Author Topic: Barrel browning problems  (Read 8926 times)

Wayne Wynn

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Barrel browning problems
« on: April 02, 2009, 06:05:51 AM »
I am browning a barrel on my fowler using the cold browning method. I am using Tru Brown from Wahkon Bay, I am using a humidity box also. I first started to apply the solution about 5 days ago and in a few days the barrel started to brown nicely over about  85% of the barrel. The other 15% is coming out splotchy, it doesn't even look like it's rusting in spots. The other thing is when I apply the solution after carding it seems to remove some of the previous brown
               The metal is degreased using acetone. I've browned several guns using the Wahkon Bay brown and this is the first problem i've had with it.
               I forgot to mention , this is my second try at browning this barrel, when it didn't come out to my liking the first time I cleaned up the barrel and started over, and here it is again ,the splotches!! And in the same areas!!!
   I'm really tempted to use something other than the Wahkon Bay brown. Has anyone used the Laurel Mountain Forge brown with good results??
      I would appreciate any and all suggestions------ Thanks , Wayne
     

Offline Dphariss

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2009, 07:34:42 AM »
Sounds like its not degreased completely. I would acetone it agian.
Browning will not tolerate as vigorous a carding as will rust bluing.
Try rubbing it back with clean burlap or similar.
Could be old Buick bumpers in the steel.
I would sand it lightly and then degrease again.
If it still will not take try some Wahkon Bay AF stock stain mixed 50-50 with the browning solution.
If this won't work you may have a problem with "Buick bumpers".

Dan
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Offline Blacksmoke

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2009, 07:57:07 AM »
Wayne-- Properly browned barrels like their metal surfaces taken down to the bright with, either sand paper or fine Emery paper before you de grease. It won't hurt to sand it again like Dan suggested--de grease and start again.  I'Ve done it lots and with a little persistence it will finally produce the browning that you want. Also if you are using steel wool to card with , some of it has oil on the strands from the production process. So it, also, has to be de greased before using. Be sure to use de greased rubber gloves as well.          Hugh  Toenjes
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Offline Hoot AL

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2009, 08:05:11 AM »
Read the instructions very carefully. If you are using the Laurel Mountain, you can not go over the same spot or area twice. If you do, it will turn a copper color and it will not brown.  If you miss a spot or streak, wait and catch it the second time around.

That is what causes the splotches.   I learned this at Conner Praire's Gunsmithing schools.

AL

40Haines

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2009, 12:04:33 PM »
I would sand it lightly and then degrease again.

Offline Lucky R A

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2009, 02:08:56 PM »
Mike Lea's Whykon Bay browning solution is my first choice for browning.  I have had nothing but problems with LMF browner, much more difficult to use.   Metal prep is very important.   I insert a plug in the end of the barrel long enough to use as a handle and use a metal hook in the tang bolt hole on the other end of the barrel, so even my rubber gloves that I use exclusively for browning don not touch the metal.  I clean the barrel with a water soluble engine degreaser.  I use Scotch Brite type pads for final barrel polish.  A too highly polished barrel will resist browning.   On barrels that I want a quick easy matt brown, I dust them lightly with my sand blaster.  Apply the browning solution sparingly.  You do not want puddles or wet spots standing on the surface as they will cause problems, just damp.   I do my carding with a plastic bristle brush.  About five to six coats and you will have a nicely browned barrel.   I stop the action with Sodium Hydroxide (lye).  Paint it on and let dry for a couple of hours, then wash off with lots of water.  Dry and warm the barrel, spray down with WD-40 then follow that with your favorite oil or wax.    (Browning 101)     Ron
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Wayne Wynn

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2009, 03:51:01 PM »
Thanks to everyone who replied , your input is appreciated!!---Thanks, Wayne

Offline Michigan Flinter

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2009, 04:32:53 PM »
  I like the "Homer Dangler browning "that gunbuilder James Klein from Fulton Mi. sells .Very easy to use with good results . Eric D. Lau Riverdale Mi.

