Vegetable shortening. What gives?

[Skychief]

I did some shooting today and used some vegetable shortening for patch lube.  I hadn't used any for years.

I can report that it shot extremely well, did the job of protecting the patch and allowed no cleaning between shots or shot strings.  Around 50 rounds were shot.  Each round seated just like the one preceding it.

Cleanup was a cinch.

All of the above has me wondering.  Can it be that good and simple?

Anybody else using it?

How does it behave in cold weather for hunting purposes?

Best regards, Skychief

[RichG]

I've used Crisco before. melts in the summer, freezes in the winter. if your patch/ball combo is tight it can tear your patch when frozen. it does work pretty well as a patch lube.

[Hungry Horse]

If you live in fire prone areas Crisco is like shooting a flame thrower. I had to fight fire, and field dress a buck, simotaniously early in my muzzleloading career because of it. Never again.

  Hungry Horse

[Daryl]

IIRC - used it as a patch lube in the mid to late 70's, both liquid and the shortening/grease. I never had a patch catch fire, possibly due to tight combinations I was using, but have seen in print by others that it is more combustible than other lubes.

[hanshi]

It's been a long, long time since i used Crisco.  Can'y really complain about it much.  It did what it was supposed to do; and that's load moderately well and give accuracy.

[T*O*F]

I've used Crisco before. melts in the summer, freezes in the winter.

Once heated, Crisco never returns to its solid state.  I used to put it in a skillet with heat just enough to melt it.  Then put my shotgun wads in it and roll them around until they were saturated.  Put em on a paper towel with another on top and squished em with a pie plate to remove the excess.  They remained lubed and neither hardened in winter or further melted in summer.

As a patch lube, one could do the same thing and make pre-lubed patches using the same method.  I would carry those threaded on a string tied to my shooting pouch  or horn strap.

[g2608671@verizon.net]

I have used Crisco for years and have had very good results.  Just melt it in a pan over very low heat, dunk the patches in and then lay them in a spiral in an old Altoids can. Clean up is easy, no greasy kids-stuff and you can fry chicken in it too; take out the patches first.

[Longknife]

I mix Crisco and beeswax 50/50, (+-), have been doing it for years with excellent results....

[g2608671@verizon.net]

50/50 Crisco and bees wax.  Think I may try this. Can you identify any differences or benefits that have you seen relative to pure bees wax or Crisco?

Yoilks and away to the laboratory!

[Longknife]

You can adjust the mix to suit the weather. Never tried pure bees wax, too stiff, always thinned it out with Crisco(or olive oil). Crisco works good when lubing and shooting at the bench but BW and Crisco gives the lube more "body", you can get more lube in the patch and gets slick as sn*+. I melt the lube in a double boiler and take a stack of patches, maybe 20 or so and dip them in the hot lube with a pair of tongs. let them soak up the lube and then squeeze out excess.....Try it, You will like it!!!   

[Hungry Horse]

The hardest gun to get shooting again, that I ever had brought to me, was a custom Hawken that the guy shot his own patch lube in.  it was plugged up tight and wouldn't fire. His home grown lube had a bunch of bees wax in it and over time it got pushed back into the flashchannel, and plugged it up tight. The gun had no cleanup screw, so we had to pull the breechplug. even then we had a devil of a time getting the beeswax out of the flashchannel. I would go light on the bees wax.

  Hungry Horse

[Marcruger]

Hungry Horse,  There is nothing like the voice of experience talking.  Thank you for sharing that.  If we listen to folks with experience in the world, we can learn a lot about a lot of things.  Best wishes,   Marc

[Longknife]

The hardest gun to get shooting again, that I ever had brought to me, was a custom Hawken that the guy shot his own patch lube in.  it was plugged up tight and wouldn't fire. His home grown lube had a bunch of bees wax in it and over time it got pushed back into the flashchannel, and plugged it up tight. The gun had no cleanup screw, so we had to pull the breechplug. even then we had a devil of a time getting the beeswax out of the flashchannel. I would go light on the bees wax.

  Hungry Horse

Sounds like someone was lubing the barrel with bees wax because there is no way your patch lube could "migrate" past the powder charge!!!!!!!!!!!!

[EC121]

Turpentine will dissolve beeswax.  Maybe the wax was mixed in the fouling and got pushed down the barrel.

[Daryl]

The hardest gun to get shooting again, that I ever had brought to me, was a custom Hawken that the guy shot his own patch lube in.  it was plugged up tight and wouldn't fire. His home grown lube had a bunch of bees wax in it and over time it got pushed back into the flashchannel, and plugged it up tight. The gun had no cleanup screw, so we had to pull the breechplug. even then we had a devil of a time getting the beeswax out of the flashchannel. I would go light on the bees wax.

  Hungry Horse

I can not imagine how that could possibly happen.  I'd like to hear an explanation on how the wax became deposited in the breech, without out being poured in through the muzzle, nipple recess or clean-out screw hole.  Cannot figure out how beeswax got behind the powder chamber area. Sounds like someone "pulling a prank."

[Joe S.]

