Author Topic: powder,ball & patch recomendations  (Read 12175 times)

Offline hanshi

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Re: powder,ball & patch recomendations
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2009, 06:40:29 PM »
A question for Daryl.  I have a couple of ml rifles that don't have what I call radiused crowns.  I've always been afraid I'd mess up & hurt accuracy if I tried it (lack of self-confidence, I guess).  Are ml guns forgiving about that sort of thing?  How's the best way to do it?
!Jozai Senjo! "always present on the battlefield"
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Daryl

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Re: powder,ball & patch recomendations
« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2009, 09:41:07 PM »
A while back, Taylor reminded me of a day at the gun club, where a guy just couldn't load a descent patch and ball combo into his TC Hawken due to the factory crown.  I pulled out my pocket knife and cut a nice chamfer around the muzzle, then pulled out a scrap of emery from my hunting pouch and 'crowned' his rifle for him with a nice radius.  Pretty simple - go for it.  Without a crown that allows tight loading, the rifle's accuracy is going to be sub-par - you cannot hurt poor shooting by smoothing the crown.  Crowns are quite forgiving - they must be, my rifles shoot well and I'm all thumbs - thumbs without any patience equals poor skill which should mean innacuracy - but not - I guess I'm a paradox!.

Offline hanshi

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Re: powder,ball & patch recomendations
« Reply #27 on: March 19, 2009, 12:47:54 AM »
 ;D  Daryl, I'll give it a go with emery cloth or sandpaper (got some 400 grit) but will not try the knife thing.  I'm not so sure I'll be able to retrieve my finger with my ball puller when it's all over.
!Jozai Senjo! "always present on the battlefield"
Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.

Daryl

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Re: powder,ball & patch recomendations
« Reply #28 on: March 19, 2009, 04:32:03 AM »
Give it a whirl. Run a bit cloth patch down into the bore to catch grindings. You can pull it out afterwards with tweezers, leaving a grit-less bore.  Or you can do it as I do sometimes and forget the patch. Not advised.

  I lay the 'cloth' over the muzzle, shove the end (nail) into the cloth, pushing it down into the muzzle as far as it will go, then rotate my hand, periodically turning the gun or barrel to ensure an even 'cut'.  I've used the round stones you  can by for an electric drill- the large variety tapered to 1" or so. Wrap some cloth or paper around it and let loose with the electric drill for a few seconds, keeping the 'drill' straight in line with the barrel.  After you get a nice taper, it will have roughly rounded edges. Then the thumb and emery - I-too have used paper when out of emery - to smooth the edges.  Maybe one day, I'll make some pictures and put up a weak rendition of a tutorial on this.  Too bad, with all the bandaids and dry-checks on my finger tips, I'm not very photogenic right now.

Since paper doesn't stretch like cloth, wrap a strip of paper into a funnel, then shove that into the muzzle and run your thumb into it's centre, rotating and turning as before.


downrange

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Re: powder,ball & patch recomendations
« Reply #29 on: March 19, 2009, 05:04:50 AM »
Well, thanks to you guys, my first day at the range with my muzzle loader might be a pleasant experience instead of a frustrating one spent wondering what went wrong. I am now anxiously awaiting the arrival of the Santa Claus in the brown suit (UPS). I have been perusing the recommended web sites plus a few others. There are a lot of toys out there! Thanks again! (As the Terminator said, I'll be back).  

Offline Dphariss

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Re: powder,ball & patch recomendations
« Reply #30 on: March 20, 2009, 05:24:05 PM »
I am a lifelong shooter & hunter, but new to black powder. I would appreciate some recommendations, both in general and specifically on loading my rifle. The rifling is one turn in 52"& about .015 deep. It is hard to measure the rifling as there are seven groves. From the top of a land to the bottom of the opposing groove is .462. What size ball & patch and what powder granulation & charge should I start with? Are any of the black powder substitutes suitable for flintlocks, which my rifle is? Thanks in advance for any input.

