Another Reason Not to Donate To A Museum

[Majorjoel]

There was a recent post made here a short while ago about donating a collection of longrifles to a museum.

The majority of reply's were against the idea and perhaps for good reason, as this news story brings up a lot of potential problems and situations that could easily change an artifact placed in the public trust..............

https://www.yahoo.com/news/nightmare-museum-art-auction-triggers-ethics-dispute-144655231.html

[ptk1126]

I think a better reason is sloppiness/malfeasance on the part of museum staff.

I had visited a local historical society which allowed me to measure and photograph
several guns in their collection (none of which were on display).

On a return visit they kindly allowed me to access their computer inventory to select
several additional rifles for study. I requested any of 4-5 flintlocks, none of which they could find.
Their comment was "Well, we probably de-acquisitioned (?) them and neglected to update the inventory".

I have around 15 antique guns (probably none of them worth more than several thousand $$) and
would NEVER consider donating them to a museum. I would rather sell then cheaply to people who would
enjoy them.

All the best
Paul

[Hungry Horse]

So, it better to keep the antique longrifles squirreled away in your closet? All three of the longrifles I own came from the estate sales, of guys that think you can't trust museums.They were on the verge of being sold as room decorators for restaurants, or stripped for their parts, when I bought them. Only one needed repair work.
 I know museums at times dispose of acquisitions that some people think should be retained. But, for most museums, the finances are all out go, and very little or no income. Frankly it's a miracle that most county museums are able to keep their doors open. Most counties start their annual round of budget cuts with the local museum funding.
 The value of the artifacts verses the expenses required to maintain them, is another area most people are totally clueless about. Guns are high maintenance, and compared to some other artifacts, of relatively low value. Probably the only reason guns get any museum space at all is because they are one of the most popular exhibits a museum can have. That being said if a museum advertises their gun collection, they are painting a target on themselves. Gun thieves, and gun haters, will descend on the museum locus.
 I am the Vice President of the local nonprofit that financially supports the local museum system. Being the financial support system for our three museums, gives those of us involved in it some power over what should be retained, and what should be eliminated.
 It's not a perfect system by any means. But, it's better than guns getting hoarded up, and not getting studied, and displayed, in my opinion.

  Hungry Horse

[Feltwad]

I would never donate any firearms to a museum only if it is one that specialise in antique weapons most museums do not have  a knowledgeable staff to look after them. Most never see a drop of oil and are housed in damp places not displayed in a glass case . My 25 years research took me to several museums which certainly  left me no doubt of a poor future to our gun heritage .
Feltwad

[jdm]

I would say Collectors are the main reason we have a lot of the artifacts we have today. Somebody in the past cared enough to save something from our past  because they thought it was special.

[Hungry Horse]

I decided that instead of whining about how museum curators, and staff, often know little, or nothing, about antique firearms, I would do something about it. I offered to do a muzzleloading seminar, for the curator and staff, at my gun clubs range. I brought some firearms, both antique, and modern replicas, along with a wide array of tools, and accessories. It was supposed to be a two hour seminar, but I finally told them after three hours, that I had to relinquish the range. It was great.
  The curator asked what was the best way to display the guns, yet keep them safe. I suggested the clear plexiglass cases gun museums use that allow viewing from both sides. She also asked how best to do the conservation work. I suggested an offsite workshop with gun safes to keep firearms being conserved safe from vandals, and thieves. She talked to the County board of supervisors, who suggested a vacant bank the county owns, that still has a functioning vault.
 This is how you change things. Get involved.

  Hungry Horse

[WKevinD]

I decided that instead of whining about how museum curators, and staff, often know little, or nothing, about antique firearms, I would do something about it.
 This is how you change things. Get involved.

  Hungry Horse

Thanks for offering a thoughtful response to an issue.
It is easy to identify a problem, seems like something everyone is good at, but to offer a positive correction is a rare gift.
This is a breath of fresh air!

Kevin 

[MGillman]

I work at the Department of Museums in Wytheville, Va. Not only are we embracing our gunsmithing past of Jacob Shaffer, Honaker family and others. We are in the process of building a large education building to house a working gunsmith shop and blacksmith forge to educate young and old alike. We have a few longrifles currently in glass cases that were made here in Wythe County. We also have originals that come in with our volunteers when we have a lecture on Wythe rifles and such. I think it all depends on the museum system.

[Seth Isaacson]

I work at the Department of Museums in Wytheville, Va. Not only are we embracing our gunsmithing past of Jacob Shaffer, Honaker family and others. We are in the process of building a large education building to house a working gunsmith shop and blacksmith forge to educate young and old alike. We have a few longrifles currently in glass cases that were made here in Wythe County. We also have originals that come in with our volunteers when we have a lecture on Wythe rifles and such. I think it all depends on the museum system.

