Author Topic: engraving ball vise? (Read 16243 times)

Mark Elliott · « **on:** February 17, 2016, 03:58:39 AM »

I have been working on my engraving and my current vise arrangement on my gun stocking bench just isn't working for me. I need something that rotates the work on axis. I was considering purchasing a ball vise to use on my work table. How many use a ball vise, and how does it work for chasing with a hammer? I already remove most everything from the gun and embed in epoxy to engrave it, so, a separate vise arrangement should work for me. I just need the right one for me. However, I really don't want to build a fixed vise just for engraving. I don't do it that often.

dogcatcher · « **Reply #1 on:** February 17, 2016, 04:14:28 AM »

A $5 bowling ball at the Goodwill store, whack off a flat spot and mount a drill press vise on it. Search Google for "bowling ball engraving vise" or "bowling ball craving vise", click on images and you have a bundle of ideas to look at.

It sets good on a 4" PVC floor flange or the tire off of a lawnmower. A little large for small hands to twist like an engravers ball vise, but works for me. I use a PVC flange, but when I want to make it harder to turn I sit a computer mouse pad on the PVC.

P.Bigham · « **Reply #2 on:** February 17, 2016, 04:16:44 AM »

Mark I really like mine. I work full time and do this on the side. It just makes it easier.

P.W.Berkuta · « **Reply #3 on:** February 17, 2016, 04:28:21 AM »

Make one using a trailer hitch ball and a small vise -- look on Youtube. They show some for woodworking also which can be adapted to fit your needs.

JTR · « **Reply #4 on:** February 17, 2016, 06:05:19 AM »

Next to a good sharpening system, a ball vise is probably the biggest help and time saver.

Spend the bucks and buy a good one, and you'll be money and time ahead in the long run.

John

bama · « **Reply #5 on:** February 17, 2016, 06:27:53 AM »

Mark a ball vice and a good turn table are a must for me. I have a GRS ball vice and turn table, the GRS turntable has a locking screw so that you can set how freely the table turns. Good engraving equipment is not cheap but if you want to do first rate work it is worth every penny.

davec2 · « **Reply #6 on:** February 17, 2016, 06:43:07 AM »

I have a GRS vise and turntable as well. I highly recommend them. Worth the money to me as I was interested in engraving and not building engraving equipment. I wii say, however, that a friend of mine jet bought a vise very much equivalent to my GRS vise from someplace on Alibaba. Not quite the quality of the GRS vise, but half the price including shipping from the far side of the world. To use a hammer and chisel, I would get a vise on the larger side.

http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=100004537&SearchText=engraving+ball+vise

jerrywh · « **Reply #7 on:** February 17, 2016, 06:44:29 AM »

I'm with Bama on this but you don't need a vise that turns just set it on a turntable. It's too bad they don't make a ball vise that doesn't spin. I hardly ever spin my ball vise. I just spin the turn table.

smart dog · « **Reply #8 on:** February 17, 2016, 02:49:22 PM »

Hi Mark,
This was my old set up. It was cheap and all I could afford at the time after purchasing a Lindsay Airgraver. It worked for hammer and chisel work as well. The pipe is capped and I threaded a large machine screw through the cap. The tip of the screw was sharpened and hardened to act as a pivot on the block of wood on the floor. The turn table was plywood with a marble round glued to the wood. The marble is heavy and provides some resistance to movement useful when using hammer and chisel. It also had a locking screw. The vise was a sturdier Lee Valley knock off of the Panavise with a suction base that stuck to the marble. It held very well although I had to reapply the suction every once in a while. I could set the tilt on the vise and spin the turn table. Eventually, I purchased a large GRS ball vice that now sits on top of the turn table. I prefer the ball vise because I can adjust the tilt smoothly as I am cutting. I prefer to stand while I work but you could devise a similar set up for working while sitting.

dave

Captchee · « **Reply #9 on:** February 17, 2016, 03:51:58 PM »

I like a larger vice then the commercially available ball vices so I made a bowling ball vice . Mine , the top spins . For a stand I used the shock from an office chair . Welded it to an old brake drum . So not only is my stand capable of spinning but it also is easily adjustable up and down . these photos were taken while building the stand . i had yet to cut the top of the stand so that it doesnt stick out from under the wood top .

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #10 on:** February 17, 2016, 03:55:53 PM »

The rotating vise will be pain if both hands are busy with the hammer and chisel. Make sure you get one that can be locked.

There is a potters wheel arrangement where the vise can be turned by foot, leaving both hands free for engraving. Neil Hartliep used something like this, and Larry Parker had a set of plans.

Captchee · « **Reply #11 on:** February 17, 2016, 04:00:51 PM »

Acer is right . your going to want something that can be locked up so as not to turn .building a lock up isnt that hard to do . a simple down bolt or even a wedge type set up works well

Mark Elliott · « **Reply #12 on:** February 17, 2016, 04:20:58 PM »

Thanks for all the input. I am looking at the GRS vise. Is the standard big enough for gun work or should I go up to the Magnavise?

Ron Scott · « **Reply #13 on:** February 17, 2016, 06:02:01 PM »

Mark, I mount my European Style Butt Plates to fixtures while engraving. A large ball really helps balance a bigger project. Same if you plan to hold a barrel while engraving. For those reasons a heavier, larger platform is preferable for the type of work I do.

