Glue?

[n stephenson]

I recently had to do a repair on a rifle blank . A piece of wood had  broken loose . I stained it first then used super glue and, clamps . I almost never got it to hold. It seems good now . My question is about the gel super glue. I`ve heard it mentioned here . Is it better , stronger, more invisible, etc. Does anyone use it ?  Are there better glues for this purpose? . Thanks for the help.   Nate

[Mike Brooks]

I probably would have used some type of Elmer's wood glue or heavy duty epoxy for something like that.  I like the "Gorilla Glue" brand of super glue gel, and I like the gel over regular. I use the super glue gel stuff mainly for small repairs.
 Now, for those of you who ignore advice from those with experience, try axel grease...best !@*%&@ glue ever.

[n stephenson]

Mike ,I first thought about using epoxy but, I was trying to keep the line as invisible as possible . I should have just went with it. What advantage does the gel have?  What about visibility ? Staining etc.

[Mike Brooks]

In general I don't know how strong any of the super glues are when compared to other glues. I like the gel because it stays where I put it. As with all glues , stain all of the surrounding wood before you glue.

[JNG3]

Mike, will any ole grease do or do I need a premium grease like a Ashland product? Inquiring minds need to know!

I've had great success with regular Titebond or plain Elmers when glueing down splinters or repairing damaged wood when there is a split.

[Joe S.]

I probably would have used some type of Elmer's wood glue or heavy duty epoxy for something like that.  I like the "Gorilla Glue" brand of super glue gel, and I like the gel over regular. I use the super glue gel stuff mainly for small repairs.
 Now, for those of you who ignore advice from those with experience, try axel grease...best !@*%&@ glue ever.

LOL,with only three hundred plus gun builds under your belt and a bum shoulder what could you possibly know

[okawbow]

I know that most people don't want to go to the trouble, but hot hide glue will made a strong and almost invisible glue joint. Just look at the center joints of violin plates. There are 500 year old violins with the butt joint on the plates holding perfectly after being under 75 # pressure for all that time.

A hot hide glue joint is also reversible with a little steam if needed. The glue also cleans up completely with warm water.

I've used hot hide glue to replace splinters and for repairs with good success. I don't stain the wood first. The glue line seems to take on the color of the wood around it, and is not obvious.

[jerrywh]

 I will tell you there is a problem with super glue for repairs on maple. As most of you know the spot should be stained before applying the glue to maple. Super glue will bleach out the stain from the spot at times and leaves a strange looking place that can be hard to cover in the finish. There is a new glue out that it translucent.   It works better than anything I have seen yet.  It is made by titebond

[Scota4570]

Another hobby of mine is giant scale RC airplanes.  Glue is used for all assembly.  For low stress areas CA glue is used.  I tend to use mostly medium viscosity and a spritz of accelerator.  It is my observation that the accelerator only hardens the outside instantly.   The inside has time to soak in and get better strength.  Basically it holds it in place while the middle dries.  For places where strength matters slow set epoxy is the best glue. Thick CA is second best.  Engine mounts and spar joints etc are doen with epoxy, period.  Those joints will probably get reinforced with dowels and fiber glass.  IF a glue joint fails you may crash and destroy a plane costing thousands.  It has happend to me, it is a pretty sick feeling.   

So what does that mean for guns?  I use thin or medium ca, with accelerator for tacking down in letting errors.  For major repairs I use slow set epoxy with dowels of some kind.  As for reversible, I don't care.  I want it to hold forever, I have no reason to undo my repair.  I am not a museum curator, I dont work on valuable antiques.  I cannot get hide glue at the hardware store, and I don't have a glue pot.  I have no reason to go there.  I would not use white glue or carpenters glue either, I cannot see a good reason to do so. Slow set epoxy is the gold standard for strength.   

No glue is stainable.  Plan accordingly and make a tight joint. 

[P.W.Berkuta]

I recently had to do a repair on a rifle blank . A piece of wood had  broken loose . I stained it first then used super glue and, clamps . I almost never got it to hold. It seems good now . My question is about the gel super glue. I`ve heard it mentioned here . Is it better , stronger, more invisible, etc. Does anyone use it ?  Are there better glues for this purpose? . Thanks for the help.   Nate

I NEVER had any luck with the CA glues. They don't bond wood for me - on plastic it works but not wood. I use TiteBond wood glue works 100% of the time.

[EC121]

Super thin CA will work where the break is in the grain, and the wood can be put back together.  It will wick into the grain.  Stain resistance is also a factor.  It doesn't seem to work that well on gluing flat wood surfaces together, and it is brittle.  Slow setting Titebond or epoxy will soak into flat wood better.  Really depends on what the wood is doing and how long you want to wait.  If it is supporting a DA150, it needs epoxy and firewall braces.  For stock splinters and cracks other glues will work.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

A friend was helping me unload the truck upon returning from a shoot, and my shotgun slid out of it's case onto the toe of the butt, sending two eight inch long splits up the buttstock almost parallel to the bottom line of the stock.  He was sick.  I said not to worry...no pieces missing and clean cracks.
I clamped the gun in rubber pads in my machinist's vise, spread the crack as much as I dared, and hydraulicked Elmer's carpenter's glue down the cracks as far as it would go.  I clamped the stock closed, wiped off the glue that squirted out of the cracks with warm water on a cloth, and let it cure.  Finally, I scraped off the overflow, light sanding, stain to match and some tung oil to re-finish.  The cracks are invisible.  A little bruise on the horn butt plate on this old double is all that remains of a catastrophe.

