Bandsaw questions?

[sean69]

Not sure really if this is the right place for this - but looking for some help on a bandsaw I just bought - got it off Kijiji for $75! all oldschool cast iron, woorks great- all cleaned up and running smoothly, though there are a few things, it binds up if I try to cut anything thicker than 2" not sure what the problem is there, blade seems sharp .

- should I be using a different type of blade for ripping and crosscutting?
- what should the blade tension be
- what should the motor/belt tension be?
- could it just be binding [by binding I mean the motor spins but the blade stops] because the motor does not pull enough amps?
- how are blades measured? pulley center to center or edge to edge?

Thanks!

[Nordnecker]

Hard to say. Blades come in all sorts of arrangements- width of blade x teeth per inch, differents gullet shapes and amount of set in the teeth. Bandsaws are categorized by the size of the wheel. A 14 inch saw will have 14" wheels. Blades come in lengths which is determined by the total length around the wheels. You should have a tension adjustment wheel that backs off or increases the tension of the blade. You should be able to rip or crosscut with the same blade. A 3/8 wide by 3 teeth per inch (TPI) should breeze through 2 inch stock no problem. Tight curves require a thinner blade, like 1/4 or 1/8 of an inch. a rule of thumb is to have 3 teeth in the thickness of the stock you're cutting. New tires on your wheels can help a lot. If your guide blocks aren't up to the task, the blade can get "bent" in the cut. Proper set up is essential. 

[J Henry]

  Go on line and see if you can get the Owners Manual for it,,then set it you starting a page one step one..Change a blade  change the settings,tension,cooling blocks etc,,Owners Manual is a great place to start..

[44-henry]

If you don't have one already do yourself a favor and get a premium blade for your saw. I use Laguna brand blades in my vintage Rockwell and they make all the difference. They cost more up front but you will save in the longrun with increased performance and durability.

[Acer Saccharum]

If the blade stops, yet the motor is still spinning, I'd say the horsepower is OK at this point.

I would look at the blade guides. Unplug the machine.


What kind of guides?
Solid bar guides:
Roll the wheel around backwards by hand, and while doing this push the blade slightly deeper into the guides. Does the blade get stuck in the guides? Back the guides out, both top and bottom, and try the saw under power again. Does the machine stop like it did before? If you have solid guides, and the blade has been pushed deeper into the guides, the blade may have lost its set from rubbing on the guides.

Ball bearing guides:
Make sure each roller turns freely. The backup roller should be set so that the blade doesn't touch it, unless wood is being cut, which forces the blade against the backup roller. The side guide rollers should be set AFTER the backup roller is set. Set the side rolls so they CANNOT touch the sides or the fronts of the teeth.

[Kermit]

A photo of your saw could help. If it's an old saw, I'd probably replace the tires from the get-go. Sounds like the drive belt is okay from your description. Get the guides set right. Don't forget the lower guides under the table. Look at getting a new blade or five. Unless you are doing tight scroll work, stay away from skinny blades. I have a 1/4" blade that almost never gets used. I use 3/4" and 1/2" blades most of the time. Look online for instruction for proper bandsaw setup. Good help out there. BTW, I use a dollar bill for a feeler guage for setting the guides. Unless your saw is a real beat up cheapie, you should be able to get it working right. They are simple machines.

[sean69]

No Prob - here's some pics, with the 2.5" bit of curly maple I intend to cut incidentally:



















So from the photos, the motor data plate [old one eh??!!]  2.8 /1.4 amps... not sure what that means, but 1/6 HP and 1725 RPM, the bandsaw says on it 900rpm.

The saw, no name anywhere - cast iron - it weighs a ton & you can see someone has extended it a bit.

- that's a 1/2 inch blade so looking at 6tpi
- there is no rubber on the wheels, metal on metal ~ there's supposed to be tires??
- both types of guides brass bushings & wheel guides, I can see already the bottom one is not sup[posed to be touching the blade. the top guides come nowhere close to the blade no matter how I adjust it - I'm just wondering if that guidepost is from a different machine
- blade seems sharp, but it's no big deal to try replacing it. at least I now know how to measure it
- this thing is 40/50 years old - no owners manual. lots of parts have been replaced with "whatever" both wheel covers look handmade as well as the "riser" several bolts and screws also.
- when it binds up everything stops, motor, pulleys etc. I did get it to cut that 2" piece of walnut after a bit of extra tensioning the motor down, but I had to feed it REALLY slowly



Thanks for the pointers, I got a few more tuning things to try - but more questions!! HA!

