Pirates Ammo

[long carabine]

 A friend of mine dropped a very old  round ball in my hand this morning. It was recovered from the ocean floor off of Key Largo, Fla in the early 70's. I measured it and it appears to be a 70 to 79 cal round ball. It has been estimated that the date of it is 1702 to 1740's or thereabout. The lead is very hard unlike the lead that we use today. If only the round ball could talk.....what a story it could tell! Long Carabine

[Harnic]

Cool find LC!  Wouldn't it be great if history could talk so we wouldn't have to rely on "scholar's" limited imaginations? 

[Levy]

I just measured 4 matchlock musket balls that were turned in to the State of Florida the other day from the wreck of the San Miguel De Archangel (ca. 1659).  They measure anywhere from .80-.83 cal.  The wreck is located just south of the Jupiter Inlet, in the swimming area.  The inlet is a real catch all as you might imagine and they turned in a forward ramrod pipe from a Brown Bess and an Irish shotcharger.  The smaller arquebus size is usually in the mid to lower .60's.

James Levy

[T*O*F]

The lead is very hard unlike the lead that we use today.

Lead is lead.  It's hard because it has a hard outer shell from sitting on the ocean bottom for so long.

[Daryl]

Size-wise it could be from a Bess or 'grape' from smaller bore cannon fire - swivels, etc..

[long carabine]

Also found were pieces of 8. He discovered under a half dozen gold coins. 

[trentOH]

In the early 80's I found an old RB about 50 caliber, close to Old Fort Niagara. I just examined it, and it too is quite hard. i don't have a hardness tester other than my thumbnails, but they don't dent it. It was not submerged, but it was hard.

[Daryl]

Round balls needn't be in or on the ground very long before they look very old.  Oxidation makes even balls that are only a couple years old, look down-right ancient.  Hardened lead balls are popular in some regions for big game hunting today - maybe it isn't an old ball? Shot in the late fall or winter time when snow is on the ground, it is found in the spring, looking very old and ancient.

Tin was used for hardening balls in the 19th century for large game shooting - as well as mixing murcury with molten lead to harden them slightly.  I've done that and didn't make them as hard as WW - but they are heavier than pure lead of the same size.

The battles around Fort Niagara, seems to me were shot with .69 cal US muskets using .64 calibre balls and British Muskets shooting .70 calibre balls.

[Collector]

Grape shot, for cannon/artillery, was made of iron ball and not lead.  Not to say that lead balls couldn't be used as a substitute, just that iron was the standard.

[Daryl]

Lead balls were used in US 'grape' in their land cannons during the indian wars inside the cointinental USA. I figured they were probably also used in their ships as well during the civil war. That might be a mistaken assumption on my part.

[Levy]

Daryl is right about it being loaded in swivel-guns.  I unloaded one that was marked with a fleur di lis on the breech and it had 32 musket sized lead balls in it.  Another had an iron shot and five lead balls in it, one of which had been rolled out into a cylinder.  I unloaded a cannon from the 1715 Plate Fleet that was loaded with a cannonball and a barshot.  Glad I didn't have to fire that one from the shoulder.

The strangest projectiles for a musket that we've found were in a wooden box full of split shot.  The balls were cast in halves with a loop of wire in each half that was twisted and joined one half to the other.  When it was fired and opened up, it was 5-6" in length and would make an awful wound.

James Levy

[Ben I. Voss]

Levy, might the split shot have been used on ships rigging, perhaps?

[long carabine]

 I also had a piece of eight  shown to me by the same person which I photocopied to do a little research on. Interesting stuff. Long carabine

[Leprechaun]

Also found were pieces of 8.

Hmmmmm, would four 2's be considered "pieces of 8"?.....I wonder.

[joelvca]

Lead balls were used in US 'grape' in their land cannons during the indian wars inside the cointinental USA. I figured they were probably also used in their ships as well during the civil war. That might be a mistaken assumption on my part.

I suspect that we may have a problem in terminology coming in.  "Grape shot" was a bunch of ~2/5± caliber iron balls stacked on a wooden base and covered with cloth to keep them together; it was largely a naval, not land, munition.  "Canister" or "Case" was a container, usually of tin or tinned iron, full of smaller iron or lead balls, used more often on land but also at sea.  Grape was preferred most of the time at sea because the balls often had to penetrate some of the ship before getting to the personnel.  The balls in canister used at sea were often more robust for the same reason.  On land, it was usually a purely-anti-personnel munition, and was commonly just filled with musket balls, or something not too much larger.

Regards,
Joel

[Daryl]

yes - US military land cannon canister was comprised of the balls for the .69's which were .640" until about 1820, then changed to .650 inches.

As far as finding a .64 or .65 call at sea - there was a lot of shooting, ship to ship with muskets and losts of missing and sooner or later they'd fall into the sea, or stores of ammo would go down with the ship.

[54ball]

 Since we are on the subject of cannon shot.  In the  mid 1780s a British naval Lieutenant developed the exploding canister shot.  I believe his first name was Henry, we all know his last name, Shrapnel!

[Levy]

I suppose the lead musket size splitshot could've been used against the rigging, but it seems a little bit light for those purposes.  It certainly seemed to be fairly common on the 1715 Plate Fleet here in Florida.  Cannon shot also came in barshot, expanding barshot, chain shot and splitshot which would've been more effective against the rigging.

James Levy

[northmn]

Stringing shot as described is an old trick.  It works with heavy monofiliment in a modern shell.  While I do not know its accuracy, up close it blows an awful hole.  I blew about an 8 inch hole in an old refridgerator with a load like that at about 30 yards many years ago.  Its supposed to string out in a straight line but mostly it globs together and keeps a tight pattern. 

DP

[Daryl]

DP - I'll about lay odds a strung load of, say, 360" split balls with wire, fired in a large bore (10?) with very slow twist would shoot a nice flat tight pattern!(depending on the twist and length of wire, of course.  I can just about visualize what effect 9 to 15 of those would make on something's hide, from a 140" or so twist barrel.