Elmer's Carpenter's Glue.

[Mark Elliott]

I use Titebond III for wood repairs while building a gun.   For repair/restoration work,  I use thin CA for tight cracks and T88 epoxy for most anything else.  I have also used hide glue for some repair work, but it is very difficult to use and there is no reason not to use Titebond III where you might use hide glue.     They are ALL reversible.  I have disassembled botched restoration jobs with copious amounts of water based glues (hide, Titebond, Elmers, etc..), epoxy, and CA.   Vinegar dissolves all the water based glues.   Acetone dissolves epoxy.   Nitro methane dissolves CA.   

[bob in the woods]

I would recommend "Titebond ".  for ease of use and for strength.  Pretty much the same as Taylor 's use of carpenter's glue.
The finished repair should pretty much disappear.

[docone]

If superglue is being used, and it does not "grab", wiping baking soda on the joint will act as an accelerant. Oils reject the superglue,either skin oil, or other, and the cyanocrylate will not set on anything but fingers etc. It makes a good joint.

[Waksupi]

I generally use Titebond III for repairs. It's what we used to do the stock laminations for Serengeti Rifles. They were field tested from Alaska to Africa with no delaminations or failures.
 
I'm suspicious of the holding power of the super glues. YOu CAN make they set up faster with baking soda or water, but that causes a white mess to deal with. I use it very rarely.

Gorrilla Glue can leave a visible yellowish line, even on a well clamped piece.

I've not used hide glue for stock repair, but I do use it when building violins. A good glue where disassembly may be needed.
Hide glue is very easy to find. Go to the grocery store in the section with the Jello. Look for unflavored gelatin. That is pure food grade hide glue. 

[n stephenson]

Thanks everyone for your input, I will be looking into getting some Titebond 3 .  Thanks Nate

[BOB HILL]

Always something to learn on this forum. Marc thanks for the info on dissolving the different glues and thanks Waksupi for the tip on unflavored gelatin. I'll have to make a note of these should I need them in the future. Thanks again to all of y'all for all the things you share here.    Bob

[bgf]

The yellow Elmer's carpenters glue is about the strongest wood to wood joint you can make.  If you feel you need extreme water resistance, tightbond 3 is good too.  I see no reason to use epoxy or super glue for wood to wood joint.

When my son was younger, I tested the wood glue pretty extensively on wooden toys. Several times the toys would break again, but outside the first glue joint.  The glue joint was stronger than the wood.

[Darkhorse]

A friend was helping me unload the truck upon returning from a shoot, and my shotgun slid out of it's case onto the toe of the butt, sending two eight inch long splits up the buttstock almost parallel to the bottom line of the stock.  He was sick.  I said not to worry...no pieces missing and clean cracks.
I clamped the gun in rubber pads in my machinist's vise, spread the crack as much as I dared, and hydraulicked Elmer's carpenter's glue down the cracks as far as it would go.  I clamped the stock closed, wiped off the glue that squirted out of the cracks with warm water on a cloth, and let it cure.  Finally, I scraped off the overflow, light sanding, stain to match and some tung oil to re-finish.  The cracks are invisible.  A little bruise on the horn butt plate on this old double is all that remains of a catastrophe.

Elmer's Carpenter's Glue.

I agree with Taylor 100% on Elmer's glue. I was nearing the end of a build when I split out about 8" of the forend, it started in the center of the end of the stock and angled down until it split out almost clean. There was just the tiniest bit of wood left where the splinter exited the stock, just enough to act as a hinge. Elmer's glue is always on my work bench so put a thin coat on both sides of the split. Then using the front barrel pin and the hinge I got the 2 pieces back in place and clamped both sides together. I wiped all the excess glue off on both sides of the stock. Then let it sit for a couple of days. I did not apply any stain to the area.
When I finished filing and sanding the stock I could hardly find the split. Now that the rifle's stained and finished it's even tougher to find it. That's been over 10 years ago and that rifle is one of my main shooters.
I don't care to try any of the new super glue's as Elmer's has proven itself to hold and to almost disappear when the gun is finished.

[Dan Fruth]

I would use hide glue. You can buy it already mixed under the name of "Old Brown Glue". Follow the directions. It was the only glue back in the day, and RCA gun #2 shows a patchbox lid that has seperated, originally a 2 piece lid. The glue failed only because George Shumway had a terrible fire, and the gun was scorched and it failed. The glue held for over 200 years. Thats good enough for me to use hide glue for gun work....Dan

[Waksupi]

I would use hide glue. You can buy it already mixed under the name of "Old Brown Glue". Follow the directions. It was the only glue back in the day, and RCA gun #2 shows a patchbox lid that has seperated, originally a 2 piece lid. The glue failed only because George Shumway had a terrible fire, and the gun was scorched and it failed. The glue held for over 200 years. Thats good enough for me to use hide glue for gun work....Dan

The modern hide glue like Franklin's has a delaying agent in it, causing it to set up slower to allow longer part positioning times. Not that hide glue sets up that fast, itself. If you use the Franklin's and want a somewhat faster set up, add a smidge of vinegar. 

[Stoner creek]

Mike, will any ole grease do or do I need a premium grease like a Ashland product? Inquiring minds need to know!

I've had great success with regular Titebond or plain Elmers when glueing down splinters or repairing damaged wood when there is a split.

That JB Wood weld is strong and will stain.