- I can use a thicker 3/4" blade on that?
- can I use it to cut metal [with the appropriate blade of course - I suppose I will have to do some math and get some different sized pulleys for metal cutting speeds]

So looks like I am going to try a new blade and try to properly adjust the lower guides, it does run fine now for cutting thin stuff, plywood etc. but I have that maple to get through

-thanks
-sean

[FDR]

Go to "you tube" and watch the video's on tuning a band saw.  "Highland Woodworking" has premium blades or can make any size required.

Fred

[Acer Saccharum]

Stop!

That roller in the second and fourth photos from the end should have its edge BEHIND the blade. The way it's set up, when you push wood into the blade, the blade rides back past the roller, and the back edge of your blade is cutting into the table.

Watch the 'how to tune a bandsaw' as suggested above.

If motor is 1/6 HP, good luck cutting anything thick.

Sharp blade is a must.

[sean69]

So what HP would you suggest to get through 3" of curly maple?

[PPatch]

Here is an excellent band saw tuning video:



From your pictures it looks like the lower guide (below the table) is good but the one above the table needs attention (watch the video). Try and not get into the madness of trying to adjust the wheels to run the blade "true," it will drive you slap nuts, or it did me anyway. 1/6th HP is pretty weak for thick maple. Mine, a Ricon 10", is 1/2 HP and will cut 2.5 inch thick stuff just fine, I don't believe 3 inch stuff would slow it much. Your blade must be very sharp, you can sharpen them yourself, its not that hard but time consuming.

As you seem to know you can't cut metal with it as is, it very likely runs far too fast for that and would overheat and eat the metal cutting blade almost immediately. Yes, maybe, you could cut metal if you installed the proper wheel setup. Doing so would involve a lot of fiddling around though. Perhaps your future holds a portable metal cutoff saw and a table jig saw. Those would be more convenient than always converting that saw for the limited advantage of slicing metal. For gun work I get by with a hack saw, a jewelers saw for thin stuff.

Good luck with your saw, hope you get it figured out.

dave

[rickw]

So what HP would you suggest to get through 3" of curly maple?

For that saw, I would recommend 3/4 HP. One HP would be better, but probably more expensive.If I were you, I'd try to get a used motor for it.
I don't recognize that bandsaw, but there are people on the Old Woodworking Machines forum (owwm.org) that could tell you the make and model.
Rick W

[Randall Steffy]

You do not want metal against metal, blade against wheel. Rubber or better yet urethane tires are a must. I wouldnt even start the saw without tires. Also you will note a crown or high spot in the center of the wheel rim. After you have tires, the blade will track to the high spot of the rim and be quite content to stay there. The top wheel has a tilt adjustment to fine tune the tracking of your blade.
Good luck.

[J Henry]

  Many adjustments need to be made by looking at the pictures.
   #4 blade should track in the center of the wheel.
#5 picture the wheel,thrust bearing should be behind the blade.
 # 7 bearing should be in slight contact with the back of the blade
       First picture shows volt is your wired for 110 or 220?
   and the horsepower is a big problem not enough to do the work you are doing..

[Hungry Horse]

You may find that tires for the drive wheels are no longer available for this saw. I HAD THAT PROBLEM WITH A 10" bandsaw I got for cheap. An old timer told me to wrap the wheels with friction tape, it works like a champ. You may have problems finding friction tape though. Modern electrical tape does not work at all.

     Hungry Horse

[P.W.Berkuta]

From what I see you got a "hobby bandsaw" to make "doll house" furniture with. Your saw with it's 1/6 H.P. motor and a GOOD blade you will be lucky to cutting 1" maple. Go to Grizzly Tools and look at their 14"- 3/4 H.P. band saw and use that as a guide. Yes -- a lot of people use less saw but I recommend a 14"- 3/4 H.P saw as a very good place to start at for most all your wood working needs.

I also suggest buying the book "Bandsaw Handbook by Mark Duginske -- it has all the info you will need to use and tune-up a bandsaw such as -- "Bandsaw Fundamentals", "All About Blades", "Pre-Use Procedures", Maintenance and Cutting Procedures".  

[smallpatch]

That little saw was never meant to cut more than 2" thick, but set up,properly, it will do much better than it does now.  Go very slow, let the blade cut.
Look on line for a bandsaw tuning video.  It MUST be set up right for guides, tension, etc before its going to work right.
Don't expect it to cut 3" thick maple.  Not gonna happen.
I use a ⅜" , 3 TPI  on mine to cut out stock blanks, but it has a ¾ HP motor.

