Author Topic: Roller locks  (Read 5450 times)

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Roller locks
« on: April 03, 2017, 08:15:17 PM »
Attached herewith is a picture of one of Bob's recent locks...(wish it were mine).  I can just feel that satin smooth crisp action.

D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

greybeard

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #1 on: April 03, 2017, 09:30:41 PM »
Thank you Taylor for this pic, . Always a treat to see quality work by Mr. Roller.
Bob

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #2 on: April 03, 2017, 10:57:48 PM »
Thank you Taylor for this pic, . Always a treat to see quality work by Mr. Roller.
Bob

This picture shows blemishes on the bridle that aren't really there.
Our son used his phone for this and maybe that's the bug.

Bob Roller

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #3 on: April 03, 2017, 11:04:17 PM »
Attached herewith is a picture of one of Bob's recent locks...(wish it were mine).  I can just feel that satin smooth crisp action.


Taylor,
Thank you for posting this. It is one of four I promised to make.
This one is a copy of a Rigby. Several years ago I got two of
these ( originals) from a man in South Africa. The springs were
gone and I made new ones.I also made a steel,actual size profile
of the plates with the tumbler hole.I have to make one more
of these and two Alex Henry's.
They are a labor intensive thing and I'll be glad to be done with them.

Bob Roller

Offline snapper

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2017, 04:34:36 AM »


this is my latest Roller lock for the Alex Henry that was completed last year, and that I shot with at Oakridge a little over a week ago.

I have 4 or 5 Roller locks.  The trigger pull is quite a bit heavy for me, and I have to lighten them up for good target work.

Fleener
My taste are simple:  I am easily satisfied with the best.  Winston Churchill

Offline smylee grouch

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2017, 04:55:39 AM »
Bob Roller, did you ever stamp your name in a straight line or did you always put it in a semi-circle?

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2017, 02:15:37 PM »
Bob Roller, did you ever stamp your name in a straight line or did you always put it in a semi-circle?

Smylee,
I MIGHT have signed a few locks in a straight line but don't remember when.
The semi circle is easy to manage and when I make a booboo it less obvious.

Bob Roller

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2017, 02:24:40 PM »


this is my latest Roller lock for the Alex Henry that was completed last year, and that I shot with at Oakridge a little over a week ago.

I have 4 or 5 Roller locks.  The trigger pull is quite a bit heavy for me, and I have to lighten them up for good target work.

Fleener

Art,
 On the LRML I made for myself back in 2001 I had to lighten the trigger pull a bit.
It's easier to lighten than to tighten it up.I have made about 35 of these locks since
1987 and had only one come in for repair.The tumbler had been ruined by grinding
the full cock notch OFF entirely and then the half cock was altered so the lock could be
fired from that position.This was an extreme example of "speed locking" a muzzle loader.
I saw it on an 1874 Sharps once but didn't think it was a good idea.

Bob Roller

Offline Steve-ALA

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2017, 03:44:39 PM »
How recent was this lock made?

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2017, 09:48:00 PM »
How recent was this lock made?

It was started several months ago but only recently finished.

Bob Roller

jimc2

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2017, 12:20:18 AM »
At my age when I see a roller lock I just want to sleep with it. I have one on a huntington county rifle made by George Seiler  These locks make most machinists work lool poorly indeed ::)

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2017, 02:38:10 AM »
At my age when I see a roller lock I just want to sleep with it. I have one on a huntington county rifle made by George Seiler  These locks make most machinists work lool poorly indeed ::)

Jim,
THAT is some compliment! I have shown these to some very good machinists and they usually
say that such gadgets are beyond their level of training. The parts that can be done on a lathe or mill
consist of the entire mechanism but the fine or fancy detailing is done at the bench with an assortment
of files of different cuts and shapes and some that are modified by grinding and polishing.
I have locks to make if I can do them,mostly Hawken but NONE are paid for and that's the way I want it.
If a customer is short of money and can't take the lock or trigger it's no problem.I have been there and
understand that situation.
Again,thank you for the nice compliment.

Bob Roller
« Last Edit: April 05, 2017, 03:13:48 PM by Ky-Flinter »

Offline elkhorne

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2017, 03:11:42 AM »
Bob,
Since all that I read on this great site, it seems you win the vote on the most knowledgable and professional lock maker alive today. I am trying to improve my lock preparation and thought I, as well as others novice builders on this site might learn some new techniques from you. You mentioned the fine and fancy detailing done at your bench with an assortment of files of different cuts and shapes, grinding and polishing. Can you offer some suggestions on good steps with files or polishing grits to take a cast lock plate or other cast part from an as cast condition to one finished and acceptable to leave bright or grayed or aged. Thanks and wish you were still producing as it would be great to have one of your fine locks on one of my flinters.
elkhorne

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2017, 03:12:24 PM »
Bob,
Since all that I read on this great site, it seems you win the vote on the most knowledgable and professional lock maker alive today. I am trying to improve my lock preparation and thought I, as well as others novice builders on this site might learn some new techniques from you. You mentioned the fine and fancy detailing done at your bench with an assortment of files of different cuts and shapes, grinding and polishing. Can you offer some suggestions on good steps with files or polishing grits to take a cast lock plate or other cast part from an as cast condition to one finished and acceptable to leave bright or grayed or aged. Thanks and wish you were still producing as it would be great to have one of your fine locks on one of my flinters.
elkhorne

