Black powder safe

[Dave R]

Who builds a good fireproof safe or container to store black powder in case of a house or garage fire?

[The Original Griz]

try here
http://www.dixiegunworks.com/default.php?cPath=22_100_360

[Hungry Horse]

 Dixie used to offer such a portable magazine, but I don't think they currently carry them anymore. I use a small job site tool box made by Knack. It has two tamper resistant locks per government regulations, and is pretty heavy gauge steel, I added sheetrock lining for longer fire protection, and iron casters to make it easier to evacuate in case of fire. This is very close to government regulations for a portable magazine.

                  Hungry Horse

[drago]

Just remember the top needs to easily be blown off before much pressure builds up and causes a unsafe explosion. This is a storage container, not a safe like vault. Better to let the powder get hot and degrade in extreme heat and the bottles pop off than blow up your house. Cans burning and popping are not as dangerous as going off in a strong steel or fire proof safe.

[Dphariss]

Dixie shows them on their web site. Again as Drago said confining the powder in a strong container  will greatly increase its destructive force. Unless confined BP is a pretty low order explosive. In the end BP or smokeless will have the same effect and in equal amounts smokeless might be worse. A bottle of BP  set off in a case of bottles will not even set off the entire case just a few. This in actual testing by a master distributor. Any propellant needs to be stored with care and handled the same way so use proper precautions. The only reason BP is considered an explosive rather than a propellant is the ignition temp and because the Gov't agency could call it an explosive. A semi load turned on its side on an interstate back east a few years back with no more drama than a load of cotton balls.

Dan

[Mad Monk]

Check the web site for the Maine Powder House.  An ATF approved black powder storage box for $208.

Keep in mind that storage of black powder on your property still falls under the ATF regulations.  The flammable solid classification is for shipping purposes.

You don't want to store any amount of black powder in the house for a variety of reasons.

The common standard building codes limit you to 5 or 6 pounds of black powder on your property.

In the event of a fire that could, or could not, involve the black powder you could run into problems with home owners insurance.

In an apartment complex they usually prohibit possession of any black powder in the apartment.

The best bet would be one of the ATF approved boxes as is seen on the Maine Powder House web site.  Tucked away in a corner of a garage.  But not out in the full sun in a metal lawn shed normally used to store lawn mowers, etc.

Very low temperatures will cause no harm to black powder.  Storage in heat requires that the temperature of the powder not exceed 150 degrees F.  No real danger of an explosion here.  Just a problem where the powder will begin to go through chemical changes that cause it to grow increasingly weaker in the gun and to foul the gun badly.


Mad Monk

[Kermit]

I got a 20mm ammo can, rattle-canned it red, and used white stick-on letters to label it. I lined it with drywall scraps and screwed casters from the Re-Store on the bottom. The lid sits on top NOT fastened shut. Holds more than I need it to and I'm sure I don't have more than 50 bucks or so in it.

[Dave R]

A BIG thanks to all!!

[hammer]

The United Kingdom Health and Safety Executive (HSE) completed exhaustive testing of firesafe boxes to contain small quantities of black powder in a domestic environment.   The objective was to determine a design that could be simply and cheaply contructed and allow sufficient time, in the event of a fire, for the occupants to escape.  Together with a design that would reduce or eliminate the acceleration of the fire from the black powder itself.   (Seperate requirements apply to commercial quantities).   The result was a box design constructed of plywood and all UK users were required to store their BP in such manner.   

The requirement for a larger box was soon accepted and further trials conducted.  These are covered in HSE rr991.   An interesting read in itself.    Google:    HSE black powder.     Note the emphasis is NEVER to consider first the removal of the store.  And it should NEVER be kept near an exit.  The first and only priority if the safe evacuation of the occupants.

The HSE do not consider security.  The police authorities in addition require a hasp and padlock to protect against casual tampering or access, e.g. by children, visitors.   

[Kermit]

Finally found this. Interesting methodology. Scroll for photos and, eventually, diagrams/plans.

http://www.hse.gov.uk/research/rrpdf/rr991.pdf

[Mark Elliott]

I bought one years ago from Dixie, but I think the British design is probably safer from a fire point of view.  I find it astounding that a government agency would go to the trouble to design and scientifically TEST a simple/inexpensive black powder storage solution for their citizens. 

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I don't know who came up with the ideas, but Canada follows the British lead.  We must store our powder in a dwelling in a wooden box with 'EXPLOSIVES' in two inch red letters thereon.  The rules have recently changed about quantity...going to check on that right now.

Storage Limit (single dwelling unit) - 25 kg propellant af which no more than 10 kg may be black powder + 75 kg in separate storage outside of dwelling with no separation distance
Proposed Storage Limit (multi-dwelling unit) – 5 kg of smokeless or 20 kg smokeless in containers of 1kg or less, 2 kg black powder in bulk in containers of 500 g or less and 3 kg in cartouches and bulk