It wouldn't cut hot butter till it was set up right. Once properly set up, with a good Timberwolf blade.  It works like a charm.
Sorry, I ramble on.

[sean69]

Here is an excellent band saw tuning video:



From your pictures it looks like the lower guide (below the table) is good but the one above the table needs attention (watch the video). Try and not get into the madness of trying to adjust the wheels to run the blade "true," it will drive you slap nuts, or it did me anyway. 1/6th HP is pretty weak for thick maple. Mine, a Ricon 10", is 1/2 HP and will cut 2.5 inch thick stuff just fine, I don't believe 3 inch stuff would slow it much. Your blade must be very sharp, you can sharpen them yourself, its not that hard but time consuming.

As you seem to know you can't cut metal with it as is, it very likely runs far too fast for that and would overheat and eat the metal cutting blade almost immediately. Yes, maybe, you could cut metal if you installed the proper wheel setup. Doing so would involve a lot of fiddling around though. Perhaps your future holds a portable metal cutoff saw and a table jig saw. Those would be more convenient than always converting that saw for the limited advantage of slicing metal. For gun work I get by with a hack saw, a jewelers saw for thin stuff.

Good luck with your saw, hope you get it figured out.

dave

I've got a line on a 1hp motor for it, think I'm just going to get it cutting wood properly before I worry about metal [really that's just a matter of doing some math and setting up the right pulleys ~ IF ~ the right diameter arrangement can be worked out for the slower speeds. perhaps the pulleys from an old drill press?

[sean69]

I only found one place to get a 10" x 1" set of tires! arrgh!  it looks like that spacer was put there to allow more choices in blade width and TPI - seems only the longer blades are very thick with low tooth count.
Doing some math what I need here is a 70" blade [+/- 2"]  even at that my options seem limited. removing the spacer drops the blade down to 64" with even less options!

so new blade, new tires, new motor - this is actually turning into a bit of a hobby on it's own!

[BTW - been watching those maintenance & tuning videos, I'm not ignoring those comments ]

Everything seems to be in the US - anyone have a parts recommendation for Canada? Lee Valley, has parts but for larger saw/diameters etc.

[Randall Steffy]

Hopefully you can connect with a shop near you which buys good bandsaw blade stock by the roll and welds the exact custom length you need. I concur that 3T x 3/8 or 4T x 3/8 will do a great job. I could get that blade made for about $8 plus shipping.

[sean69]

Hopefully you can connect with a shop near you which buys good bandsaw blade stock by the roll and welds the exact custom length you need. I concur that 3T x 3/8 or 4T x 3/8 will do a great job. I could get that blade made for about $8 plus shipping.

funny - I just got off the phone with a local place [Busy Bee] - they gave me a line on 2 places in Ontario, one will make the blade while I wait & the other will make the tires!

[smallpatch]

Sean,

Sounds like you'll be spending more than what your saw is worth.
Mew motor, new pulleys, etc.
I've got a 14" Rigid on a stand that I paid $299.00 for brand new from HD.

Works like a charm, with all parts and blades, over the counter standard sizes.

[P.W.Berkuta]

Sean,

Sounds like you'll be spending more than what your saw is worth.
Mew motor, new pulleys, etc.
I've got a 14" Rigid on a stand that I paid $299.00 for brand new from HD.

Works like a charm, with all parts and blades, over the counter standard sizes.

THIS is the way to go -- new everything -- at a good price with a GUARANTEE too boot - how can you go wrong UNLESS you want to futz around with a "toy" saw .

[JTR]

I agree, get a new one.
I had my Dad's old saw that was well worn out, and it just wasn't worth fixing. I'm sure Pop forgave me when I tossed the old one in the trash and put a brand new 1 HP, 14" saw in its place, for a bit less than it would have taken to patch up the old one.
John

[huntinguy]

looks a good deal like my old PowerKraft. The tires will have to be made, from what I have found with all my research. The only place I have found (I don't have my bookmarks on this computer) is in Florida.

Blades are not a problem. You should be able to have a good toolhouse order them to size for you.

I have mine as a project that I haven't gotten to yet.

If you have room a bigger saw would be better. I, however, do not have the luxury of room. Those small saws can fit on a rotation table a drop out of the way when you don't need it.