Author Topic: Square vs round patches  (Read 17316 times)

Offline bones92

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1170
  • If it was easy, everyone would do it.
Square vs round patches
« on: September 09, 2017, 01:53:06 AM »
I am finally getting some pillow ticking set aside to make my own patches. I'm debating options for cutting round patches but I'm reading on various forums that square patches work every bit as well as round.

What is the general consensus regarding square versus round patches?
If it was easy, everyone would do it.

Black Hand

  • Guest
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2017, 02:06:20 AM »
Cutting round patches is a waste of time....

Rip the washed/dried cloth into strips, cut the strips into squares with shears (I use the EMT shears you can buy at Harbor Freight for $3.99) and you're done. Make a hundred patches in less than 10 minutes without any special tools/cutters.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2017, 02:12:44 AM by Black Hand »

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12842
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2017, 02:38:00 AM »
I cain't get square patches to shoot worth a hoot.
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline WadePatton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5272
  • Tennessee
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2017, 03:04:13 AM »
I cain't get square patches to shoot worth a hoot.

If you fold them and nip the corners, two at a time-making an octagon, and then align the corners of that octagon with the corners of your bbl, then

You cannot miss!

   :o ;D :o :P

Unless you has rounded bbl...
Hold to the Wind

Offline wattlebuster

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2040
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2017, 04:45:24 AM »
Round or square makes no difference in my guns. I used to cut them round then tried square an saw no advantage in the extra time to make em round. Cut a few of each an see if you can see any difference
Nothing beats the feel of a handmade southern iron mounted flintlock on a cold frosty morning

Offline okawbow

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 784
    • Black Rhino Longbows
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2017, 05:04:54 AM »
The corners on the square patches get in the way when I start the ball. The right sized round patch is less trouble. I use a round punch and stack the cloth, so I get many perfect round patches per strike. They all are the same, so that helps a little for accuracy, I feel.
As in life; itís the journey, not the destination. How you get there matters most.

Offline Don Steele

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 660
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2017, 12:59:19 PM »
There are times when I enjoy using pre-cut patches vs. cutting at the muzzle ( which has it's own rewards).
I have found pre-cutting ROUND patches is definitely NOT a waste of time.
My procedure: After cutting my patch material into measured strips, I use a small template and pen to draw appropriately sized circles on the material, next: cut between the circles making little squares. Now...and this is where it gets to be fun.  :).. cut out each little circle with a smooth continuous motion of my scissors.
I got a really nice pair of LEFTHAND Fiskars scissors last year for a Christmas present and let me tell you, sharp scissors really make a difference..!!
Ya'll may think it's a waste of time, and please note that nowhere in this conversation am I discussing things like "Group size", "ease of loading" or "historical correctness".
Fact is...sitting in my Gun Room with the radio playing quietly in the background calmly slicing out little cloth circles with sharp scissors is a VERY relaxing way to spend some spare time.  8)
I will admit however that I keep the door closed. There's something about a crazy old guy sitting in a corner cutting out little cloth circles that doesn't need to be put out for public view.  ::)

Look at the world with a smilin' eye and laugh at the devil as his train rolls by...(Alison Krauss)

Offline bones92

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1170
  • If it was easy, everyone would do it.
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2017, 01:38:42 PM »
Also, what is an ideal patch diameter for a round patch suitable for .45 and .50?  I see some variation in size among factory cut patches.

There is a 1.25" hollow punch on Amazon that looks decent.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2017, 02:08:38 PM by bones92 »
If it was easy, everyone would do it.

Offline Joe S.

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1932
  • the other Joe S.
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2017, 03:12:52 PM »
I cain't get square patches to shoot worth a hoot.
probably cuts the crust of his samiches ;D

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12842
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2017, 05:20:19 PM »
Also, what is an ideal patch diameter for a round patch suitable for .45 and .50?  I see some variation in size among factory cut patches.

There is a 1.25" hollow punch on Amazon that looks decent.
Start a ball in the barrel with your patch material under it. Cut it at the muzzle. Load. Shoot. Find patch. Use as pattern.
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

n stephenson

  • Guest
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2017, 05:44:28 PM »
I wrestled with this question years ago . I finally decided , just to quit using patches all together, patches are overrated , square or round. I just take a .45 RB and ram it down my.40 cal. Seals up TIGHT! One less thing to worry about.

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12842
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2017, 08:05:54 PM »
I wrestled with this question years ago . I finally decided , just to quit using patches all together, patches are overrated , square or round. I just take a .45 RB and ram it down my.40 cal. Seals up TIGHT! One less thing to worry about.
Where there is a will, there is a way..... :o
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline bones92

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1170
  • If it was easy, everyone would do it.
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2017, 08:11:29 PM »
Given that most .45 and .50 caliber rifles shoot the same sizes of ball, I figured someone here could recommend a patch diameter.

Failing any input here, I will order a 1.25" hollow punch, which should suffice for either caliber.
If it was easy, everyone would do it.

Offline Daryl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14391
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2017, 08:17:16 PM »
1 1/4" to 1 1/2" is good for .69's to .75's.

1 1/8" Arch Punch will work for up to .58's and .62's.

I use 7/8" to 1" for .45's and .50's.

3/4" will be fine for .32 to .36, but 7/8" gives
 
more room for error in centering the ball in a .40.

roughly speaking.

