Questions concerning Tennessee rifle build

[frogwalking]

Gentlemen,

I am building a Tennessee rifle, using a .40 Rice Southern Classic bbl. with long tang bp, Dunlap grade 6 red maple stock, (inletted and the butt shaped by Jack's Mtn. Gunstocks), a Chambers late Ketland lock, and iron furniture.  In the past, I have riveted the toeplate and buttplate together with a copper rivet when using brass furniture, and likewise used a copper rivet to attach the brass nose cap.  The iron pieces will be finished (browned) when installed, and attempting to rivet, with iron or copper, will scratch up the finish.  How do you guys do this?  Also, I bought a front site that originated with Ted Cash, silver blade and copper base.  If I install as is, the bottom of the blade will stand several hundreths above the bbl.  Are they soft soldered together.  If so, I can take it apart, file a little, and reassemble with the blade a little lower so it hugs the barrel.   I had planned to post a photo, but have not completely mastered Windows 8 yet, and seem to have lost my photo.

Thanks for the help.

[Dave B]

I would use a finishing nail as my rivet to  secure the toe plate with the toe of the but plate. Just a small counter sink on each side and  let drive. I would do it after the finish work is done so no having to take it apart at all. Once riveted in place and dressed down I would touch up the rivet with the browning solution in the end. With regard to your sight I would take the base down from the underside making it thinner on the whole. This works well if you are not having to install it into a pre machined dove tail for 3/8" sight base. Hand cutting one will allow you to make the depth perfect to keep the base flush with the top of the barrel. The blade is silver soldered in to the copper base If I remember correctly.

[frogwalking]

C'mon guys, help me out here.  You have built innumerable rifles with iron mounts, and can tell me how to do  it.

[kaintuck]

I am REAL careful when working with finished metals.....you can use tape(duct tape etc) around the areas you want to protect~ I know it's tuff....but satified when finished....
sounds like a real nice rilfe!!!

marc

[Dennis Glazener]

C'mon guys, help me out here.  You have built innumerable rifles with iron mounts, and can tell me how to do  it.

OK here's how I do it but I haven't seen but one or two NC rifles done this way and am not familiar with how a TN rifle is done.

I don't rivet the bp toe to the toeplate. I usually fit and secure the bp leaving it a little too long (past toe plate). When I inlet the bottom of the toe for the toeplate I file a notch in the end of the bp toe then let the length of the toeplate extend into the notch. Then file the end of the bp toe to be flush with the toeplate. Hope that makes sense.

I make my nosecap rivets out of a piece of #10 copper wire, I cut a piece off hold it in the vise and make a 90 degree bend then flatten the short leg of the 90 degree bend. I then drill a hole the size of the wire through the nose cap and through the forestock. I slip the rivet through the hold from the barrel channel, mark around the flatten end and then inlet that end flush with the bottom of the barrel. Then counter sink the hole on the outside of the nosecap just enough to brad the rivet flush. Then I cut the end of the rivet to about where I think I have enough to stick a little above the counter sunk hole. Then use a small ball peen hammer to flatten the head (I do this with the barrel in place and clamped so the back side of the rivet has a firm surface to hold it in place). I have never had a problem damaging the nose cap. You don't beat it down below the surface of the metal just slightly above and then use a fine file to dress it off.
Dennis

[Meteorman]

  Also, I bought a front site that originated with Ted Cash, silver blade and copper base.  If I install as is, the bottom of the blade will stand several hundreths above the bbl.  Are they silver soldered together.  If so, I can take it apart, file a little, and reassemble with the blade a little lower so it hugs the barrel. 

why cant you just file some off the bottom of the base ?

[frogwalking]

Meteor man, I wish it was that simple.  I had Rice cut the front dovetail, and for once, the store bought sight fits perfectly, except the base is too thick.  Filing the bottom off will make the dovetail base too narrow.  I will just make the sight as I often do, making the base, and using a silver coin to make the sight blade.

Thanks Dennis.  I have some copper saddle rivets that work fine if I flatten the very slightly counter sunk head.  I didn't know if a copper rivet was suitable for an iron  nose cap. 

[bgf]

Iron rivets work/look fine also.  The shine will wear off them or you can touch them up with something.  You want the rivet visible, if only just a bit, for authenticity .  To be 100% truthful, I tapped the nosecap on my last rifle and used a countersunk machine screw in place of the rivet for easy placement after finish, and somehow I still sleep at night.

[mjm46@bellsouth.net]

You could probably get the sight apart with some judicial heating with a torch. Once the thing is apart do your filing and re-solder it back together then file of the excess peg on the bottom.

I wouldn't rivet the butt plate and toe plate together. Unless your wood is very old and/or very well cured and even if it is, the wood is going to expand and shrink. I've got rifles that the butt plate is now a strong 1/16" inch longer than the original butt where it was originally flush. This means that if they were riveted shrinkage might force a separation in the toe plate or in the butt plate. I usually just attach my toe plate with a couple of screws and let it naturally ride against the inside of the butt plate.

I've seen a kind of mortise and tenon connection used, where a pin from the toe plate fits into a notch in the butt plate, on Moravian rifles. But I think they may have been using better aged wood than is available to us.

[rich pierce]

I would peen the sight base to be thinner using a flatting punch for blacksmithing. I forget the right term for it but it's a flat bottomed swaging tool.  Place it on one side of the blade while the blade is on the anvil and hit it with a 3 pound hammer.  Then the other side.  Then straighten it, then measure thickness. Repeat as needed. Leave it a few thousandths over for filing smooth.

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

i love it Rich... Don't force it... get a bigger hammer.... Duh!!  Someday I will learn to think like that.............

[Mark Elliott]

My four pound cross-pein is my favorite hammer.  I can move a lot of metal.