Lehigh Varnish

[RockLock92]

Hello,

As stated in earlier posts my Dad and I are attempting to put together a rifle that at least vaguely resembles a Lehigh and we’re getting fairly close to the final shaping of the stock. I’ve got a set of plans from Eric Von Aschwege and I’ve been using his websites hints and tips page but I could use some advise on the varnish. On his site he lits two original varnishes but he only lists a recipe for one as near as I can tell. Anyone have any advice on making a varnish or a modern option? On his site he says the modern varnishes don’t hold up to uv light, but my understanding is that newer varnishes ar now uv proof. I sent Eric a message on Facebook a while back, but never heard back so I’m guessing he’s pretty swamped at Colonial Williamsburg. Any advise would be much appreciated.

Thanks,
Brad

[Mikecooper]

Important note:  do not make varnish indoors.  Do it outside as it can be very flamable also it gives off lots of smelly fumes.  Wear protective clothing and have a fire extinquisher handy.


I have made red violin varnish.  It's not too hard to make a good rosin / oil varnish and then add madder lakes to color it.  That's the old traditional way.  It requires UV to fully cure and harden so after applying the varnish put it in the sun to dry.  Strads varnish has held up pretty well for about 300 years now.  Somewhere online there are good instructions.  I'll try to find it and post it here.   Under the varnish you need a really good ground in the wood but I'll have to keep quiet on that.   Often you'll see spirit varnish recommended but linseed or walnut based oil varnish is the best. 

It took some searching but here's the PDF I was thinking of.
https://cdn.cremonatools.it/media/wysiwyg/PDF/HOW_TO_MAKE_VARNISH_Adele_Beardsmore_2008.pdf

You can look up on google how to make madder lake.  It has to be mulled into the varnish because the varnish itself doesn't have much color.

An old issue of muzzleblast has some varnish making info also.
http://www.muzzleblasts.com/archives/vol5no2/articles/mbo52-1.shtml


I made some by cooking Hawthorn venice turpentine till all the volitiles cooked off leaving only the rosin then cook that with linseed oil

[Joe S]

This formula

It took some searching but here's the PDF I was thinking of.
https://cdn.cremonatools.it/media/wysiwyg/PDF/HOW_TO_MAKE_VARNISH_Adele_Beardsmore_2008. 

will take forever to dry.  You need to cook in lead carbonate as described in Kettenburg's article.

Dragon's blood is a lot easier to work with than madder lakes.  Both were apparently used on Lehigh rifles.

Search the ALR files and you will find a lot of threads on these topics.  If that isn't enough information, you can always ask Kettenburg.

[RockLock92]

Thanks to both of you for the help!

[Mikecooper]

Dries fast in UV if you use the right kind of linseed oil. but yeah lead will help also you can add a little burnt umber artists oil paint the metals in it will act as driers.    Dragons blood looks good but the color is fugitive,  fades over time. 

[Mauser06]

How "far off" is Chamber's oil finish??? 

I have no idea...I've read a little about the Lehigh varnish but wouldn't say I'm educated on the subject.


I just know that Chamber's oil finish was red in color and definitely tinted..can see the red tint on my mortises that weren't stained but I put the finish in.

[KentSmith]

y understanding is that Lehigh 's were finished more with a "wash" than an oil varnish.  The finish sat on top rather than penetrating the wood like an oil varnish will.  May be my misunderstanding but i though a wash was made with alcohol and applied after the base oil vanish to provide a top coat so to speak.  I am no ex[pert on Lehigh rifles or violin varinishes so I may have just sent this thread off on a wild goose chase.

[RockLock92]

y understanding is that Lehigh 's were finished more with a "wash" than an oil varnish.  The finish sat on top rather than penetrating the wood like an oil varnish will.  May be my misunderstanding but i though a wash was made with alcohol and applied after the base oil vanish to provide a top coat so to speak.  I am no ex[pert on Lehigh rifles or violin varinishes so I may have just sent this thread off on a wild goose chase.

I know what you’re referring to. It’s called a spirit varnish. From what I understand you suspend a resin in alcohol and when the alcohol evaporates it leaves behind the resin on the stock. You can mix in some oil or wax to help the resin from becoming brittle. I’ve spent way too much time today researching violin varnishes at work (don’t tell my boss) and I think I’m going to experiment with this method first.

[Mikecooper]

I'm a semi expert on violin varnish but not gun varnish.   Spirit varnish has the resin disolved in alcohol,  the varnish tends to be friable and chippy.  Oil varnish is what Stradivari and his contemporaries used on violins.   It's possible to make a spirit varnish using linseed oil but complicated and time consuming.   On a rifle I would get some color into the wood by suntanning it and sealing it with amber shellac as a base coat in the wood, I would also use a stain but wont talk about that much. Without the base coat the wood under the varnish is paper white and that doesn't look good.  After the base coat then I would put red oil varnish on top of that.  But that's just me, I don't know what the old gunmakers did.

Here's a brown varnish I put on a sample, notice the golden undercoat in the wood where the varnish is worn off on the bottom edge. 

[RockLock92]

I'm a semi expert on violin varnish but not gun varnish.   Spirit varnish has the resin disolved in alcohol,  the varnish tends to be friable and chippy.  Oil varnish is what Stradivari and his contemporaries used on violins.   It's possible to make a spirit varnish using linseed oil but complicated and time consuming.   On a rifle I would get some color into the wood by suntanning it and sealing it with amber shellac as a base coat in the wood, I would also use a stain but wont talk about that much. Without the base coat the wood under the varnish is paper white and that doesn't look good.  After the base coat then I would put red oil varnish on top of that.  But that's just me, I don't know what the old gunmakers did.

Here's a brown varnish I put on a sample, notice the golden undercoat in the wood where the varnish is worn off on the bottom edge. 

According to Eric Von Aschwege’s site he uses a “mild wash of aqua fortis” to achieve the same result. I was wondering if a stain would work as well. Looks like I’ll have a bit of experimentation ahead of me, but I look forward to getting it dialed in. The components for this build have been sitting around for far too long, and I’m estatic to finally getting around to finishing it..

[Mikecooper]

A light wash of dilute aqua fortis might be a good idea.  You want to get something in the wood so it's not white like a sheet of paper.  I'm not any kind of Lehigh expert so don't take my word for it.  I just know what looks good to me and what doesn't. So take my advice with a big grain of salt  
 In real antique rifles maybe the wood is white under the varnish I don't know, never seen one.

  In the center section of my video you'll notice the maple flames have a  slight redish tint.  that was a weak red colored dye which compliments the color of the darker varnish on top.   
Experiment on scraps first.   I'm looking forward to seeing your finished results show pictures!