Newbie question regarding Priming horns

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Consensus or no, I use one without shame.

[smylee grouch]

Timalso, there are those that do and those that dont but you will make up your own mind and find whats best for you. As for me, I use a primer because I want to, its just the way I like to do it and I feel I get better results as I can dribble some into the vent before I prime the pan and it seems to me that that helps speed up ignition.

[James Rogers]

Of course anyone can do their own thing these days. I plan to carry a primer in just a few minutes;  )
The question though was did the COLONIALS  use priming horns. There is no real evidence I am aware of at this time to support general use by same in the 18th century.

[Virginiarifleman]

From what i have read and the discussions on this subject. until late 1800's there was but one granulation of powder. best known today as FFG.

not true - just three references to various F grades pre-1800
THE SOUTH CAROLINA GAZETTE
September 25, 1736
Charleston, South Carolina
JUST imported in the King George, Jacob Ayres from London, white and colour'd plains, strip'd duffils, bullets, shot, F FF FFF gunpowder, Saxe Gotha hoop-pett
THE SOUTH CAROLINA GAZETTE
June 11, 1741
Loaf Sugar, Gun Powder in half Barrels FF and FFF, Bullets, Strouds, Indian Trading Guns, Mens and Boys Felt Hats

The Pennsylvania Gazette
January 7, 1752
Imported (chiefly) in the Myrtilla, the last ship from London,
....best London steel, shot, F, FF, and FFF gunpowder....

       i think Chuck just answered the question for us all. thanks Mr. Burrows

[Tim Crosby]

 I wonder what the bullets were for? Some standard gauge caliber? There must have been a lot of the same around.

   Tim C.

[Dewey]

None of Miller's paintings show a priming horn at rendezvous (or on the way there).

I use a small brass powder charger with 4F at the range or hunting for convenience (and so the modern shooters don't freak out), but prime from the horn in any historical re-enactment setting (using 3F).

[Monty59]

over the years I've read a lot about this topic and am of the same opinion as James Rogers. And if you have a good lock that gives you enough sparks  it also ignites fast with the same powder that was use for the main charge.

Monty

[art riser]

http://www.flintriflesmith.com/WritingandResearch/Published/priminghorns_mb.htm

[michaelB.]

hehe  this is one of those questions that when we answer, we end up end to end pointing in all directions. 

[Ky-Flinter]

http://www.flintriflesmith.com/WritingandResearch/Published/priminghorns_mb.htm

LOL.  I posted the same link in this thread 4 months ago!  Still good info.

-Ron

[The Rambling Historian]

If I recall correctly, there are many period sources from before the matchlock and wheellock era that indicate arquebuisers carried separate charges of finer grain powder for priming before the flintlock mechanism was even invented. However, they aren't readily mentioned in colonial era sources suggesting they fell from use, but there is no reason to think that they were universally abandoned. There are War of 1812 era dated priming horns that still survive and others in museum collections purported to be from the French & Indian War and Revolution. The Fort Ticonderoga Museum in a publication from the 1930s stated that American soldiers carried a priming horn and they had one in their collection.

[michaelB.]

... OR go ahead and use one  hehe

[Longshot]

The adage - "Lock and Load" refers to the system used by soldiers with paper cartridges and flintlocks - you primed the lock from the cartridge and then loaded the rest of the cartridge in the barrel.

Chuck-
That phrase has confused me for as long as I can remember.
I am at peace!

[michaelB.]

I guess we can only be so authentic and true to a particular period of time.  Practicality, convenience and safety may ultimately dictate whether you use a priming horn at your shoots.  I use one because it is convenient to prime my SW Virginia flintlock.  It has an L&R Durs Egg lock and using a priming horn gives me a small throw of powder in the pan.  Also, one of the other posters mentioned the aspect of safety regulations in many clubs that prevent one from priming with the main horn.  In the woods while hunting, of course you can prime from your larger horn. I'd say that safety should be your first concern and take it from there.

[Dphariss]

While it is probably the best practice, did colonials always use FFFg priming powder in flintlocks or did they just use what they had in their larger flask?

Separate priming container, horns etc, were used in the Matchlock era. Now were they common in America for FLs? Don't know. I find priming with the main horn to be a PITA and will result in wasted powder and powder grains holding the pan cover out of position etc. But that's just me.
If we look in "Kentucky Rifles and Pistols 1750-1850" you will find a horn and pouch and the pouch contents of David Cooke who was born in 1760 IIRC and died in 1842.  See at http://www.icollector.com/EXCEEDINGLY-RARE-RIFLE-AND-ACCESSORY-COLLECTION-CARRIED-BY-FRONTIERSMAN-DAVID-COOKE_i17332400

Dan

[Dphariss]

None of Miller's paintings show a priming horn at rendezvous (or on the way there).

