help shaping around the lock panel?

[Bigmon]

I have now built several or more rifles but just have not found a way that I like in forming / shaping out the area around the lock or the opposite side plate area??
I am just wondering if there might be some information on this fine site that would give me some help?
I looked at the tutorials under woodworking but didnt see anything.  Still I am hoping there might be something I have missed, as is often the case?
Thanks in advance

[moleeyes36]

Mike Brooks' tutorial http://americanlongrifles.org/PDF/tutorial.pdf covers it starting about page 51.

Mole Eyes

[Wolfshead]

I have now built several or more rifles but just have not found a way that I like in forming / shaping out the area around the lock or the opposite side plate area??
I am just wondering if there might be some information on this fine site that would give me some help?
I looked at the tutorials under woodworking but didnt see anything.  Still I am hoping there might be something I have missed, as is often the case?
Thanks in advance

Not sure what day you were at Dixon's but Dave Pearson did a great seminar on cutting lock moldings and beaver tails on Saturday.
Some things he said were on the flats around the lock make the top flat a little thinner than the bottom as it has an optical illusion and helps to make it look better.
He also said not to worry "too" much about the two side being exactly semetrical as you only look at one side at a time.
Another thing he said was to carry the beaver tail down into the wrist by following the ridge formed by rounding the top of the wrist and the bottom.
I am not sure if this is what you were looking for or if I did a very good job in explaining but I hope it helps.

[Turtle]

For some reason I have more trouble getting this right than any other job. Entry thimbles-duck soup, butt plate inlet fine ect -but lock panels? not so good. I could have used that demo.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

A mistake that I made for years was to use a 3/8" rat tailed file to cut a concave trough around the rear end of the lock panels on longrifles.  This area is actually quite flat and is not as concave as the file will make it.  Studying Eric VonAuschwege's fine drawings will show this, especially his sectional views through the lock panels.  These studies are the very best next thing to being able to examine originals in person.
Sorry if I butchered your name, Eric!

[Bigmon]

THanks all for the in-put.
And that tutorial is absolutly great!  It covers the whole gun from beginning to end.
I cant down load it here at my house cause all I can get it dial up service.
But I visited my dear old Mother in her personal care home today and they have a public use computer there and I viewed it as much as I could.
I might be able to down load and print it at the local library?
I tried making that seminar at Dixons but I think it overlapped with another I watched.
Just so much to see.
Thanks again to all

[Herb]

I am building another Hawken inspired fullstock .50 caliber rifle for my antelope hunt.  I traced the lock panel from a full-sized enlargement of the Kit Carson rifle, then probably adjusted it some to this stock, don't remember.  I trace around the template onto poster board or a pizza box for stiffness, and then trace a duplicate of that for the left side, omitting the cut out for the snail.   I use the lock bolt to hold the two in position, adjusting the tails to the same measurement from the top of the wrist.

I cut out the panel with a small curved chisel, then smooth the cut with a 3/16" chain saw file and then with half round jewelers files, or a flat file.

Here I cut away some of the wood to better raise the panel above the stock.


images upload

[flehto]

I do the lock and side plate areas similar to Herb's and then after using a small gouge, use a 3/16 dia rasp and then a finer file. 220 grit paper wrapped around the 3/16  finishes up the radii.

I only build Lancaster and Bucks County LRs and use the same bottom outline,  but the lock surround varies w/ the lock plate. The top around the tang gets the same treatment, but the carving patterns differ according to the style.  Perhaps if other builders would post pics, the OP would get a pretty good idea of how it's done.

Shown below are 4 pics of a Bucks County LR's lock and side plate areas.......Fred

[L. Akers]

I think the delineation of the lockpanel will depend on the School you are workin in.  I have seen lock panels delineated by any radial degree of filet from a very gradual slope to being stabbed in at 90 degrees.  I would suggest looking at as many pictures and actual rifles as you can and try to duplicate what you see.   

[Acer Saccharum]

So much depends on the school of gun. This gun has a soft radius in front of the toe, but fairs out gently away from the lock panel along the bottom of the lock and sideplate, and sweeps softly away from the panels toward the tail. Any crisp delineation is done with low relief carving, as in the beavertails. I doubt anywhere the relief height is more than 1/32", as the finishing will make all of this 'pop'.

Some builders use a rat-tail file all the way around the lock panel, but again, it's school-specific.

A slight radius at the nose only, and then a gentle planing away from the mid panel to the guard area.


Then the relief line is cut between panel and guard.


Top edge of sideplate panel is a tapered slope, not a dished out hollow. While this may be right for this gun, it may not be for yours. Simply food for thought.


Then this photo is posted just to knock your sox off.


Not a lot of 'meat' around the lock. Not an even reveal, or flat, all the way around either. I like to look at a gun build as a soft, living thing; no straight lines, no hard geometry, it's all about the flow of form. What would it look like if it grew up as a creature of the air or water? Again, this is school specific advice, and this particular gun has much European influence, far more than American.

[taco650]

Glad I found this thread.  I am starting my second ever build and have the same questions about the lock area.  My kit came with the lock already inleted but I wanted to make the area around the lock look less clunky.  Thanks for all the replies from the experienced builders!

[smart dog]

Hi Taco,
Lots of good advice.  One thing is key, do not cut the lock panels too early in the shaping process.  Let them form naturally as you shape the wrist and lock area and cut the moldings after the stock is almost ready for final sanding or scraping.  If you cut them too early, the stock may end up a slab-sided with the cross section of a 2 by 4 with rounded corners.  You also will usually end up with a tight radius curve to the moldings, which may be OK for some styles but I don't care for it.  I never, ever cut moldings around the lock with a small gouge or rat-tailed file except around the front of the lock.

dave