Pipes..make them or buy them ?

[bob in the woods]

I wondered how many builders actually make their own pipes/thimbles rather than buying them ?
I often make my own, but my Chambers kit guns came with ready made pipes. Lately, even after a few years of use, this has started to bother me, so I'm probably going to replace them. My N.E. fowling gun is first on the list, but next up will be the Edward Marshal rifle. These are made from substantial castings, so I 'm also asking whether or not the originals were formed from sheet, or cast ?  I figured someone here would know .
Thanks

[Thom]

Pipes are easy and fun to make. Making their own can boost the confidence of a new builder.

Guess that makes me a "make them".

[Dave B]

It is always nice to see a rifle that has the ram rod pipes made. The mass produced  pipes look it.
You can dress them up but its like putting lipstick on a pig. It will always be a pig just made up. I always enjoyed making ram rod pipes after having watched David Rase do a demonstration years ago at The Carriage House in Corvallis OR. He made it dirt simple to knock them out and make them look good. I was lucky enough to buy a set of his forming tools.

[FALout]

I've made my own and it's not that difficult. But, on my present build I found it easy enough to take some cast pipes and alter them to suit the build.  Lots of them are thick enough to file in what shape you want.  So for me, It doesn't matter.  I'll buy them, use as are, or I'll make them, or alter them, it depends on the build and how much time and effort I what to put into them.

[PPatch]

I like making them, the forming and filing, so yes, I make them. And nose caps, lock plates, front sights; anything I have the materials and homemade jigs for.

dave

For the rear thimble I have one jig made out of oak, a poor choice in wood it turned out. Anyone who has a steel jig they are willing to part with PM me, I would be interested in purchasing one.

[smart dog]

Hi Bob,
I believe almost all 18th century long rifles had thimbles made from sheet brass including the Marshall guns.  Every NE fowler I have seen from that period also has sheet brass thimbles.  There may be exceptions of which I am not aware or misidentify.  That said, my objectives for a gun dictate what hardware I make or buy.  If I am making a gun with a strong historical connection, I make much of the hardware from sheet.  In contrast, I like the robustness of cast thimbles and I use them if I am making a gun that will be used hard and is contemporary in concept.  I even have cast thimbles myself. 

dave 

[thimble rig]

Im making my first set for the rifle im making now.Its kinda fun .The entry one is giving me a little trouble getting the lift of the tail just right but I will get it.

[Acer Saccharum]

If you are making your own pipe, and you have a slim gun in mind, watch how much 'lift' you put in the tail of the entry pipe.It's easy to make too much lift, and then you got yourself a fat grip section.

I like to get the trigger plate in, and run my profile from trigger plate to entry pipe. This tells me how much wood I have to work with. Now I make my pipe to fit the wood, and I can easily control how much 'lift' there is to the tail.

[Mark Elliott]

I have always made my own pipes.   I have made several dies over the years  to make the rear pipes.   The pipes for the E. TN rifles with the extreme lift are the most challenging.   Most of my rear pipes have 1/16" of lift.   That is the way I was taught to make them.  I can punch in more lift in the thumbnail portion of the pipe if needed.

[Tim Crosby]

 Not an answer but may be of some help:


    http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=687.msg6780#msg6780

    http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=15962.msg149742#msg149742

  Tim C.

[rsells]

I make the pipes I use on my rifles, with the exception of the entry pipes used on Hawken rifles I build.  I think it adds to the look of the rifle when I use ones I make.  It is my goal to do as much as possible in my shop on each build.  The end results is well worth the effort put into making them.
                                                                                            Roger Sells

[Curtis]

I used cast pipes - ONCE.  I felt like I was in-letting a Buick in the stock.  I make my own now, it allows you to do things like make graduated thimbles in length and diameter, as well as create the style you need.  Not to difficult to do, and very rewarding.
Also much more pleasant to inlet than the cast ones.  The commercial sheet metal ones usually look, well factory made.

Curtis

[flehto]

I've used both purchased cast RR pipes and mostly make my own, Never used purchased RR pipes made from sheet stock...look too "chintzy".

