I used half and half turp. and boiled linseed for first couple coats then pure linseed oil for several more coats with no problems. Latest builds seemed like the finish would never dry. I even added some japan drier. Is the linseed oil we get now different, or am I losing patience in my old age?

[bob in the woods]

Check out Dan Phariss' posts re boiling /making oil finish.  I never use just linseed oil.  The stuff made per Dan's instructions
[ I think Eric Kettenburg wrote an article for Muzzleblasts some years ago re making finish] works extremely well and drys fine.  If I don't have my own finish or just don't have the time to make it up, I will just use Tried and True oil varnish.
Or if you want, try Chamber's finish. It is good stuff too.

[Pete G.]

I have found that the linseed sold as art supply is way superior as a finish. The hardware store stuff, not so much. I do still use the later in cleaning. I will rub on a light coat and then rub off as much as I can with a paper towel. This leaves that mellow glow that we are all so fond of.

[wpalongrifle]

Too thick a coating will most likely take days to dry!!! I don't use any furniture varnish or linseed oils on guns!!! I've been using Chambers Finish for 15-20 years now with great success. Its a varnish, very thin and dries fast. Most likely you have too thick coating!!! And mixing diffent products had a reverse effect? Best thing to do is remove as much or all back to bare wood and restart!!! Anything you do now is a fix/temp. Or covering over will be an underlying issue later. Cloudy depth to wood or most likely sticky in humid conditions!!!! My guess would be yellowing over time also!!

[wpalongrifle]

I have found that the linseed sold as art supply is way superior as a finish. The hardware store stuff, not so much. I do still use the later in cleaning. I will rub on a light coat and then rub off as much as I can with a paper towel. This leaves that mellow glow that we are all so fond of.

Cold press linseed oil from Art supply had way more lead hardners in it!! Making it much better than boiled linseed you get in home depot or Hardwear stores. Speedlac is a great choice also. Difficult to use at times but builds a great hard finish. You can add powdered lead as hardners to any oil based paint, finish etc. but must be mixed under a double heat, I use a glass jar in sand inside a coffe can. Over an electric element!! No open flames. You get a overall warm heat without boil over.

[Kermit]

You could try several days in direct sunlight--or a few visits to a tanning salon. However, I'm also suspecting something awry in your mixture. Were all your ingredients pretty much " fresh," or was there some shop shelf time in previously opened containers?

[Dphariss]

I have a hard maple stock that I put the finish on and it will not dry. My finish is one third poly, one third tung and one third turpintine with some japan dryer in it. As it would not dry totally I steel wolled it down with turpintine and wool and added more dryer and refinished agine with not very good results. The stock is in the80- 90 percent drying range but still  has a slightly tacky feeling. Any suggestions appreciated.

Maybe the plastic does not like the natural finishes and they are fighting each other, if you listen closely can you hear tiny bugles and drums
People spend a lot of time over thinking stock finish and staining. Bat wings, eye of Newt, melted milk jugs (they will dissolve in acetone you know), spider pee..... When in reality the wood finish, especially on maple, is the easy part. Its almost TOO simple. But people insist on making it difficult.

Dan

[Jim Kibler]

Is there a possibility that you've applied the finish in coats that are a little too heavy?  Without seeing the stock, this seems the most likely possibility to me.  Very thin coats are usually best in my experience.  By thin, i mean stretching the finish about as far as it will go when applying.

[Dave Dolliver]

I had an experience, early on, where I tried to put polyurethane over an oil sealer.  The urethane would not polymerize because of the oil.  maybe that's happening here.

Dave Dolliver

[PPatch]

I have a hard maple stock that I put the finish on and it will not dry. My finish is one third poly, one third tung and one third turpintine with some japan dryer in it. As it would not dry totally I steel wolled it down with turpintine and wool and added more dryer and refinished agine with not very good results. The stock is in the80- 90 percent drying range but still  has a slightly tacky feeling. Any suggestions appreciated.

I see so many possible problems here, first and foremost your mixture should have been tested on scrap before putting it on your rifle.

- "Polyurethane" is actually sort of a generic term and comes in many varieties with many mixes of solids to dryers etc. Just because it says poly on the label does not mean it is like any other poly's sitting on the shelf next to it. We have no idea which poly you chose so can't know how to advise you on that point alone.

- Polyurethane has its own drying cycle, basically the thinners flash off first then the poly has to have oxygen to cure.

