Author Topic: Loading and Shooting Smoothbores (Read 10995 times)

One Shot · « **on:** January 30, 2016, 10:07:01 AM »

I recently acquired a Curly Gortomski Trade Gun in a .62/20 with a 41 1/4" barrel.
Its been awhile since I last owned a smoothbore (other than a ML shotgun) and have been searching for some meaningful articles on loading and shooting smoothbores. There seems to be alack of information out there or I just cant find them. Does any one have any good info or a link to some? I do have knowledge and experience of some of the different loading preferences but just looking for more information.

Thank you

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #1 on:** January 30, 2016, 03:27:38 PM »

Powder, patched ball, in that order.....

Seriously, not really much different than loading a rifle for round ball.

crankshaft · « **Reply #2 on:** January 30, 2016, 04:07:40 PM »

http://home.insightbb.com/~bspen/

http://home.insightbb.com/~bspen/starr.html

SCLoyalist · « **Reply #3 on:** January 30, 2016, 04:42:19 PM »

http://home.insightbb.com/~bspen/SmoothboreLoads.html

and, Eric Bye's book on Flintlocks has a chapter devoted to smoothies.

Dewey · « **Reply #4 on:** January 30, 2016, 11:56:12 PM »

I have found for my NSW Chief's gun using an unpatched ball that 0.610 shoots better than a 0.600 size one.

But each gun has it's own likes.

Brokennock · « **Reply #5 on:** January 31, 2016, 06:59:30 AM »

Yup, definitely use the link above for Bob's Black Powder Notebook, lot's of good info there, and Bob is a heck of a great guy, very helpful with a great source/system of documentation.

I have two smoothies, both 20 gauge. My Tule Fusil de Chase has a bore measuring .618 and it shoots .600 ball patched with .010 patches very well, it was the best combo I tested, and is fairly easy to load. My Early Virginia Smooth Rifle has a bore that measures .615 and the afore mentioned patch and ball combo is very hard to load and doesn't group too well, with any powder charge tried. A .600 ball sitting on a lubed 1/4" felt wad groups better, and a .615 ball sitting on the same wad over two thin cards separating the wad from 85 grains of 3f shoots best.
Point being, read what Bob and others suggest, but each gun has it's own appetite and it will take some experimenting on your part to find its optimum diet.

Hungry Horse · « **Reply #6 on:** January 31, 2016, 10:52:47 AM »

I shoot my 20 gauge Curly trade gun with a bare ball dropped on top of Greased blanket wad held in with an overshot card. The ball is .595, tumbled until it has dimples all over it. This combo shoots better for me than any patched ball I ever used.

Hungry Horse

Curt Lyles · « **Reply #7 on:** January 31, 2016, 03:18:04 PM »

How much lead is left on the barrel walls after shootin bare balls in a smoothbore .It seems like they would be a pain to clean up after wards. Just curious, Curt

Hungry Horse · « **Reply #8 on:** January 31, 2016, 06:57:58 PM »

I find no lead deposits inside the barrel. There will be a lot of powder residue, but you aren't trying to force a patched ball down the bore, so it's not an issue. I usually dip the freshly cast balls in a tallow mixture to give them a light coating, that helps with the fowlings soft.

Hungry Horse

Brokennock · « **Reply #9 on:** February 01, 2016, 08:53:01 AM »

No leading issues. The wadding cups around the bottom of the ball keeping it centered in the bore.

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #10 on:** February 01, 2016, 03:20:51 PM »

I had a 20 bore I shot bare balled with all the time. Lots of lead. Didn't make much difference if you shot bare ball all the time though. I loaded noting but powder then dropped the ball down. 60gr 2ff and a .600 RB.

crankshaft · « **Reply #11 on:** February 02, 2016, 08:34:17 PM »

Quote from: Mike Brooks on February 01, 2016, 03:20:51 PM

I had a 20 bore I shot bare balled with all the time. Lots of lead. Didn't make much difference if you shot bare ball all the time though. I loaded noting but powder then dropped the ball down. 60gr 2ff and a .600 RB.

Okay...but could you hit anything ? ?

hanshi · « **Reply #12 on:** February 02, 2016, 09:33:06 PM »

Many smoothbores seem to shoot as well or maybe better with a slightly looser patched ball combo than one might use in a rifle. I like WW for casting ball and while a lead one drops out at .600" precisely, a WW one is more like .606". A ball cast .590" in my Tanner mold shoots pretty darn good with a .024" patch. The lead .600" ball can't take a patch much thicker than .010". My favorite is the .606" WW ball over a felt or fiber wad and 2 card wads over the powder and, of course, a card wad to keep the ball from slipping out. The bare ball WW load doesn't even dream about straying off a small paper plate at 50 yards. The others usually do a bit better having carved out 5 & 8 shot groups of well under 3" at 50yds. Experiment! IMHO smoothbores can be more finicky than rifles.

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #13 on:** February 02, 2016, 11:27:57 PM »

Quote from: crankshaft on February 02, 2016, 08:34:17 PM

Quote from: Mike Brooks on February 01, 2016, 03:20:51 PM
I had a 20 bore I shot bare balled with all the time. Lots of lead. Didn't make much difference if you shot bare ball all the time though. I loaded noting but powder then dropped the ball down. 60gr 2ff and a .600 RB.

Okay...but could you hit anything ? ?