I like the convenience of round patches - there are no absolutes &

to make one saying cutting round patches is a waste of time, is a silly

 thing to say in my opinion.

Arch punches can be used with a HDPE or UHMW 'cutting' block for cutting

up to 10 layers at a time.  Usually takes 4 or 5 hammer blows to go through

that many, but cuts 10 patches at a time.

Friend Ron uses a circle cutter he mounts in a drill press to go through an inch

of patch material at a time. The cloth is sandwiched between two pieces of ply

that is clamped so it does not spin around and rip your fingers off.

Bearing races with heavy equipment ball bearings (single patch at a time-1 blow) is

a method many people use a lot up here.  I prefer an Arch Punch as it cuts more patches each time.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2017, 08:24:37 PM by Daryl »
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline P.W.Berkuta

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2090
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2017, 08:48:25 PM »
Given that most .45 and .50 caliber rifles shoot the same sizes of ball, I figured someone here could recommend a patch diameter.

Failing any input here, I will order a 1.25" hollow punch, which should suffice for either caliber.
Do as Mike Brooks says - lay the patch material (lubed) over the muzzle, push the ball into the muzzle until slightly below flush - cut the material then using a ball puller pull out the ball/patch combination and measure the patch - simple pimple. I find either a square or round patch works for me. I made a patch cutter out of O-1 and put it in my drill press and cut 40 or so out at one time. I have one cutter for each caliber that I shoot.
"The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person who is doing it." - Chinese proverb

Offline taco650

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 122
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2017, 10:43:51 PM »
I cut my pillow ticking into 1.5" strips, then lay the end over the muzzle,  put ball on & start it, then cut the other end off and send it down. Am over thinking this? 🙄🙄

Offline hanshi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5288
  • My passion is longrifles!
    • martialartsusa.com
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #16 on: September 09, 2017, 11:54:03 PM »
I've always cut square patches because it was so easy to do so.  I already have the various size punches so may give pounding out round ones a try.  Square patches are okay for target and match shooting, but avoid using square patches for hunting; square patches will kill anything in the bush that you shoot at.  8)
!Jozai Senjo! "always present on the battlefield"
Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.

Offline rich pierce

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18475
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #17 on: September 10, 2017, 12:15:59 AM »
I cut my pillow ticking into 1.5" strips, then lay the end over the muzzle,  put ball on & start it, then cut the other end off and send it down. Am over thinking this? 🙄🙄

Apparently we are underthinking it.
Andover, Vermont

Offline Sharpsman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • "There ain't no freedom...without gunpowder!"
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #18 on: September 10, 2017, 12:34:16 AM »
Don't make a hoots bit of difference if they're triangular....as long as they're cut at the muzzle!

PRB by Sharps Man, on Flickr
"There ain't no freedom...without gunpowder!"

Offline Darkhorse

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1630
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #19 on: September 10, 2017, 10:38:34 AM »
I started out cutting at the muzzle and I still cut at the muzzle. That's why we have patch knives.
This may be too simple for some but I find it makes a perfect patch every time regardless of caliber.
American horses of Arabian descent.

Offline bones92

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1170
  • If it was easy, everyone would do it.
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #20 on: September 10, 2017, 02:14:46 PM »
Cutting a patch at the muzzle should yield a patch that is half the circumference plus 2 times the radius for a ball exactly flush with the muzzle.  So for a diameter (d) of a .490 ball...

(.5 x 3.14(d)) + d,  or about 1.259"

So a 1.25" punch yields a patch equivalent to cutting at the muzzle.

If it was easy, everyone would do it.

Offline oldtravler61

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4159
  • We all make mistakes.
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #21 on: September 10, 2017, 04:07:14 PM »
  Let's see, I cut patch at muzzle. Ram ball on to powder charge. Take aim an shoot poker chip at 25 yards. Good enough for me. This is all starting to get WAY to technical for me........  But carry on...See yeah on page five...Me I'm going to the range an have fun...
   Oldtravler

n stephenson

  • Guest
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #22 on: September 10, 2017, 04:19:24 PM »
  Let's see, I cut patch at muzzle. Ram ball on to powder charge. Take aim an shoot poker chip at 25 yards. Good enough for me. This is all starting to get WAY to technical for me........  But carry on...See yeah on page five...Me I'm going to the range an have fun...
   Oldtravler
Mike , are you saying that your a member of the KISS club? Keeping It Super Simple

Offline smylee grouch

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7381
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #23 on: September 10, 2017, 10:18:00 PM »
I have some luck finding hole saws at pawn shops and yard sales. I then grind off the teeth and spin it in the drill press and file a cutting edge on the outside of the hole saw and some times use a diamond stone to put a fine edge on the filed edge. I usualy cut about 12 patches with these at a time.

Offline oldtravler61

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4159
  • We all make mistakes.
Re: Square vs round patches
« Reply #24 on: September 10, 2017, 11:48:35 PM »
  Yep Nate that's exactly what I'm saying.
  Didn't get into this sport to become a rocket scientist... I mean really do yeah think it really makes that much difference. Maybe it does to some an that's fine.
  But if I can pop a squirrels head out to 40 yards. An a Big game animals lungs out to 75-80 yards. That works for me.
 Never did have any interest in punching paper targets except to sight in. Besides it tastes terrible.
If I can't eat it I don't shoot it. Except for coyotes.... me really dislikes them.. But hey whatever floats your boat.  But I like it simple...Oldtravler.  aka another Mike but no B