You will likely find .440-.445 ball and a heavy ticking patch will work. Denim is another patch option.
There are 2 BIG name "replica" powders that are *aggressively corrosive* relative to BP. They contain high levels of potassium perchlorate and the fouling has ruined barrels literally overnight in some cases.
Thus you are better off buying BP  even if you have to have it shipped in rather than using the other stuff.
None of the "replicas" really work with a flinter anyway and priming and booster must be BP.
Patch lubes are often a matter of shooting style and climate.
I don't use water based lubes, some really like them, its a choice. I use Bear, Sperm Whale oil or *pure Neatsfoot oil* (no petroleum additives or "compound) as a patch lube. Sometimes a grease. Any of these mixed 1 part beeswax to 2-3 parts oil by weight will give a soft grease that will work well. I have also used SPG bullet lube. SPG requires wiping between shots but it shoots very well in the one rifle I tried it in when used as a match rifle.

Cleaning bp fouling does not require hot water, tepid to cool/cold is fine. I mix Windex with vinegar to water 1 part to 2-3 water as a solvent. It works very well. I like a little soap to help cut any left over oil/grease. Too much soap makes too much suds.
Corrosive substitutes do need fairly hot water and a lot of it.
Flint guns with no hooked breech are best cleaned by removing the lock and plugging the vent with a round toothpick, unless its very large this should seal it if tapped with a knife handle or such.
Pour in enough solvent to fill the bore 6-10". Put a finger/thumb over the muzzle and up end the rifle 2-3 times to slosh the solvent in the bore. Dump and wet patch 2-3 times then repeat the slosh treatment.
This will wash out the active ingredients in the fouling. Wet patch with 4-5 patches. If it seems dirty with wet patches do the slosh thing again then wet patch 3-4  times they should look pretty clean. Dry patch 2-3 times till fairly dry then pull the toothpick to work air through the bore. When fairly dry shoot some WD-40 in the vent, not a lot, use the little tube with the WD40 can, then shoot some in the muzzle and wipe one time with a dry patch.
Now really hose it with WD-40 and let it drain down till the vent shows WD-40. Then stand muzzle down for an hour or 2 then wipe the bore and oil it with a preservative oil.
Wipe fouling from lock and oil lightly at all bearing points. Just a drop here and there is plenty.
With a hooked breech put the breech in a bucket of tepid water than run a wet patch down the bore and up 5-6 times. Repeat with 2-3 more patches then follow the dry process above.

Sounds pretty labor intensive but having recently spent 3 hours mining carbon and copper from a 223 I bought I can assure you its easier than getting a modern gun clean.
DO NOT  foul the bore with a blank before loading when hunting, this causes misfires.
To dry a bore before going hunting I wash it with denatured alcohol then wipe dry. Load with an oiled or greased patch. This will protect the bore better than the others.

Do not fall for the "we shot a 1000 shots and never cleaned and had no rust" BS in some advertising.
If the gun is kept in low humidity it will not corrode when used with BP. Below 30% relative humidity BP fouling "goes to sleep". So if testing is done in a lab or air conditioned shooting house the gun used with BP made from pure ingredients is unlikely to rust no matter the lube so long as the testers control the atmosphere.

Dan
« Last Edit: March 22, 2009, 04:27:19 PM by Dphariss »
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Offline hanshi

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Re: powder,ball & patch recomendations
« Reply #31 on: March 20, 2009, 07:57:32 PM »
Downrange, the above advice from Dphariss should be down loaded and kept as a reference.  The use of vinegar is new to me and I don't go through the steps the same way but my basic process is the same.  There is plenty of room for coming up with your particular cleaning routine and cleaning materials, oils & such; just be sure to include some form of each step.  I read nothing in his post that I can disagree with.  Good shooting.
!Jozai Senjo! "always present on the battlefield"
Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.