Elkhorne,
I don't claim the title of most knowledgeable on anything.I saw a modern double barrel,cased flintlock rifle
at the CLA show two years ago that had a pair of locks of really exquisite craftsmanship.The hours that went into
just the locks had to be stunning.I think Jim Chambers knows who the maker is and maybe he'll see this and say something.
  I can't really address the cast parts questions. I use expanding rubber wheels,3" x 1" with different grits of abrasive CLOTH,
not paper.I buy this in rolls and make my own abrasive bands. My favorite is aluminum oxide,preferred is any American make
if available.I made a modification to a bench grinder,an old American Rockwell that makes it into a grinding,polishing station
by making shafts that replace the nuts that hold the grinder wheels on. The left side has left hand threads but I have the tools
to do that job.On a Chinese made grinder,I have no idea about the threads.
Getting on to files,I still have some old American made ones and some Swiss and British made ones.I have these in cuts that range from
very coarse to #8 which has,according to the maker,Baiter (Biter)233 teeth per in.These odd files are an accumulation of over 50 years and
purchased at random in flea markets.I have also several sets of fine German files that were a gift from a German Black Powder Club
in Koln (Kern) in 1980.Files are a very personal tool and if you see some you can use,get them if possible.I do use a tapping fluid with
fine cut files from time to time that helps with a nice finish.
Cast tumblers and other cast internal parts are really out of my area of expertise.I hear all kinds of things,good and not so good but
not too much is published about problems,at least here on this forum.Same for sears,flys and mainsprings.I don't use them or want them
as can be seen in the "4 pin" lock shown on this forum. Only the hammer is cast,the rest is me and my filing.
I'm sorry I can't be more specific about this type of work but all of us have different approaches to areas of work and some work,some don't.

Bob Roller

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #14 on: April 05, 2017, 03:16:18 PM »
Bob,
Since all that I read on this great site, it seems you win the vote on the most knowledgable and professional lock maker alive today. I am trying to improve my lock preparation and thought I, as well as others novice builders on this site might learn some new techniques from you. You mentioned the fine and fancy detailing done at your bench with an assortment of files of different cuts and shapes, grinding and polishing. Can you offer some suggestions on good steps with files or polishing grits to take a cast lock plate or other cast part from an as cast condition to one finished and acceptable to leave bright or grayed or aged. Thanks and wish you were still producing as it would be great to have one of your fine locks on one of my flinters.
elkhorne

Elkhorne,
I don't claim the title of most knowledgeable on anything.I saw a modern double barrel,cased flintlock rifle
at the CLA show two years ago that had a pair of locks of really exquisite craftsmanship.The hours that went into
just the locks had to be stunning.I think Jim Chambers knows who the maker is and maybe he'll see this and say something.
  I can't really address the cast parts questions. I use expanding rubber wheels,3" x 1" with different grits of abrasive CLOTH,
not paper.I buy this in rolls and make my own abrasive bands. My favorite is aluminum oxide,preferred is any American make
if available.I made a modification to a bench grinder,an old American Rockwell that makes it into a grinding,polishing station
by making shafts that replace the nuts that hold the grinder wheels on. The left side has left hand threads but I have the tools
to do that job.On a Chinese made grinder,I have no idea about the threads.
Getting on to files,I still have some old American made ones and some Swiss and British made ones.I have these in cuts that range from
very coarse to #8 which has,according to the maker,Baiter (Biter)233 teeth per in.These odd files are an accumulation of over 50 years and
purchased at random in flea markets.I have also several sets of fine German files that were a gift from a German Black Powder Club
in Koln (Kern) in 1980.Files are a very personal tool and if you see some you can use,get them if possible.I do use a tapping fluid with
fine cut files from time to time that helps with a nice finish.
Cast tumblers and other cast internal parts are really out of my area of expertise.I hear all kinds of things,good and not so good but
not too much is published about problems,at least here on this forum.Same for sears,flys and mainsprings.I don't use them or want them
as can be seen in the "4 pin" lock shown on this forum. Only the hammer is cast,the rest is me and my filing.
I'm sorry I can't be more specific about this type of work but all of us have different approaches to areas of work and some work,some don't.

Bob Roller

One thing more about files. I buy the Harbor Freight needle files and if need be I won't hesitate to grind them to another shape.
They are  cheap and seem to work.
Bob

Offline elkhorne

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Re: Roller locks
« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2017, 04:42:22 AM »
Bob,
Thank you very much as many of us are learning as we go and I am trying to learn and try new techniques as I hear about them.
I have several grits of emery paper down to 600 and maybe finer so I will try to make some bands of them overlapping the cloth and gluing it. I will experiment with some scrap steel I have sitting around.
I also have been picking up (some say collecting) any American made files I find for several years. Also, I have started purchasing some from Gesswein or other suppliers that are Swiss. Can only get a few due to costs. Good to hear about the Harbor Freight needle files as we have had God luck with their chisels and great to reshape. Thanks as I am always learning from reading the experiences of you much more experienced members.
elkhorne