And the money within that system. Here in Illinois its been really sad watching the state funded historical sites deteriorate, cut staff, cut pay for positions, and do less and less to actually preserve and encourage understanding of our history. Lots of places are trying to depend solely on volunteers that previously had multiple full-time state employees.

[MGillman]

I work at the Department of Museums in Wytheville, Va. Not only are we embracing our gunsmithing past of Jacob Shaffer, Honaker family and others. We are in the process of building a large education building to house a working gunsmith shop and blacksmith forge to educate young and old alike. We have a few longrifles currently in glass cases that were made here in Wythe County. We also have originals that come in with our volunteers when we have a lecture on Wythe rifles and such. I think it all depends on the museum system.

And the money within that system. Here in Illinois its been really sad watching the state funded historical sites deteriorate, cut staff, cut pay for positions, and do less and less to actually preserve and encourage understanding of our history. Lots of places are trying to depend solely on volunteers that previously had multiple full-time state employees.

We have full time staff, part time staff and volunteers. We are partners with the Wythe County Historical Society as well.

[n stephenson]

The Tennessee State Museum in Nashville used to have some  original longrifles  on display and, I was told by someone that used to work there that they had a bunch that weren't on display. The last time I was there , which by the way will be the last time I ever waste my money there, there was none to be found . Instead there was a large "civil rights" display. Who knows ,they probably threw them in a dumpster !! I personally would NEVER donate a rifle to a museum . But this still is America , and, a person can do what they want with their own stuff .

[Cades Cove Fiddler]

  ... Wow, Nate ....That's a  shocker.... I haven't been to the Tn. St. Museum in over 10 years .... that's sad news ... also a lot of gun-making tools on  display, too ....The Russell Bean pistols were displayed.... Robin Hale was allowed to photograph the "archived" rifles several years back .... Hope someone still has the photos ..... Regards,  CC Fiddler ..... 

[Howard]

I was in Nashville two years ago & rifles, pistols, bowie knives were displayed as well as the old gunsmithing tools.  They still have plenty of other longrifles that are not on display.

[n stephenson]

They may have been resetting exhibits when I was there about a year ago, but I didn't see any. I hope that they are back out on display. They do have some nice stuff.

[Scota4570]

A good friend donated several very nice antique guns to a musuem out West.  He was very proud, he told me about it.  I encouraged him to make sure the guns would be displayed and not sold.  He was informed they would not be displayed and would be sold.  He demanded them back.   

"Loaned" items have a habbit of being lost or sold too.

Be very carefull with musuems guys. 

[ClaudeH]

Anyone contemplating historic firearms or other items to a museum, if they really care about preserving the items and having them displayed or at least available for study, should talk to a lawyer about a better way of doing it than outright gift.

I believe a charitable trust could be stablished to receive the items.  If written correctly, the trust would qualify the estate or individual for a charitable tax deduction for donating the items to the trust.  In turn the trust would >loan< the items to the chosen museum on the condition that they be displayed or at least available for study.

Done this way the museum would be liable if the items were lost or degraded and they could not be sold.

[Majorjoel]

When I wrote this post, it was because of what had happened to artifacts that were in this particular museum and put up for sale to pay for museum expenses.

My concerns were only meant to enlighten future contributors of the many pitfalls that "could" take place under such circumstances where there may be mismanagement, no public interest (our love for the longrifle is not shared by the majority) etc.

My honest opinion is that a good museum that shares with the general public the collections and the knowledge of those that took the time to present the HISTORY of such, to be the best thing since butter was put to bread!

To be able to see actual history on display has always been one of the best experiences of my life. It has added so much to my understanding and has lit a fire within to go further. 

Sadly, it is when the few that do not share in our interests, get into positions that control our interests........
make for empty displays that were there once upon a time.........given in trust by those of us who truly cared..............................................................................................

 

[RAT]

I've been to gun shows where original muzzleloaders have been for sale that still had the museum catalog number on them. Were they sold by the museum? Stolen? Who knows?

[45-110]

I worked for a western history museum for a spell awhile back. went from exhibits to curator to temporary director. we had a medium sized firearm collection and a large saddle collection. at one point i asked if the weapons had ever been checked to see if any where loaded......got a big blank look from the staff. our new director and two of the curators where cut from the same liberal-cultural academic cloth and felt guns where the blunt instruments of that evil ugly thing called manifest destiny. why they where ever brought in was beyond me. so the internal staff philosophy would determine if i ever donated firearms. and yes museums do occasionally deaccession and sell off collection items.
kw

[Shreckmeister]

If you look above the side plate on the barrel are museum numbers on this one.  Allegedly from a
Museum in Columbia SC.



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