Second Kibler Rifle complete

[Longone]

When drilling the trigger plate, can that be done in the stock following the tang holes or will that mess up the holes in the stock? My concern is getting the correct angle on the threaded holes in the plate.

Longone

[Jim Kibler]

Thanks everyone.

As to drilling and tapping the trigger plate, I would suggest the following:
Fit the tang and triggers.  Clamp the trigger plate in the inlet.  With a drill bit that just passes through the pre-drilled stock hole, spot the trigger plate hole location.  Switch to a number 29 drill and extend the hole through the plate.  With the plate still in the stock, tap the previously drilled hole by inserting the tap from the top of the stock.  This will align everything properly.  If you have anymore questions about this process, just let me know.

Thanks again,
Jim

[Chowmi]

Kingsbury, Doc,

I did get a bit of work done on my Kibler kit.  It's .36 Cal and curly Maple.  Barrel, under lugs, trigger plate, butt plate, trigger-guard and lock are all in and pinned, drilled and tapped.  I have not yet checked for full and free movement of the lock internals.  Right now, just the tumbler, cock and frizzen are on the lock.  
I still need to get the lock parts in and check/work on the double set triggers, inlet the ramrod pipes, and install the sights and touch hole liner.  

I have to say, everything has gone together like a dream.  I never touched the tang inlet with a chisel.  Essentially, I filed off the roughness on the sides of the tang, and gave the rear tang screw portion a bit more draft, and it was in.  I filed a bit off the front of the trigger plate, and then only had to scrape the mortise to get it in nice and tight.  First time I chiseled wood was on the trigger guard, just a small amount, mostly scraping.  Lock mortise the same.  Only the tiniest amount of chiseling around the tail, and then scraping.  Wonderful.  Now I know what a good inlet looks like!!

The butt plate took less than about 10 minutes of filing the end grain, and done.  However, my inability to drill on-center showed up again, and my first two butt plate holes were off and drove large gaps when I mounted the butt plate.  As a result of this known weakness on my part with butt plates, I already had enough dowels of the appropriate size to fill the holes!  I filled those two holes, drilled again and it is much better.  Good wood to metal fit, but still slightly off center. Probably not noticeable after I file and sand, but I might just do it again since I will always know it is not as good as it could be.  No fault of the kit, just me.  

Pictures in a bit.

Cheers,
Norm

[Jim Kibler]

Chowmi,

Thanks for the progress update.  It's good to hear how everything works out and any potential problems or pitfalls.  A couple notes:

If a touch of wood needs removed from the trigger plate inlet, it's probably best to remove it from the tail end.  That is, insert the end nearest the barrel breech first and then trim the other end to fit.  It won't make too much difference, but may affect the trigger function a tiny bit.  I set each set of triggers to match each lock so shifting forward or backwards might affect the function ever so slightly.

As to the buttplate, I will give the holes some thought.  I had been drilling the holes in the wood to accept the buttplate screws, but recently stopped.  Varying degrees of part shrinkage convinced me it might be best to allow the assembler to drill the holes.  I understand how it can be tricky to get the holes centered, though.  I have been using a drill bit which centers on the countersunk buttplate holes recently.  These are sold for centering wood holes when installing hinges on boxes and such.  This works pretty well if you have someone help align the drill.   I may start including one of these in the kit.  We'll see...

Glad everything is going well.  Keep us posted of the progress.


Kingsbury,
Your finish job on that wood looks fantastic!  

Thanks a bunch everyone.
Jim

[Chowmi]

Jim,
thanks for the point out on the trigger plate.  I may have moved it ever so slightly forward.  I'll see how it works out when I get some more time.

The problem with the butt plate was entirely mine.  I've had trouble with it in the past, and so it is good practice for me.  I have a drill centering jig, but did not use it.  I had used it on a previous rifle with poor success (it's probably because it was an el-cheapo version).  The last two butt plates I had done worked well by center punching by eye and then drilling on the center punch. 

I'll have another look at it and will probably try again.  I don't mind filling the holes and doing it again, I need the practice!

Forward two ramrod pipes are in, and the rear pipe will go in tonight.  I'm enjoying this.

cheers,
Norm

[Kingsburyarms]

Fun kit - lot's of options and designs - Jim, you should be proud...

Jon

[Chowmi]

Fun kit - lot's of options and designs - Jim, you should be proud...

Jon

Absolutely right.

Also, triggers work great.  No issue with the trigger plate placement.  Lock sparks like mad!