Maybe borebutter or the likes used for rust preventative rammed down upon reuse?all this and an undersized powder chamber could cause issues eventually

[Darkhorse]

When I started shooting blackpowder with a .54 Renegade back in 1976. I only knew one person shooting BP and he had been a flintlock shooter for quite a while. I asked him about patching material and lube as I had no idea. He recommended pillow ticking for the patch and Crisco and spit for the lube. So that's what I used and it worked so well I used it for match and hunting for years with no problems of any kind. I only changed lubes after reading about how wonderful bore butter was and how you could shoot all day without cleaning.
I have used a few different lubes over the years and most of them have a bad side waiting to come out. The longest shooting strings were with a spray on liquid lube, but it dries out after awhile and my patches would actually catch on fire and almost burned the woods down one day.
For hunting I prefer Track's mink oil but I'm out so last season I used Bore Butter. I seriously considered Crisco but it would have required a 20 mile round trip to town.
In that old Renegade, off the bench, crisco shot the tightest groups. I had a process, I would chew on and saturate a clean patch while I shot the first 3 shots with crisco. Then run the spit patch down the barrel followed by 2 dry patches, then shoot the last 2 with crisco. That worked real well and I won or placed high in a lot matches.
So would I use Crisco again? I sure would.

[Hungry Horse]

 I always supposed the bees wax coated the inside of the barrel upon firing, and with each successive loading and firing, with a tight patched ball combination, small amounts of the wax was pushed back down the barrel with the new patched ball. Cleaning after shooting may have pushed wax down the bore and into the flash channel as well. I'm sure the process took some time, but once the channel was plugged there was nothing that would clear it. Had we known exactly what was causing the blockage we might have been able remove it with some thing that would desolate the wax, but we did't know what plugged things up. We used a high pressure air compressor to try and clear it but it wouldn' clear the blockage.

  Hungry Horse

[Marcruger]

Reminds me that when storing a longrifle in the safe, think about storing muzzle down.  I ran into a percussion gun with hooked breech that had been standing upright for 16 years or so.  The barrel protectant had migrated down the bore and into the breech.....and solidified.  Daryl and Taylor wisely instructed me on soaking the breech in solvent for a while, and then flushing it.  That sure got things moving, but it was a pain until then.   Wonder if that beeswax was in the storage lube, and migrated with the lube?  Just pondering.   Marc

[Mad Monk]

A word about Crisco as a patch lube.  When I first got into BP shooting Crisco was a commonly used lube for cloth patches.  Sometimes, depending on the breech plug design, the heat from firing the gun starts to "bake" the Crisco in the breech.  You get a deposit that looks like the burnt build up in the home kitchen oven.  Soap and water has little effect on it.  Common bore cleaning solvents have no effect on it.  To remove all traces of it you end up using home oven cleaner.  With the flat face breech plugs in my two longrifles I would get a ring where the flat face of the plug joins the barrel.  Sometimes a scraper would work and other times not.  My flintlock vent liner was at the face of the breech plug and burnt baked Crisco would get into it and give me ignition problems.  In my factory rifles with the sub bore diameter powder chamber I could not get into that powder chamber so the baked Crisco would continue to build up.  Only a strong caustic will break down the baked Crisco and allow it to be flushed away.

[Frank]

I know a lot of guys use beeswax in their patch lube with good results. Personally, I would never use it. Melted wax is never a good thing
in a barrel.

[Daryl]

Frank, I disagree with the premise that beeswax is somehow bad in a gun barrel, but you must do what you feel best for you and your shooting.
 
For those shooting Minnie or flat base bullets in competition or for hunting like in and muzzle loading rifles, but more often in .58 rifles or the Parker Hale Whitworth and Volunteer .451 rifles, beeswax is virtually in all bullet lubes used with black powder -(& modern smokeless rifles shooting cast bullets as well) - whether it's Lyman's Black Powder Gold, SPG, or a mix like the old Sharps lube of Beeswax/Tallow around 60:40, beeswax is used in the concoction for black powder bullets. 

That some people put it in their patch lube for patched round balls due to specific reasons such as high temp integrity, more power to them.

I have used the Sharp's mix as well as SPG and Black Powder Gold on bullets in muzzleloaders & had absolutely no problems switching back to patched balls or back to slugs during the shooting sessions - no wiping needed before switching, either direction.

[yulzari]

Crisco has some water emulsified in it which may, or may not, be a good thing? Captain Wilde of the Swiss army sold some small German states on his concept of dropping a little measured water down the bore onto dry patched balls and it worked well. Tried it myself but it is tricky to get the right amount without it soaking past the patch. When done right it worked fine for me. Just a bit too much and you wet the powder.

The period British Army standard for rifled muzzle loaders was always tallow until the rifle muskets when bees wax came in. Tallow was issued for all rifles up to and including the Brunswick.

[Frank]

I tried Crisco many years ago when I first started shooting muzzleloaders, 1975. Didn't care for it as I was getting a lot of fouling. Probably my fault, being a rookie. I remember it smelled a lot  like fired chicken, lol. 

[Mad Monk]

To add to Daryl's comments.

During the days of the muzzleloading military arms they commonly used a mixture of beeswax and tallow as a lube.  The proportions of beeswax to tallow would change depending on when the lube was to be used.

When we get into black powder cartridge guns the standard bullet lube was beeswax with either bayberry or Japan wax in the beeswax.

If you go back in modern muzzleloading to the late 1970s into the mid 1980s you see several commercial patch lubes based on beeswax as an emulsion in water.