It shot very well, that is why I settled on that load, it wouldn't shoot anything else. I killed alot of deer with that gun and won alot of smooth bore matches with that gun.

Dewey · « **Reply #14 on:** February 03, 2016, 04:41:01 PM »

Quote from: Mike Brooks on February 01, 2016, 03:20:51 PM

I had a 20 bore I shot bare balled with all the time. Lots of lead. Didn't make much difference if you shot bare ball all the time though. I loaded noting but powder then dropped the ball down. 60gr 2ff and a .600 RB.

How did you keep the ball from rolling back down the barrel when shooting

I use two felt wads over the powder and one to keep the ball or shot seated on the powder.

Been thinking of trying cut paper instead of the felt wads - has anyone tried this method ?

I would be hoping to improve my shot pattern by doing that.

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #15 on:** February 03, 2016, 07:54:32 PM »

Quote

How did you keep the ball from rolling back down the barrel when shooting Huh

By fouling the barrel and holding it with the muzzle elevated while carrying. Never had trouble with the ball rolling after the bore was fouled.

michaelB. · « **Reply #16 on:** February 04, 2016, 05:06:03 PM »

*I is busy making notes for when my Chief's Grade Trade Gun is finished*. I spoke with John at TOW about this yesterday and he suggested that just a thin card over the powder and a second thin card over the ball works well too. He also said that a lot of folks just use a thinner greased patch (powder, patch and ball) and this works good too. Guess I'll find out what the new gun likes when I get it.

Daryl · « **Reply #17 on:** February 04, 2016, 07:36:17 PM »

Quote from: crankshaft on February 02, 2016, 08:34:17 PM

Okay...but could you hit anything ? ?

I expect it hit "something" out in front of it, every time it was fired.

thimble rig · « **Reply #18 on:** February 06, 2016, 04:52:07 PM »

look up duelist 1954 on u tube he has videos on shooting smooth bores on there.There pretty good to watch u can learn smotheing by watching.

Daryl · « **Reply #19 on:** February 06, 2016, 10:23:22 PM »

Found this one interesting, bit slowwwwww monolog talking, but interesting facts - about chewed balls. He used a pair of rasps, same as I did in the 1980's to increase the size of my home made "minnie balls" for my 14 bore. It works, just never thought of doing it to increase the size of the round balls for bare ball shooting in a smoothbore -

About .5 he gets into some of the meat of the load, then about 1.35 or so, finally gets to the increasing the ball's size due to the divots or 'chews' - to prevent the ball from bouncing down the bore.
This gives justification to the use of a patch that only 'just' holds the ball in the bore of a smoothbore.

Ray-Vigo · « **Reply #20 on:** February 08, 2016, 01:23:21 AM »

They all seem different to me. I have a 12 gauge that shoots a .690 ball and a thick patch pretty well. That's a pretty undersized ball, but with a thick patch, the accuracy is nice. I have a 20 gauge that likes a little tighter fit.

To me, the biggest handicap compared to a regular rifle is the lack of rear sight. Even if you have a friendly tang screw as your "rear sights", it's still harder than with a regular rear. A "smooth rifle" with regular sights might be a good compromise for that, but I do like the extra element added by shooting front-only or front plus screw.

bob in the woods · « **Reply #21 on:** February 08, 2016, 02:07:38 AM »

The front sight only issue is the reason that I believe proper fit is essential to a smoothbore. I didn't put the finish on mine until it was extremely comfortable and came up to my eye with little effort. At my hunting distances of 50 yds or so for deer I have no trouble at all hitting what I shoot at.

Daryl · « **Reply #22 on:** February 08, 2016, 07:38:56 AM »

I cannot imagine shooting without a patch in a smoothbore. The filth is what I am talking about. On our local shoots, we go through up to 100 shots in a few hours of shooting the trail. I cannot imagine shooting bare balls and getting even 50 shots without having to clean the fouling out - not for me. Be OK for hunting though (bare ball and card wads), if it proved just as accurate or more accurate than patched ball. Hard to visualize that, though.

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #23 on:** February 08, 2016, 03:39:36 PM »

Quote from: Daryl on February 08, 2016, 07:38:56 AM

I cannot imagine shooting without a patch in a smoothbore. The filth is what I am talking about. On our local shoots, we go through up to 100 shots in a few hours of shooting the trail. I cannot imagine shooting bare balls and getting even 50 shots without having to clean the fouling out - not for me. Be OK for hunting though (bare ball and card wads), if it proved just as accurate or more accurate than patched ball. Hard to visualize that, though.

I could get 50-70 shots out of mine before it started to get hard to load, depending on humidity. On a hot humid day in the Mississippi river valley I could sometimes go all day and then some, same with rainy days. Otherwise when it got hard to load I'd pour some water in the barrel and slosh it around then pour it out and patch untill the bore was dry. Didn't have to patch untill it was clean. I shot that gun almost exclusively for 8 years in rifle and smooth bore matches. In fact I tied the national record at Friendship in their flintlock feather duster match with that gun.

bob in the woods · « **Reply #24 on:** February 08, 2016, 04:38:37 PM »

I haven't shot patched balls in my smoothbores for a very long time. Paper cartridges have been far more accurate for me, and more convenient too.

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Author Topic: Loading and Shooting Smoothbores (Read 10995 times)

michaelB.

thimble rig

Ray-Vigo