Uberti Santa Fe Hawken

[L Meadows]

Been looking at one,can someone give me the LOP,can find most specs but can't find that. Also,I know they are not a custom gun,but how do they compare for the price?

[Martin S.]

I had one back in the 80's.

I sold it for college money.  I wish I had never done that.  I have offered 2 times what I sold it for to the guy who bought it, but he says he will never sell.

It was an accurate rifle, not sure about historically accurate.

Not a custom rifle, but a really nice one.  I am 5'10", and it fit me, but I don't know exact LOP.

There was some talk about them on this board within the last year or so.  You might do a search.

[Hungry Horse]

I think the pull is about 14", but I don't remember for sure. The gun is definatly fifty three caliber rather than fifty four, and shoots a 520 ball. The molds are available, but are not something you just stumble on to at a gun show. Mine shot great, and was a reasonably good Hawken replica.

  Hungry Horse

[Smoketown]

Mine measures 14 13/16" from the curve in butt plate to the curve in front trigger.

It's a Jeb Smith Commemorative.

No. 298 of 1000 on the tang.

845 on the hammer side of the barrel.
(Barrel, tang and stock all marked or stamped 845.)

AE proof mark.

Stamped 54 cal. I'm almost sure it takes a .520 ball as did others of the same vintage.

Western Arms Corp  Santa Fe N.M.

I got it with out the manual or a proper ramrod but, I think I still have the box ... Somewhere.


Oh, and this one is unfired ...


Cheers,
Smoketown

[Lee44shootercnb]

A little history
http://grrw.org/uberti-santa-fe-hawken
 

[L Meadows]

Man,14 13/16 is a pretty long trigger pull,especially for a 5'6" runt like myself. How much would I be looking at to get the LOP cut to 13 1/4, and would it be worth it or would I be better going another route?

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Cutting a Hawken butt shorter poses a problem in architecture.  As you get closer to the lock, the vertical dimension of the stock gets smaller, and you end up with a strange looking butt stock.  Also, the stock swells a bit just forward of the butt plate and this leaves wood proud along the edges of the butt plate if you move it forward.  I'd leave it alone.
For a commercial offering, the Cherry Corners/Ithaca/Santa Fe Hawken is pretty decent.

[Dan Herda]

Mine is 143/4" lop,.530 bore,slant breech and the toe plate is dovetailed into the bp. I thinkits a first run for Sante Fe Arms

[Hungry Horse]

Mine was a Santa Fe Arms 1 in 1000 also, but I don't remember what the serial number was. It was first prize at the Tall Trees Rendezvous in Crecent City California many years ago. It had an engraved cheek piece inlay commemorating the shoot, and stating the tear.

  Hungry Horse

[Herb]

I examined one of these xxx (I don't remember the number) of 1000 Sante Fe Hawkens some years ago and the length of pull was 15".  I can't find my measurements right now.

[Herb]

Found my notes.  Rifle was a Western Arms Corp. Sante Fe, N.M. Jedediah Smith 1799-1831.  Serial number 22/1000.  Walnut stock.  Not well shaped.  Unbrowned steel escutcheons.  Slant breech.  Clean out screw.  Pewter forend.  Rib screwed on.  Barrel .54, 1x32", seven lands.  Length of pull 15".  Five steel tacks on each side of forend, seven on each side of buttstock in a lengthened plus sign.  Owned by Jack of Salt Lake City, I don't know if he put the tacks in the stock or if it came that way.

Don't cut off the stock.  I did that to a Track of Wolf Kit Carson Hawken stock, and the cheek piece came too near the buttplate.  This on an unfinished stock.  Don't even think of cutting a finished stock shorter.

[L Meadows]

After doing some searching on this site,I found a post of a member re-building this rifle,including cutting the butt stock. Don't know how to copy it into my link, but if you do a search for " rebuilding an Uberti hawken" you can see the details. Looks like after cutting the butt and reshaping the cheek piece it looks pretty good.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

The search function does not take one to the thread of which you speak.

[L Meadows]

Something else I learned today, it's best to go back to the home page to do a search unless you know what sub forum the topic is in. This topic is in gun building,but if you go to home page you can find it.

[L Meadows]

After checking the post again,Mr Sapergia, you,as always,offered some excellent advice on the re-build.

[Lee44shootercnb]

http://grrw.org/the-heyday-of-the-hawken/#Uberti

[Bob Roller]

http://grrw.org/the-heyday-of-the-hawken/#Uberti

I went to St.Louis in 1978 to visit Art Resell and the Hawken Shop and thought
that the then "High End" guns was a guarantee of failure.I told Art that he had to
have a Chevrolet to go with the Cadillac and that in that time frame few could or
would support these costly kits. It's better today but then this ain't the early 1970's.
Art gave me a breech and tang from the Gemmer shop and I still have it as a reminder
of another time.

Bob Roller

[nosrettap1958]

Here is one with a Uberti barrel and mold,

http://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/rifles/muzzleloading-rifles-custom/-52-cal-hawken-flint-lock-with-mould.cfm?gun_id=100735279

[Lampro]

Mine is plain walnut with no tacks, no cheekpiece(any body else heard of one with no cheekpiece?) and says Allen Arms, it takes a .520 or .526 ball and measures 15 1/8 from curve in front trigger to curve in buttplate. I believe the bore is choked and IMHO it is a very accurate rifle.

[Hungry Horse]

I've never heard of one without a cheek piece. Your gun might have been one of the later ones that came out in kit form, from which the builder removed the cheekpiece. I am sure none of them came with tacks in the butt stock from the factory. I do think these guns have a bit of a choked muzzle, because the gun I owned I got from the gentleman that won it at a rendezvous, and it was brand new. He successfully shot it with .530 balls, but said it was a real bear getting them started. I shot it with .520 balls, and they loaded pretty easy, but after the first four inches they really took no effort to push down the bore.

  Hungry Horse

[Dphariss]

A little history
http://grrw.org/uberti-santa-fe-hawken
 

Ed Webber made a copy of the circa mid-1830s (I suspect) J&S owned by the Montana Historical Society. How they thought John Baird helped to make the rifle I have no idea.  Maybe it was just advertising. But Uberti was unable to reproduce it, this from Ed. I guess it was impossible to shape it properly with a belt and drum sander. As a result they produced a line of "Hawken" rifles with far cruder shaping. The main difference between the copy Ed made and original was the square tailed lock on the original.  Today with CNC  equipment it might be possible to shape the stock correctly but I have no idea where the Ed Webber rifle is today.

Dan