Shooting minie ball question

[Fly]

I have a number of patched round ball rifles in 1-66 twist barrels. All but one are
.50 cal. I also have a .54 Lyman GPR. Can Minnie ball be shot with good accuracy
is these rifles.I known the minies where shot in the enfleild rifle with a 1.78 twist  &
that's my reason for asking.
                                                Fly

[SCLoyalist]

Keep in mind that twist is just one factor.  Other barrel characteristics such as groove depth,  ratio of land to groove width, & number of grooves will also come into play.   The Enfields had, as I recall, three fairly shallow but  narrow grooves.

Track will sell you a minie mold for around $25.  One afternoon casting and one morning shooting the minies over a range of different powder charges should give you a pretty good idea if minies will work for you in your guns.

[Hungry Horse]

 My first question, would be, why do think you need a minie bullet in the first place. The minie was designed for speed of loading more than accuracy. My experience with minies used in a hunting situations, is that the first one works fine, but if you need a follow up shot, the reload can be very difficult, due to the foulings in the bore. A fifty caliber round ball, in the right spot, will kill anything in the lower forty-eight, and the back-up shot will load like a dream.

                    Hungry Horse

[Fly]

My first question, would be, why do think you need a minie bullet in the first place. The minie was designed for speed of loading more than accuracy. My experience with minies used in a hunting situations, is that the first one works fine, but if you need a follow up shot, the reload can be very difficult, due to the foulings in the bore. A fifty caliber round ball, in the right spot, will kill anything in the lower forty-eight, and the back-up shot will load like a dream.

                    Hungry Horse

Well to the question, I know the Enfields shot well over 200 yds with a 1-78 twist barrel.I was just wanting to
see if one of my 1-66 barrels can shot farther out then a 100 yard round ball.

[Hungry Horse]

 I think if you are dead set on shooting bullets, you need to get a gun designed to do so. correct twist, and correct rifling. Long range shooting is one thing. Long range hunting is another. So if you are just shooting targets at ranges over about 150 yards there is no problem. But if you are hunting big game, at extended ranges, you need to think long, and hard, about hunting ethics, and the distinct possibility of wounding game, that you may, or may not, be able to retrieve.

              Hungry Horse

[Fly]

HH I already have a Gibb's & you don't get much better for long range.I,m just playing
with these rifles.I want a 1853 Enfield some day.I don't hunt just like to play with these
old guns & see what can be done with them.

The Enfield rifle of that day with only 1-78 twist has always amazed me, as to how far they
can hit a man.David at Research Press says they shot them up to 800 yds in England in comps.

                                                                    Fly

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Based upon my experience, I will answer your question with a 'no'.  Cylindrical/conoidal bullets do not shoot well in a barrel designed to shoot  patched round balls.  You will be disappointed with slugs in your Lyman GPR.  The only bullet I know works acceptably well in these rifles, is the REAL bullet.  By all means, give that one a try.

[heelerau]

Mate,
       I have been shooting Enfields, both Pat 53 and Pat 58 Parker Hale two band rifle for 40 odd years. They have shallow wide grooves designed for paper patched Pritchett or naked mine bullet. The hollow base upsets in both cases to engage the rifling. Patched round ball can be conversely shot out of these rifles, I have  not done so, but plenty of others have. I believe the deep groves and narrow lands of the long rifle are really only suited to patched round ball, suspect you may get leading if you shoot to many minnies out of  such a rifle.  The Enfields have a very high trajectory compared to the flatter one of a long rifle. I have hunted with both and find my long rifles much easier to use as they shoot much flatter, and the .50 will take anything that we have down under.

Kind regards

Heelerau

[Fly]

Well I think you fellows are most likely right.My problem I think out side
the box too much.But it never hurts to ask .

                                         Thanks Fly

[Old Bob]

A Minie will work with a 1/66 twist ok. My Richmond R-M has a 1/48 six groove barrel. The problem is the deep grooves in a round ball gun. The Minie was designed for use in a barrel with progressive depth rifling, deep at the breech and very shallow at the muzzle. Also very wide lands and grooves. In the case of Springfield muskets, that would be 3 grooves, .015" at the breech tapering to .005" at the muzzle. Enfields were similar, though some contractor arms such as Pryse & Redmond used 5 groove barrels. What it boils down to is the rifling needs to be wide enough and shallow enough to allow the bullet to obdurate or upset into the grooves to both engage the rifling and seal off the gases. Deep narrow grooves won't let that happen, especially if you use the powder charge the Minie was designed for or less. An example would be my barrel. With a fairly fast twist and twice the grooves of the original, my Richmond does best with 50 grs. of powder rather than the service charge of 60 grs. The big advantage of the Minie is the speed of reloading. If properly lubed, quite a few rounds can be loaded quickly without wiping. Also, you get much more bullet weight, but that comes with a price. Velocity drops greatly and you'll have to change sights. For hunting you'd be just as well off staying with the round ball. But, I'm not one to say you can't experiment. If you have a barrel with shallow grooves, you might have something that'll work.

[gunmaker]

While not a scientific test, my son tried quite a few bullets in his 30" 1:66 Douglas bbl. rifle from 50 to 90 gr.  None would group on a 8 X 11 paper at 50 yd.  ......PRB---one hole at 25 yd. from a rest, 1-1/2" at 50 yd.....If you shoot from a blind or tree stand at 20 yd or less. I don't like 'em because I'm afraid they mite move off charge while hunting. .....Tom