Norm

[draton2681]

Kingsbury, Why the secret on the metal coating? Lindseed oil? I am tossed between antiqueing or in the white. Your rifle looks amazing! I got my kit a few months ago and put it together in two easy days except for the ramrod pipes. It's been sitting since. I'm not experienced with any of the finishes for metal as this is my first build. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

[Doc]

A thought on centering the holes.   If you have a brad point bit set,  use the one that just fits in the butt plate and drill just with the brad point to make a starter hole.

Doc

[Chowmi]

Doc,
good point.  I'll admit, I had to google "brad point bits"...  Ha ha.

Norm

[Kingsburyarms]

Kingsbury, Why the secret on the metal coating? Lindseed oil? I am tossed between antiqueing or in the white. Your rifle looks amazing! I got my kit a few months ago and put it together in two easy days except for the ramrod pipes. It's been sitting since. I'm not experienced with any of the finishes for metal as this is my first build. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

Out of respect for the traditional builders on this site...... - I use modern tools, materials and coatings to complete my contemporary firearms. It was brought to my attention in another thread when I used a more modern gunstock as a wood finishing example, that it was not in the spirit of this forum. I have the utmost respect and understanding why, and what I am learning of the ways these were built a few hundred years ago. So, for example, if I were go on about clear polymer heat coatings and molecular metal bonding, it would not be in the spirit of this audience/forum. Happy to have a call, a chat over a beer or a PM for additional info, but I respect the concept of traditional building and classic use of traditional methods.

BTW, http://www.nyalic.com/Blacksmiths-Ironwork_c_55.html is only one example.

[WadePatton]

Well-stated, thank you. 

[Billy Mike]

Wow! All I can say is wow! Everything is superior. My experience is limited at best. But the lock is stunning, the stock is perfection, everything looks perfect and an inventory shows all the parts present and accounted for. The crate is a superior effort at shipping and shows great care.

I hope I can do it justice.

[Chowmi]

I've been out of the country for a few days for work, but got back to it today. 

I got the butt-plate sorted out so it is nicely centered.  Good.

I chiseled away at the wood around the muzzle so I could pour a pewter nose-cap.  I'm going for a chevron type design.  That all worked out nicely. Good

I poured the pewter.  I was reasonably confident in this, as I have done it before.  (oops)  First attempt, didn't fill all the areas I needed it to.  Poured again, with generous room for it to flow.  Still didn't work.  Not good.

Now I have a nice blob of pewter on the nose that will all have to come off.  I'll have to spend some time filing etc, to get it off and try again.  if any of the piercings are damaged underneath the pewter, I will just go for a plain pewter nose cap.  If worse comes to worse, then I'll do an iron/steel nose cap.

Despite the mishap, I'm still enjoying this build.

cheers,
Norm

[horseman]

A very beautiful rifle!  Could you please go into more detail on the stain mix.    I really like the color.  Thank you.

[Kingsburyarms]

Iron Nitrate application as per Jim's instruction, heated and let dry overnight. Sanded it down to a sharp curl.  The stain is a mixture of two Laurel Mountain Forge colors, thinned down 50%. I used a Mason jar and filled it about 25% with Denatured Alcohol, then added about 1 oz of Laurel Mountain Honey Maple color, mixed it in (Thinned it). Applied the thinned stain to the rifle with a foam brush, pretty heavy, and let dry for 4 hours, I then added about a tablespoon of Laurel Mountain Lancaster Maple to the Mason jar mix (it really gets darker) and applied (with a foam brush) to the rifle and let dry. Sanded through most of the "darker" honey/Lancaster color, and this is what it came out as. You can see on the edges of the darker curl a slight "Lancaster red" tint, but mostly the Honey Maple. all wood takes on different hints of color, but this is what worked for me on this stock.    

[horseman]

 Thank you very much.

Horseman.

[Chowmi]

I finally got some more work done on my .36 Kibler SMR.  I've been away for work for a bit, and then came down with a cold that set me back a few days.

4th try lucky on the pewter nose cap.  I ended up trying to patch a small area, but my melt was too hot and it also melted some of the good parts.  Eventually got the whole thing off and did it again.  Mostly successful.  There is a spot along the edge of the RR groove that didn't get any pewter.  I may just live with it.
I have not filed it all down yet, as I have run out of time and energy for the day.  (still not quite back from the cold).

Once I file and sand down the pewter, I will sand the stock in preparation for staining.

Cheers,
Norm