Unidentified Southern rifle

[Longknife]

This rifle was discussed here in 2014 but no one was able to ID the maker. I have talked to Dave Byrd several times and sent him pictures but he was also unable ID the maker. It is clearly marked on the top barrel flat behind the sight, "L F * L E C C * 1886".  It is a 38 cal 48 inch barrel, 15/16 acf and weighs a hefty 11 pounds. I originally though it to be .36 cal. but upon inspection I pulled a crudely cast .360 ball from the breech over some old gritty powder! There are a few things that make this rifle unique, the unusual front trigger guard post, the "sunburst" stamps around the muzzle, the flat area on the cheek piece and the simple round flat washer for the lock bolt. Hoping some help with an ID,,,THANKS, Ed












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[Joe S.]

She hides her weight well,slender looking gal from here

[galudwig]

Reminds me a lot of the John Wishon rifle in the Library.

http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=22665.0

[wildcatter]

Is that a finger rest infront if the trigger guard? Neat gun!

[Cades Cove Fiddler]

  ... Agree on similarity to the Wishon rifle .... same peculiar cheek-rest and lock and off-side molding .....Hmmmmm...

[Eric Krewson]

I have to agree with CCF, I am building a Kibler kit right now and see the similarities.

Check this out;

https://www.jimkibler.net/southern-mountain-rifle-kit-overview.html

[Hlbly]

The Kibler kit is from a J. Whitson rifle. Probably associated with Wishon, but not the same man.

[gibster]

This rifle has a lot of similarities to the Wishon rifle that I have. Mine has a little more file work on the RR Thimbles and the butt plate and toe plate. The architecture is pretty much the same. The cheek piece on mine is a little smaller, but the same shape.  I'd say there is a good possibility that they were made by the same hand. But here's the kicker, John Wishon died in 1862 in Pea Ridge Arkansas. In 1850, he was listed in Henderson County NC as a Gunsmith. In 1860, he and his family are listed in Louisville Kentucky as a Blacksmith. But he is buried about 15-miles from where I am sitting typing this. There seems to be a rumor that he was a civilian walk-on at the Battle of Pea Ridge for the Union Army. I haven't found any hard evidence for that, but who knows. Two of his Son's enlisted in the Union Army so maybe it's true. So if this rifle was made by John Wishon, the initials on the date was added later. Perhaps the initials were as well. Here are a few pictures of the one that I have.










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[Longknife]

Thanks Gibster for the pics if your Wishon rifle. I have looked at that rifle in the museum too. While there are a couple of similarities there are many more differences too! I can see a connection though, maybe from the same area or trained by the same maker? One thing that I have been studying is the design that is stamped around the muzzle, it seems most Southern makers always did this and each makers design was unique. This "starburst" design appears to be made with a stamp and I am betting that that "L F" stamped all his muzzles with this stamp,,,?  I note that your Wishon rifle and My "L F" rifle have different markings, and , as you have the stated, the dates do not match, 1886, IF this is the date it was made!? Throw in the unique trigger guard, the simple lock bolt washer, etc..etc.......Ed

[Longknife]

Is that a finger rest infront if the trigger guard? Neat gun!

Not a finger rest, too small, just a unique design?,,,,Ed