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #14 on:** February 17, 2016, 06:18:16 PM »

Size of vise is totally dependent on the size of work you are doing and how much force you will be applying to the the workpiece.

Bigger is better. Especially if you are hammering.

I have a Ray LeTourneau vise, which I think must be 50 lbs. It's a 6" diam ball. The vise has a lock to prevent/allow rotation. I think it was around $700. If I need it to be stationary, I put it in a rubber ring. If I need it change attitude, I put it in a plastic ring.

Jerry H has a vise on a freestanding post which is very nice to get around. If it's low enough, you could roll around the work on a chair.

I gave my bowling ball away, ad sometimes I wish I still had it for buttplates and big stuff. $:-\$

Hungry Horse · « **Reply #15 on:** February 17, 2016, 06:20:31 PM »

I gave an old potters kick wheel away, because I couldn't think of a good use for it. You guessed it, the guy I gave it to mounted a bowling ball, and a vice on it. And has the best engraving station I've seen. By rotating the caste concrete flywheel, with his feet, he cuts the smoothest scrolls I've seen. He does fine engraving in about half the time of more traditional engravers.

Hungry Horse

dogcatcher · « **Reply #16 on:** February 17, 2016, 09:50:32 PM »

For just rotation, you can buy a wood lathe live center with 1-8TPI chuck threads.
https://www.pennstateind.com/store/LTCA18.html

Mount it wherever you want, add a lathe face plate to it for a table top. Or you can mount a variety of wood lathe chucks on it. Or make it real fancy and build a stand, using 1.25 and 1.5 pipe to adjust the height. In the top you could weld a #2MT plain socket in the 1.25 pipe to hold the MT on the live center. A foot brake could also be rigged to stop the rotation.

jerrywh · « **Reply #17 on:** February 17, 2016, 10:02:32 PM »

Go with the biggest vise you can get. Even the magna vise is smaller than I like. Weight is a primary factor. The heavier the vise the less effort it takes to cut the metal because more of the force is concentrated on the cutter. Also you will have a lot less broken graver trouble with a big heavy vise.
My vise weighs over 40 pounds. GRS is top of the line. You will not regret getting a GRS.

Mark Elliott · « **Reply #18 on:** February 17, 2016, 10:04:57 PM »

I think I am going to go with a GRS Magnavise and see how that goes. I can add a stand and turntable later if need be.

I see by the pictures that a good number of you have Lindsay Airgravers. I guess that I need to start thinking about one of those, but I think I will work on my setup and sharpening first. I am still working those things out. Seeing is still my biggest problem. Moving or moving around the work is the next biggest problem.

I have three handles I made for 1/8" and 3/32" graver/tool bits. I am only grinding the 3/32" now and use the Lindsay M42 bits. I am assuming that it should be relatively easy to move to the Airgraver when the time comes?

Chris Treichel · « **Reply #19 on:** February 17, 2016, 10:33:36 PM »

I use the Japanese version of this which is a pitch bowl mounted in a rope donut. Advantage is that you can mount almost any shape without marring it. Work both sides with the other side completely protected. Bowl has about 30lb of lead in the bottom with a mix of pitch, plaster of paris and charcoal on top. Looks like this

JTR · « **Reply #20 on:** February 17, 2016, 11:11:22 PM »

Mark, I have the GRS Positioning vise. I don't use the positioning feature unless I'm using a microscope, but the vise is very stable as it weighs 42 pounds. I see it's also gone up in price since I bought mine 15 years ago! When considering the price of the vise, I'd suggest considering the cost of the work holding sets they sell as well. The pins and gadgets come in handy when holding unusual shapes.

As for powered engravers, either the Lindsay or GRS work well. I used a GRS Gravermeister for 10 yeas or so, after saying good bye to the hammer and hand graver. Recently, more or less, I bought a Lindsay palm control from one of the guys here, and absolutely love that tool!
Each have advantages over the other and each take a bit of practice to get the hang of using them. And for me, both a light years ahead of hammer and tool.

Try them if you can. Both companies make foot control models and hand control models. GRS has the self contained Gravermeister that doesn't require an air compressor.

John
Check you PM's

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #21 on:** February 18, 2016, 05:59:02 AM »

Mark, you say you won't be doing this a lot, I can't recommend buying a big ball vise. The ball vise is great for engraving with one hand and turning the vise with the other.

With hammer and chisel, you will need to walk around your work, or stop and turn it. The ball vise isn't going to help you with hammer and chisel, other than to act as a vise that pivots.

Chris Treichels' pitch bowl would work great. A bowling ball with a wooden platform you can screw a machinist vise to would work great.

Or a machinist vise with a swivel base mounted on a bench corner. It doesn't tip, but it works pretty well for me for hammer and chisel.

Mark Elliott · « **Reply #22 on:** February 25, 2016, 04:30:31 AM »

I received my GRS Magnavise today. It makes things considerably easier for me. On my worktable, it is just the right height to see what I am doing, and I can rotate my work instead of my body.

jerrywh · « **Reply #23 on:** February 25, 2016, 05:04:46 AM »

Good for you Mark. If you need any tips just email me. I will be glad to help out.

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #24 on:** February 25, 2016, 05:44:41 AM »

wonderful ALR, it is.

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Author Topic: engraving ball vise? (Read 16243 times)