Author Topic: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug  (Read 3798 times)

Offline Chris Treichel

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Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« on: February 22, 2017, 09:50:30 PM »
So I want to machine a breech plug for a 1 1/8 Percussion job... Which metal to use? (I will first machine one from Aluminium for practice)
So... searching through as many posts as I can find and looking through a few books I have found the following.
4140
1144
12L14
1137
8620
Any preferences?

westbj2

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2017, 11:19:07 PM »
If you are going to color harden the breech plug 8620 would be the best choice.  Otherwise 1144 or 1018 would be fine.
Jim

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2017, 11:36:52 PM »
If you are going to color harden the breech plug 8620 would be the best choice.  Otherwise 1144 or 1018 would be fine.
Jim

I have made several breech plugs from 8620 and it machines easily
and seems to take a better finish using carbide.

Bob Roller



Offline rich pierce

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2017, 11:43:07 PM »
With all due respect to the barrel steel discussion, you may want to use the same steel as the barrel is made of for a good visual match.
Andover, Vermont

Offline David Rase

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2017, 12:13:06 AM »
I have had good results case hardening both 12L14 and 1018.  I like 12L14 as it machines much nicer for me than 1018.
David

Offline frogwalking

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2017, 12:21:08 AM »
If you will rust blue or brown barrel and plug, I agree to use the same kind of steel.  I made one with a black barrel and plum colored plug, both treated the same.
Quality, schedule, price; Pick any two.

Offline jerrywh

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2017, 12:56:19 AM »
 The steels you listed are all good but it doesn't need to be any stronger than the barrel. Because of the shape the breech plug is stronger than the barrel anyway. The barrel would explode before the plug ever blew out.  My last choice would be 4140. 8620 is very good or 1137.   
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Offline JCKelly

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2017, 05:32:23 AM »
Of those steels, I would consider 4140, annealed, or 8620. Only the 8620 may be color case hardened if you wish.

1018 would be fine but it is cold drawn which means full of residual stresses, which means it may wander around a bit when you machine it. You can get rid of these stress completely by a short time around 1100-1200F (dull red heat, air cool). So long as it is stress relieved, 1018 is a good choice for color case hardening if you wish.

12L14, 1137 and 1144 have no toughness at all. I would not want such in front of my own face.

Offline Chris Treichel

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2017, 06:38:06 AM »
The barrel is 4140. Thank you for all of the input. I will order some aluminium to practice on and and some steel then give making a breach plug a try. 8620 Sounds like it may be a good choice.

Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2017, 08:46:57 PM »
 Here we go with the how much can you over think this sport crowd. A grade five bolt of the proper thread count is many time stronger than the old wrought iron plugs used in every antique longrifle. Unless you are going into this build with the plan to grossly overload the piece, it seems you are worrying about nothing. I had a friend bring in a trade gun for repair that I helped him build.he had been hunting in Idaho in the winter, and let the ramrod slip up through his numb fingers while pushing the overshot card down on a load of shot while grouse hunting. the gun had all the barrel pins bent, both lock bolts bent, the upward tang screw bent, and a thumbnail shaped chip out of the stock at the tang. The breech plug was a grade 5 NF bolt with a tang welded on it. No threads were pulled, or showed any signs of damage. The pins, and bolts, were replaced, and the barrel was check for bulges, rebreeched with the original plug, proofed, and is shooting today.

  Hungry Horse

Offline JCKelly

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2017, 03:26:12 AM »
According to boltdepot.com/fastener-information/materials-and-grades/bolt-grade-chart.aspx
a grade 5 bolt is Quenched & Tempered Medium Carbon Steel.
That is pretty good stuff, and it is light-years away from 12L14 or 1144

practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/grade-5-bolt-material-193435/

says

"Commercial grade 5 sold by such as McMaster-Carr simply say Rockwell C hardness of 25 to 34 and a minimum tensile strength of 120,000 psi.

 4140HT (also known as pre hard) would be in this general class and not require additional heat treat.

 It is also readily available . . . "

Grade 5 bolts are metallurgically far superior to most muzzle loading rifle barrels.

Offline Chris Treichel

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2017, 02:54:05 PM »
This is for percussion rifles...

Offline Rolf

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2017, 07:33:05 PM »
12L14, 1137 and 1144 have no toughness at all. I would not want such in front of my own face.

Rice, Burton and alot of other Professional barrelmakers use 12L14 for making barrels. If it's good enough for a barrel, why isn't it good enough for a plug?

Best regards
Rolf

Offline Elnathan

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2017, 01:00:11 AM »
12L14, 1137 and 1144 have no toughness at all. I would not want such in front of my own face.

Rice, Burton and alot of other Professional barrelmakers use 12L14 for making barrels. If it's good enough for a barrel, why isn't it good enough for a plug?

Best regards
Rolf

*points downward*

We just had a six page discussion of this topic.
A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition -  Rudyard Kipling

Offline Rolf

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2017, 11:35:38 AM »

I'll refrase my question. Does a plug have to be stronger than the barrel? If so why? Is it exposed to more pressure?

Best regards
Rolf
« Last Edit: February 26, 2017, 10:41:53 AM by Rolf »

Offline Chris Treichel

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Re: Which Steel for a Percussion Breechplug
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2017, 08:56:41 PM »
With a percussion system you have the nipple screwed into the metal... at that point the nipple with its smaller hole has to withstand a lot of pressure... which acts against the threads cut into the breech plug.