W/ the Bucks County LRs, don't have an option....must make them....and especially so w/ the entry pipe. The other 2 pipes just follow so they're all similar. The "lift" as it was referred to is .040 which is the sheet thickness

The bottom pic is the form die and forend block for the BC entry pipes...either one piece or 2 soldered together can be made.......Fred

 

[moleeyes36]

I've used both purchased cast RR pipes and mostly make my own, Never used purchased RR pipes made from sheet stock...look too "chintzy".

W/ the Bucks County LRs, don't have an option....must make them....and especially so w/ the entry pipe. The other 2 pipes just follow so they're all similar. The "lift" as it was referred to is .040 which is the sheet thickness

The bottom pic is the form die and forend block for the BC entry pipes...either one piece or 2 soldered together can be made.......Fred

 

Fred,

That's the way Ron Luckenbill showed me how to do it when I visited him about a year and a half ago.  Once I got home and made form die, it was no problem after that.  By the way, I really like the carving and moulding around the entry pipe on your gun.  That really sets things off.

Mole Eyes

[Acer Saccharum]

Commercial pipes are a great place to get started. After a few rifles, builders often want to add more of their own parts, while improving upon their skills.

Lugs, sights, side plates, toe plates, inlays and patchboxes are other areas to segue into.

[Pete G.]

Depends on what style pipe. If a commercially available style will work I usually use it, mainly the Ted Cash pipes with the embossed rings. Those are a good start for hand filing a wedding band type ring on each end. If something different like a longer or shorter pipe is needed I make them; so it boils down to about $8 to buy them or $20 to make them (assuming my time is worth about $0.75/hr.)

[Jerry V Lape]

I now have a computer with 3 D camera which I can link to a 3D printer (which I can't afford) but if the price comes down ---? 

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I built a Chambers Virginia rifle for myself several years ago.  There is lots one can do with the wood to make the rifle your own, and I did personalize my rifle.  But I used the pipes as they came out of the box.  And every time I shoot that rifle, I think, "I've got to do something with those pipes...they just don't do it for me."  And yet there's nothing wrong with them...they just are too generic.  A few minutes with files and polishing materials will make a satisfying difference.

[bob in the woods]

Taylor, you are absolutely right re there is nothing wrong with the pipes as they come with the "kit".
My N E fowling gun is a wonderful ,functional piece. It's just that the pipes stand out as "commercial" [ at least to me ] in contrast to the rest of the gun. No one else has ever noticed, but I do believe I'll be changing them or at least modifying them soon.

[oldtravler61]

Simply I just like makin my own.

[Dennis Glazener]

Speaking of pipes, I just made a set for a Gillespie I am working on, glad they are plain Jane since I may have to make a replacement. I finished them up and silver brazed them yesterday afternoon, inlet them this afternoon and like a dummy I had them both in the inlets while I drilled the pins for the mid one I head the front one fall out of the stock. Thought to myself I will finish drilling this one then pick up the fallen one. That was nearly an hour ago and I still have not found the one that fell out! Its got to be in the shop somewhere around the drill press but so far I have not found it. Could have made a new one by now but I am determined to find the lost one even if I have to sweep/vacuum the entire shop which badly needs it! Pins/fly's I understand not finding but a 1.5" X 3/8" thimble should be easy to find even in my shop!
Dennis
Ah-ha, Found it in the bottom of a small glass jar containing cutting oil that was sitting on the stand of my drill press! It had dropped off the stock and straight into the jar but I couldn't see it because of the dark cutting oil! Oh well I did get that corner of my shop cleaned up looking for it.

[WKevinD]

I think if i really cleaned the nooks n crannies and dark corners of my shop I could build a rifle from the lost parts.

I try to make my pipes when appropriate.

[bob in the woods]

I'm in the process of making another  front sight, "cause the first one fell off the bench and is now part of the floor debris. Looked for over 1/2 hour....but those things bounce, ya know !     I sometimes will lay a cloth under my vise to catch these things, but not today 

[WadePatton]

I think if i really cleaned the nooks n crannies and dark corners of my shop I could build a rifle from the lost parts.

I try to make my pipes when appropriate.

I'm in the process of making another  front sight, "cause the first one fell off the bench and is now part of the floor debris. Looked for over 1/2 hour....but those things bounce, ya know !     I sometimes will lay a cloth under my vise to catch these things, but not today 

I should build a dustpan with a sifter to help alleviate this sort of situation. 

[retired fella]

Sights are easy, try losing a lock fly.  That'll test your patience as well as your eyesight.