AquaFortis and Potassium Permamganate stain

[Dennis Glazener]

I copied the statement below from a post by JoeG regards to GRRW ( read it here http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=34088.0 )

I worked there in 1975-76 and at that time GRRW was making all their own barrels and had stopped using chromic acid to stain their guns because of the green color. Stocks were stained using AF with a coat of Potassium Permanganate. Also Don McKee had left GRRW before I started working there and was living in Alaska in 1977.
   

What stuck out was the use of AquaFortis and Potassium Permamganate stain. I have often thought about trying Potassium Permamganate on a stock but never did follow through. Has anyone here had any experience with it? Especially long term?
Dennis

[James Rogers]

Dennis,
I have not used it with nitric but have used it alone. Once on a maple rifle and once on a maple walking stick. Color fades fast. The walking stick was subjected to sunlight and had gone a light blond within a year.
I used it on a pine camp chair years ago and it took on a rich chocolate brown color but was muddy looking. The color fastness held much better on the soft wood.

[flehto]

Used potassium permanganate on my first LR and it was fairly dark when the finish was applied and now, 36 yrs later, it's a light brown,  w/ a touch of light green in some areas. Used it on only this one LR and then switched to LMF stains.....Fred

[louieparker]

Dennis I used this years ago. Got a very good color.  Problem, the color faded. LP

[FALout]

It will fade and it doesn't go very deep.

[rich pierce]

On top of AQF potassium permanganate deepens the color and gives an almost purplish hue when applied full strength.


The center panels were stained like the ones on the right with AQF, then washed with potassium permanganate.

[smart dog]

Hi Dennis,
The first 2 rifles I made were stained with nitric acid and then potassium permanganate.  The brownish color from the K perm was good initially but it changed over over time.  The reddish undertone from the nitric acid never changed color. With respect to maple, I really don't understand why anyone would not simply use ferric nitrate and water.  In my opinion, everything else is just a waste of time and effort except if you want to supplement the ferric nitrate stain with something like aniline dyes.

dave

[JoeG]

I start staining with AF and then apply heat. The potassium is applied after the AF. I use about two coats  letting the stock dry between coats. It goes on purple and dries dark brown - black .Then I rub it back with 0000 steel wool and linseed oil.  
the resulting finish has a reddish under base and the potassium really darkens any stripe in the wood.

I stain all my maple gun stocks this way and have never had any problem with it lightening over time.
I carry a rifle I built in 1976 and it never lightened.

I mix the potassium 3 parts water to 1 part potassium crystals

I use straight potassium permanganate on hawk handles and antler.

I once put multiple coats of it on a walnut pistol stock and came out looking like ebony,
never lightened

The combination of AF & potassium permanganate along with a mixture of BLO and beeswax has always worked well for me and has been my main finish on about 100 guns.

[L. Akers]

I used KMN03 for awhile back in the 70s.  Quit using it because it fades badly.  After 2-3 years the stocks had no color left.

[JoeG]

were you using KMN03 straight or with AF?  What did you use for a final finish over it?

[smart dog]

I start staining with AF and then apply heat. The potassium is applied after the AF. I use about two coats  letting the stock dry between coats. It goes on purple and dries dark brown - black .Then I rub it back with 0000 steel wool and linseed oil.  
the resulting finish has a reddish under base and the potassium really darkens any stripe in the wood.

I stain all my maple gun stocks this way and have never had any problem with it lightening over time.
I carry a rifle I built in 1976 and it never lightened.

I mix the potassium 3 parts water to 1 part potassium crystals

I use straight potassium permanganate on hawk handles and antler.

I once put multiple coats of it on a walnut pistol stock and came out looking like ebony,
never lightened

The combination of AF & potassium permanganate along with a mixture of BLO and beeswax has always worked well for me and has been my main finish on about 100 guns.

Great Joe!!  So let us see some of your work.  It might be very helpful.

dave

[JoeG]

this one was built in 1986
the lightened area was rubbed out to fake wear





this is potassium on walnut built in 1980



I will have to take some pictures of a couple others tomorrow that have more red in them

[Keithbatt]

If someone is interested in experimentation, I can investigate shipping potassium permanganate. I'd offer free materials for actual shipping costs, or you can pick up from me locally in the Bay Area of California.  I have a lot of permanganate. I think I have nearly 100 pounds.  I'm not sure about its hazmat status for shipping: it is a strong oxidizer.

[Mike Brooks]

You can buy PP at lowes or Menards pretty cheap.   I have seen it used on walnut to good effect. Never tried it myself.

[Daryl]

When I was a elementary school kid, I had many potassium permangenate baths due to the poison ivy that seemed to grow just about everywhere I played.  I didn't know there was any other use for it.   

[eddillon]

My elk gun that I built in 1976.  Home made aqua fortis.  50% distilled water, 50% HNO3.  Untreated steel wool until the mixture would not dissolve any more steel wool..  Heat, neutralize,  Coat with a mixture of potassium permanganate and water.
2.5 Tbsp permanganate crystals, i cup distilled water.  Lots of Boiled Linseed oil.

  

[Dennis Glazener]

Daryl,
What color did it turn you and how was the staying power
Dennis

When I was a elementary school kid, I had many potassium permangenate baths due to the poison ivy that seemed to grow just about everywhere I played.  I didn't know there was any other use for it.   

[Daryl]

BROWN!  DEEP BROWN after the initial purple! LOL As I remember it took a long time to wear off, but did dry up the blisters & relieve the itching.

[John Archer]

It's a sure cure for athlete's foot when all else fails as well.

John.

[WadePatton]

My knowledge of Kperm has developed exponentially over the last few minutes.

thanks guys!

I think I'll get a little (appears to have many applications and I like multi-ap products and tools).