brass furniture

[Bob Rearley]

Gentlemen,
Is it considered poor workmanship to have pits remaining on furniture?  I am not sure I can remove them all and still have a part left.
Bob

[Ed Wenger]

Bob,

I think it kind of depends on how big the "pits" are....  You should be able to get the little ones out with filing and sanding, although I confess, I typically don't sweat little ones, as long as there aren't tons of them. 

If you have something bigger, like a casting flaw, you can fill them with brass colored solder, such as used to repair brass music instruments.  Do a search here, and you should get some good info on various techniques.


        Ed

[JCKelly]

Or buy your hardware from Reeves Goehring in the first place.

[Bob Rearley]

The pits are small.  I just received some parts from Reeves for another project.  Looking forward to working that yellow brass.  Thanks guys

[54ball]

 Pits in castings, knots and wormholes in wood, there just there and add character. You work with them the best you can just like they did 200 years ago.

[bob in the woods]

That's one of the reasons that I prefer sand castings over the wax cast stuff.
They just look "right" to me, and small imperfections are part of that .  If the imperfections are too large , they can be filled

[Pete G.]

I agree with Bob. I too prefer sand castings, primarily because they often do have the small pits.
Remember that we are replicating hand made items, not perfectly machine produced interchangeable parts.

[bama]

I have seen some originals with some pretty big casting flaws that were just left by the builder. I am not saying that we should not try to use the best materials we can get but at the same time I don't think a few voids should deter the build or be fretted over. I agree that some even add to the overall look that we are trying so hard to achive. In my opinion our work today can be a little on the sterile side or to perfect. 

Jim

[T*O*F]

I suppose you realize that you can move metal around with a polished, round-tipped punch and fill the pits with existing material.  Then burnish the repair and it will disappear.

[jerrywh]

I agree with Bob. I too prefer sand castings, primarily because they often do have the small pits.
Remember that we are replicating hand made items, not perfectly machine produced interchangeable parts.

 Hand made items should be better than machine made parts not worse. Bad workmanship from the past does not justify bad workmanship now. I would personally prefer to keep getting better not worse or equal.  Mediocrity is never remembered. It is very easy to lean how to do metal inlays. You can put small brass inlays in those parts with nothing more than a dremel and a hammer and punch.
  What's the point in having a forum like this if you don't learn to fix things??

[54ball]

 I'm not an experienced builder and I'll not claim to be.

 More than half my life has revolved around something longrifle though. I don't think anybody has on this thread advocated poor workmanship. My opinion, quite the opposite is true.

 It's common sense. If it's something you can work with...looks good it's OK. If it looks like Swiss cheese or has the remains of the casters cat embedded in the brass, maybea major repair or a new plate is in order.

 It's news to me that this site is just about high art guns. First and foremost I'm building a rifle. It's main job is to work and work well. OOhs and Ahhs are a bonus that is, at least for me. Others obviously have different standards but I don't think the gulf between philosophies is all that far.

 Of course, with all due respect. 

 

[jerrywh]

  It's not a question of high art guns verses regular guns. It's a question of quality verses junk. If you were buying a gun at the store would you pick the one with the defects or the one without them?
  If you want the one with the defects I have a great car deal for you CHEAP..

[54ball]

 All I say is this Jerry. I disagree with the junk comments. I really don't think we are too far apart on this, really.

 I have too much much respect for you and your work to comment further.

 

[toddsndrsn]

I suppose you realize that you can move metal around with a polished, round-tipped punch and fill the pits with existing material.  Then burnish the repair and it will disappear.

Could you describe this in a little more detail?  Sounds like something I might want to try. 

As far as the OP...I think it depends on your audience.  If the gun is for you then do what you are okay with.  If the gun is for a customer then I say it's bad workmanship.  Then again my opinion shouldn't count for much with me being on my first rifle.

[T*O*F]

Could you describe this in a little more detail?

Annealed brass is malleable and can be moved around.  For a small pit, place the round punch just off the perimeter of the pit and lightly tap while going around its circumference.  You will move metal into the pit.  Burnish with a hardened burnisher, easily made by hardening a bit of drill rod.  Sand or scrape to even things out.

If the pit is larger, do as Jerry suggested and inlay a small piece of brass into it.

[jerrywh]

 I never meant to infer that anybody's work is junk.  I see this forum as sort of a school and the object of a school is to learn to get better.   

[Bob Rearley]

Thanks for all the comments gentlemen.  Those pits are much smaller when you remove the loops.  I spent the afternoon polishing brass and ruminating over the responses.  While working on this gun, it occurred to me that maybe a few remaining small pits are acceptable among the guys building guns with built in age.  I have no complaint about sand castings.  I became interested in gun building about 15 years ago when I discovered that both my gggg grandfather and his father were well known gunsmiths.  I have built 4 Chamber's kits to this point.  Were it not for Jim's kits and many helpful people in the business and on the ALR I would not have had a clue where to start.  I have attended 2 of Jim's week long classes and spent a week with a well known builder learning about the art.  Every gun I build is better than the first.  My next build will be from a stock blank.  I plan to do the barrel inlet and rr hole myself.  I strive to become a better builder maybe in some way honoring my ancestors.  Even if my work is perceived to be junk, it is the best I can do.  There is a phrase that I taught my children and grand children.  Some of you may have heard it.  "Good, Better, Best, Never Let It Rest, Until Your Good is Better and your Better Best.  I did not know that you could patch or infill brass defects.  I do now.               
I often wish this forum could be conducted in the old gunshop
 or better yet in the old White Horse Tavern over a Yeungling and a cigar.
Bob

[Ed Wenger]

Good for you, Bob, and great sentiment!  Hope to see your finished rifle posted!


     Ed