I use a small brass powder charger with 4F at the range or hunting for convenience (and so the modern shooters don't freak out), but prime from the horn in any historical re-enactment setting (using 3F).

 I used to use a brass primer, for a few years, until a discussion with a friend pointed out that strong metal containers were basically grenades. I went back to a horn.
I carry my primer in the pouch as David Cooke apparently did. So its not going to appear in a picture unless I am using it. A couple of reasons. First off ffff is easier to work into a vent. Priming horn works better for me. Years ago I used to wear one around my neck. OK for squirrel hunting but not so good for low crawling on antelope on the prairie.
Dan

[Dphariss]

Another point and an important one. Paintings, in most cases, are artistic INTERPRETATIONS. They, in most cases, are not photographic evidence.

Dan

[Dphariss]

Consensus or no, I use one without shame.

For several reasons I have always used one.

Dan

[Dphariss]

Cannon Fodder was not a grade of powder.
Cannon fodder is an informal, derogatory term for combatants who are regarded or treated as expendable in the face of enemy fire. The term is generally used in situations where combatants are forced to deliberately fight against hopeless odds (with the foreknowledge that they will suffer extremely high casualties) in an effort to achieve a strategic goal; an example is the trench warfare of World War I. The term may also be used (somewhat pejoratively) to differentiate infantry from other forces (such as artillery, air force or the navy), or to distinguish expendable low-grade or inexperienced combatants from supposedly more valuable veterans.

Infantry types tend to become somewhat cynical. My MOS was 11B. Sometimes referred to as "Eleven Bulletstopper" when I served.
New guys are well explained in a scene from "The Big Red 1" and one in "Band of Brothers".

Dan

[Robby]

While it is probably the best practice, did colonials always use FFFg priming powder in flintlocks or did they just use what they had in their larger flask?

Separate priming container, horns etc, were used in the Matchlock era. Now were they common in America for FLs? Don't know. I find priming with the main horn to be a PITA and will result in wasted powder and powder grains holding the pan cover out of position etc. But that's just me.
If we look in "Kentucky Rifles and Pistols 1750-1850" you will find a horn and pouch and the pouch contents of David Cooke who was born in 1760 IIRC and died in 1842.  See at http://www.icollector.com/EXCEEDINGLY-RARE-RIFLE-AND-ACCESSORY-COLLECTION-CARRIED-BY-FRONTIERSMAN-DAVID-COOKE_i17332400

Dan

That is a very interesting display and write-up. Thanks Dan!
Robby

[JoeG]

The only reference I have found to the use  of priming horns is from Major George Scott, 40th Foot, commander of the Light Infantry and Rangers for the 1758 Louisbourg expedition. He noted that the colonial rangers used a horn ( slung under their right armpit) containing pistol powder to prime their muskets. Stating that it was a quicker and more convenient way of priming their musket ,and the finer grain powder was not subject to misfire.  He recommended that this practice be adopted by Light Infantry Companies in North America for "bush fighting"

He further states that in combat priming from the cartridge and closing the pan can result in half the charge being spilled. The Ranger method of priming from a horn prevented that from happening.

 

[Dan Fruth]

While reading a historic document in the Ohio reading room at the Westerville Ohio public library, I read an account of a hunter getting into trouble near present day Galipolis on the ohio river. He was carrying a "self priming" rifle, and the article went on to describe the touch hole was large enough for the powder in the bore to run into the pan. As a result the pan was closed when loading the main charge. I know this info is not all inclusive but it does show that main charge powder was used for prime, and enough that 'self priming" was common......Dan

[Clark Badgett]

While reading a historic document in the Ohio reading room at the Westerville Ohio public library, I read an account of a hunter getting into trouble near present day Galipolis on the ohio river. He was carrying a "self priming" rifle, and the article went on to describe the touch hole was large enough for the powder in the bore to run into the pan. As a result the pan was closed when loading the main charge. I know this info is not all inclusive but it does show that main charge powder was used for prime, and enough that 'self priming" was common......Dan

Or most likely it got mentioned because it was seen as a curiosity. The mundane often didn't make the news.

[George Sutton]

Julia Auctions just sold what he claimed to be an 18th century bag and horn with a priming horn in the bag.

 When I started shooting these guns in the early 1960's I took fffg and ground small lots of it in a glass bowl using a spoon for a grinder. It was like talcum powder but worked very well.

Centershot