Offline Roger Fisher

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2009, 04:53:07 PM »
Read the instructions very carefully. If you are using the Laurel Mountain, you can not go over the same spot or area twice. If you do, it will turn a copper color and it will not brown.  If you miss a spot or streak, wait and catch it the second time around.

That is what causes the splotches.   I learned this at Conner Praire's Gunsmithing schools.

AL
LM -use one stroke only do not smear/schmutz/ back and forth over itself this tends to turn coppery and not want to 'brown'!

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2009, 06:45:22 PM »
i very rarely polish past 220 grit - often 180 is perfect....on a longrifle bbl, that is.  i remove the tang and screw in a brass rod threaded for the breech, and drive a hardwood dowel into the muzzle.  the to the laundry sink and scrub with Comet - not Old Dutch - and a scotch brite pad.  you cannot overdo this.  in sight slots and around engraving and bbl loops, i use a stiff toothbrush - my wife's. i don't like the taste of comet myself.  never touch the bbl again with the fingers.  i use two cotton batting balls, bought at the drug store, dipped into a shot glass full of solution, then squeezed out, to apply the liquid full length in one slow stroke.  i like a q-tip for sight slots.  the bbl goes into the damp box suspended by a screw eye and a hook.  i record the time in and out and muzzle up or down, reversing at each application.
to card between coats, i have a four inch long roll of cotton canvas about two inches in diameter, and i scrub the barrel hard.  the barrel, for solution application and carding, rests horizontally on its end plugs, on two wooden v supports.
five or six applications, two - three hours apart, yields a good, rich, dark brown, that is matt but very smooth.  i kill it in the laundry tub again, with super saturated baking soda and a finger nail brush.  then i pour a whole kettle full of boiling water over the barrel, held vertically.  while still hot, i dry with clean paper towels, then apply motor oil.  the steel loves this part.
now, even after all of that, i occasionally find a small spot where the steel is not perfect.  but it is rare.  i usually shrug it off.
laurel mt forge is the most difficult to use, but it gives a very solid and deep brown.
D. Taylor Sapergia
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keweenaw

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2009, 12:01:15 AM »
I've been degreasing lately with 409 spray cleaner.  Put the barrel in the laundry sink and spray liberally with the 409 scrub thoroughly with a piece of clean cloth, flush it off with lots of hot water and do it all again.  I never get oil spots.  I've also used Comet as Taylor suggested but found it unnecessary after the 409.  Lots easier and better than using acetone or any organic solvent.

I wanted a nice plum brown on the last rifle I did.  No polishing on the barrel after the last draw file pass with a really good small mill file that leaves a clean surface.   After cleaning as above I browned it with Oscar Gaddy's browning formula that was in the Double Gun Journal.  Used it full strength.  I didn't let any coat rust more than 2 hours in the humidity box and carded with a fine wire wheel run at fairly low speed.  Got a gorgeous plum brown.

Tom

Offline Don Getz

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Re: Barrel browning problems
« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2009, 01:31:14 AM »
Tom....I use fantastic.   I spray the barrel real well with fantastic, the scrub it with a piece of scotchbrite, work up a lather
on the barrel, then rinse it off with real hot water.   Of course, I wear those cheap, plastic gloves so as not to get any fingerprints on it.   If I do this in the summer when the humidity is high, the barrel will actually start to darken up before
I even put any browning solution on it.  I have two of those long, flat plastic covered hooks that I have screwed into the
wall of my garden shed.  I lay the barrel on this to brown, using a cotton swab and merely make each flat wet with one
swipe.   I have used Laurel Mtn Forge stuff, as well as Homer Danglers solution.....I think Homer's stuff works the best.
I scale the barrel off using a piece of terry cloth and hot water.   When I am finished, I use a piece of terry cloth and Lava
soap to clean the barrel off.  I scrub it real well, the Lava soap has a fine abrasive in it which helps to smooth the barrel
and helps to neutralize the acid in the browning......works for me...........Don