- Adding oils to the mix significantly increases the poly drying time. Without testing you not really know what the finish will look like when done. Poly does not like water either, high humidity can play heck with it and cause it to dry cloudy.

- "Tung oil" also comes in a host of varieties and percentages of actual tung oil to whatever else the maker added. Most have a low percentage of actual tung oil.

- Did you "seal" the stock before using your finish? What with? Could make a difference.

Basically, and if it were me, I would remove that finish asap. I would remove it and rethink the whole idea of using a mix such as you have and go with something a bit more traditional and that has known working properties.

Good luck and I hope you are able to save the project.

dave

[smart dog]

Hi Joe,
You mentioned using the tung oil (or the mix?) before with good results but this time it is not working.  Is that correct?  If that is the case it may be the thickness of your coats and the humidity.  I've used a tung oil, polyurethane, and turps mix as a sealer and then "polymerized" tung oil as my top coats for >20 years.  It is my favorite mix unless I want to use an actual varnish.  Anyway, none of the ingredients you describe should cause any problems.  However, pure tung oil (no solvents, driers, or treatments) can take a long time to dry.  I use polymerized tung oil, a process in which it is heated so that it dries quickly.  Lee Valley, Garrett Wade, and Sutherland-Welles sell the stuff.  There are also products on the market called "tung oil finish" that contain no actual oil, just derivitives combined in a varnish.  You do need to know what it is you have with respect to the tung oil.  That said, generally if finishes can be thinned with the same thinner, they will be compatible when mixed.  My advice is to be patient and let the stock have plenty of time to dry.


dave

[little joe]

The Tung oil is Formbys, the poly is Minwax brand and I have used this mixture for years sucessfully. I put as thin a coat as I can. Will  try the sunshine if it ever shines agine.  I,m stunpted on this one.

[sdilts]

You might want to try out the book Flexner on Finishing - Answers to Your Wood Finishing Fears and Frustrations. He goes into great detail about the various finishes, what they are, how they are made, how to use them, how to make your own, etc. There is also a section on myths of wood finishes that is very interesting. Wish I had read that before I tried using pure tung oil on a stock I just refinished. Won't do that again.

There are also chapters on stains and how they act on different types of wood.

By the way, Formby's Tung Oil finish contains no tung oil at all, it was a marketing gimmick.

You can find it on Amazon for 15 to 20 bucks. Well worth the money.

[smart dog]

Hi,
Great advice by SDilts.  Flexner's books are very good.  He is also correct that Formby's contains no actual tung oil.  It has tung oil derivitives that are included with other compounds to create a wiping varnish.  That said, like you, I have used Formby's tung oil finish many times but only on furniture and gun cases.  It works fine and easily but does not penetrate very deeply.

dave

[porchdog48]

  I had the same problem with Formby's . I hung rifle in the sun for days, and put it in a heat box to get it to dry. Nothing worked so stripped it and used another finish.

Dave

[bama]

I agree with Jim. If you put on a coat of finish and do not "stretch it" or rub until you actually heat the finish with the palm of your hand until it almost feels dry, then you are probably putting on to heavy a coat.

What happens is the top of the coat dries enough to block the air from getting to the under part of the finish so it never dries. I had a friend that built a nice mountain rifle about 20 years ago using Linseed oil and that rifle still felt tacky. I took the rifle and an old wore out towel and started rubbing. As I started to rub the surface started to heat up. As this happened the gummy finish started sticking to the towel and I was able to remove the excess finish that could not dry. Now this took time, I rubbed on that stock for a couple of days. But when I got through low and behold that stock had the nice soft luster that we all attempt to get and I did nothing but rub the stock. But I had to get that old gummed up finish that would not dry removed first.

[Mark Elliott]

I always rub back my oil finishes.    I put the oil on thin coat by thin coat until I get a uniform glossy finish then rub it back.   If I got too much finish on, then I rub it back with 0000 steel wool and then reapply some more coats.   Otherwise,  I would rub with a coarse cloth, or better yet; white  Scotch Brite type pads I get from Lowes.    They make quick work or rubbing back to a deep satin finish without taking off much finish.    Usually,  I end up rubbing the finish back two or three times before I am done.   That also includes several applications of colored washes.   You actually have to apply several wash coats to build it up.   One heavy coat doesn't work.   It will all just rub off. 

[Mark Elliott]

I should probably also note that I seal with a mixture of 1/2 my oil stock finish and 1/2 turpentine.    I apply two coats of this, and on a well scraped/whiskered surface,  it helps in building up the finish quickly.