Late period Canadian Flintlock

[Twobucks]

Hello all - I'm new to the forum, although I've read quite a number of threads here over the past few years. I hope I'm posting to the appropriate section.

I'm looking for information on the kind of longrifle that a farmer might have had in Upper/Lower Canada (Ontario/Quebec) in the 1820's or 30's.

I have an R Ashmore (NOT marked "warranted") flintlock that has come down through my family. Unfortunately the lock is all that survives. I'm in the process of reconditioning it and eventually building a functional gun around it. The best I can sort through internet research and showing it to a few people in the know it is a cheaper "hardware store" lock made around 1820. The family were Scottish farmers and loggers. We'll never know exactly what it was attached to, but I'd like to make something period and location appropriate.

Any thoughts or links would be greatly appreciated. Thanks all in advance!

[Mike Brooks]

Probably the most common farmer gun in that period would be a  cheapish  flintlock British fowling gun in either 1/2 or full stock. Probably about 20 bore.

[greybeard]

Barnes & Noble have the book   Canadian gunsmiths   1680-1900.
About $20.00.
        Bob

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

That book is in our library Bob.  It's interesting.  It doesn't have much information about what guns looked like - just lists of 'smiths and where they were based.  It's been several years since I perused it, but it seems to me the last gunsmith making muzzle loading firearms was based in Victoria BC. around the turn of the twentieth century.  During the middle of the century, there were lots in Upper and Lower Canada.  The guns they made emulated styles from England and especially the Northern States.  Many rifles from Ontario could easily be taken for guns from the North Eastern States.

[ddoyle]

If he was a disbanded soldier he would have a Bess on his mantle. Firearms of the Fur trade would give you a good glimpse of   rifles/muskets were icommercially available as imports and in wide spread use. Krieghoff's paintings give a glimpse of what was carried in 'lower Canada' at the time. You can ID alot of the guns from the paintings in the fur trade book and have exc pics to work from. Also  Call the Royal Ontario Museum and talk to them  lots of our museum have guns that are just stacked and no one shows interest. Get the right curator and you might learn something no one else knows.

call Mr Clarke in Ontario (search clarke- flintlocks- airplane props) He usually has time to chat and would be the guy to talk to.

If this is your first build leave that lock well enough alone for now (mount it in a deep frame on the wall) and build with a lock from Jim Chambers that suits the gun you decide to build. In my limited experience the first one is not the one to use heirloom pieces on. But then again I am a slow learner and a butcher your milage may vary. Plus you never know a barrel and stock might just show up a cousin's house some xmas.

[ddoyle]

Where did they live? The quality of their land size of their grants would have a big bearing on what cash was available for arms.  I doubt an indentured scot working the winter in the bush and the summer on tending rocks would have any gun but an ex officer disbanded after 30 years service would have some nice toys. An Orkney kid might have a trade gun........ I think you need to start with figuring exactly who they were and how they lived.

To get an idea of what was in peoples house (maybe even the exact house) you need to look at the survey/census records that the crown conducted back then (just in case we needed to lay a whooping on the republicans again ). A guy went around and took notes on arms/stores/improvements/children etc. (and political disposition). pretty detailed stuff. bore size /country of origin/condition.

you 'd be surprised how many homes/farms had NO arms in them. I found the surveys for my ancestors via the N.B archives. I am sure Ontario would have em.

[Mike Brooks]

Where did they live? The quality of their land size of their grants would have a big bearing on what cash was available for arms.  I doubt an indentured scot working the winter in the bush and the summer on tending rocks would have any gun but an ex officer disbanded after 30 years service would have some nice toys. An Orkney kid might have a trade gun........ I think you need to start with figuring exactly who they were and how they lived.

To get an idea of what was in peoples house (maybe even the exact house) you need to look at the survey/census records that the crown conducted back then (just in case we needed to lay a whooping on the republicans again ). A guy went around and took notes on arms/stores/improvements/children etc. (and political disposition). pretty detailed stuff. bore size /country of origin/condition.
you 'd be surprised how many homes/farms had NO arms in them. I found the surveys for my ancestors via the N.B archives. I am sure Ontario would have em.

Or at least those that CLAIMED to have no guns.....

[Dave Marsh]

Zactley.

Dave

[ddoyle]

Could of been that there was some reason to fib about it but Obama was not in power and everyone concerned wanted them to have guns. More the better as far as the crown was concerned. (as long as you were'nt some form of Catholic LOL)
I just think that it was a matter of what do you buy a new set of horse shoes, a saw or some other necessity or a gun that might or might not have a use. By 1830 alot of Canada was not exactly frontier. Pigs are killed with a knife and turnips seldom run.

[bob in the woods]

1820's isn't all that long after the war of 1812.  I live north of Kingston,Ontario and opted for a Chambers officer's fusil
[English ]  . It has a cherry stock and is in 20 bore.  I don't personally believe that there were that many "Bess's " in the farmer's hands since the firelock remained the property of the King. Perhaps an older style Bess [surplus ??]
I'd stick with a plain but decent quality fowling gun.  A lot of us "loyalists " , including a whole lot of Scots ] ended up with acreages of woods and rocks. It was a tough life trying to farm and keep body and soul together. This is Canadian shield country, and it's still pretty wild. Coyotes and wolves , raccoons, fishers, owls,bears...it seems that everything wants to snack on what I'm trying to raise. I can't imagine a rural fellow not owning some king of gun.  And, there were gunsmiths in just about all the towns around this entire area. No need for gunsmiths if there aren't any guns.

[ddoyle]

Bob, Many Regiments that were disbanded in North America were left with thier arms with the idea of being a militia. As you say American invasion was still considered a potential issue and that is why the surveys/census were conducted. 

Your right about rock and woods LOL. My ancestors under Hammond were originally given some of that shield land and were smart enough to say F*** that and went back to N.B where they had been previously stationed and knew of a redoubt of acadians still on good land....... dark nights with the bayonet............  New grants, deep soil, access to the sea.

I know exactly where one of the bess's from this period resides. Still owned by the same family on the same land. Though it bears a hatchet mark and no cock from a spitey mounty dewatting it cause he could not "register it" no stickers that day?