Repro Trade Gun Locks

[Hudnut]

Forty odd years ago, I was involved in manufacturing reproduction NW guns.
This is one of our locks on a gun that I made in the late 70s, using some left over parts.  Barrel is a North Star, stock is cherry, whittled out of a board.  The Barnett and circle fox are stamped.

This is another of our locks, plate was never marked.

This lock was assembled using our parts on a plate from the Upper Missouri Trading Company.  The W Chance and tombstone IA fox mark are cast in.

The dies for casting the waxes for our lock were made using parts from an original lock borrowed from Charles Hanson at the Museum of the Fur Trade.  It was W Chance, tombstone IA.  New, never installed replacement lock.  We had the Chance and tombstone removed from the lock plate die, and had stamps made.
I very much suspect that UMTC borrowed the same  lock, to make their dies.

[Justin Urbantas]

those are some nice looking locks. I have a few trade guns to build, and have been looking around for something better than the plain old Barnett lock.

[ddoyle]

Rare to see a NWTG Trigger Guard that actually matches the musket in material and construction. You nailed it.  For such a plain feature it makes a huge difference. My personel favorites are the ones that left Ann William's shop. 

[Hudnut]

The serpent, trigger and trigger guard from which our dies were made were from one of the 1812 War period guns with Board of Ordnance marks.  I cannot recall the contractor.  We did not copy the lock on that gun, because it was of the unbridled pattern.

[Curtis]

Nice locks!  I would like to see more of that trade gun...

Curtis

[Hudnut]

I'll take some photos later.

[Hudnut]

Barrel is a 30" North Star.  When we were making them, the barrels were machined from 1 13/16 x 36 blanks.

[Daryl]

They were pretty neat - had one in 12 bore, weighed 5 1/2 pounds & is likely the reason I have a flinching problem today with flinters.

Wish I still had it, though.

[rich pierce]

I have a similar lock but the cock is somewhat different where it holds the top jaw.  Any info on this one?  I believe it’s a repro and a couple parts have casting lines. 

[Hudnut]

The internals of your lock are different, as is the cock.

[rich pierce]

Any ideas on who made it or what period it would be appropriate for?

[Mtn Meek]

Rich,

Your lock was probably assembled from Upper Missouri Trading Co. parts.  Your cock has the same shaped spur.



Track of the Wolf offered a partially assembled lock using the UMTC parts in the early 1980's.



W. Chance & Son NW Trade Guns were being imported into the US in the early 1840's by the American Fur Company.  After Astor sold the AFC, Pierre Chouteau & Co. purchased NW Trade Guns from William Chance into the 1850's.

This lock would be appropriate for a late period NW Trade Gun.  I have a trade gun that was built by Michael Hayes in Feb 1979 that used the UMTC lock.




The Michael Hayes NW Trade Gun has a number of features consistent with this late period such as trigger guard finials and screws versus nails in the butt plate.

[rich pierce]

Very nice, Phil!  Would you recommend 14 or 20 ga and 36” barrel if I was to build it up?

[Mtn Meek]

My M. Hayes trade gun is 20 gauge with a 36" barrel and handles real nice.

During the fur trade, 24 and 28 balls-to-the-pound were the most common size bores for trade guns.  Of course, those are measurements of the size of the ball to which one must add "windage" to get the bore size.  A 24 balls-to-the-pound would be equivalent to a modern 20 gauge and 28 balls-to-the-pound would be equivalent to a modern .58 caliber.  Those would be the HC sizes of bore, but of course, you could go larger such as 12 or 14 gauge if you want.

James Gordon in his Great Gunmakers For The Early West states that "the records of the Pierre Chouteau Co. reveal that Northwest gun barrels were ordered in a great variety of lengths, from 30, 33, 36, 39, 42, to 48 inches.  This exceeds the variety offered by the HBC."  That gives you a lot of latitude to choose a barrel length that best suits you.

[rich pierce]

Yours is certainly a great looking gun. 

[Hudnut]

Locks of this style would be appropriate for replicating guns from the second quarter of the 19th century.
There are a variety of octagon to round barrels available; 20 or 24 gauge would be typical. 

[Hudnut]

Here is a photo of the mechanism.  Different than the UMTC kit.