Author Topic: Pecking away at my rifle.....  (Read 5204 times)

Uncle Alvah

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Pecking away at my rifle.....
« on: January 29, 2018, 07:13:53 PM »
I have inlet the lock plate on my rifle. Frankly, I think it looks deplorable, I am more than somewhat disappointed in my results so far. That said, it is my first build, I have no deadline to work against, and I am both learning a lot and much enjoying the work. I believe/hope when the sidepanels are sanded down, the gaps around the plate will be less striking.

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2018, 07:47:06 PM »
Where are you at?  Somebody ought to be able to give you a quick inletting lesson.
Andover, Vermont

Offline Chowmi

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2018, 10:32:43 PM »
Alvah,
I'm not great a inletting, and have improved from appalling to OK with a bit of practice.
Take these comments as constructive, from someone who has buggered up a lot of inlets.

I think those gaps are going to notice when you sand down the lock panel. So be it. Not much to be done at this point.

Hard to tell from the pictures, but my guess is that you are the victim of chisels that are not sharp enough, as well as poor chisel shape choice and a bit of poor technique. Add to that, it looks to me like a bit of hurrying and frustration. Again, all criticism intended as constructive rather then negative.

Try some practice into a scrap piece of wood. Not Pine, something hard like Maple.
There are tutorials on inletting on this forum. Have a look at them.

Here's a few things that have worked for me. They are techniques, not absolutes.

Sharpen your chisels razor sharp. Easily cutting paper sharp. This is difficult to learn, at least for me....

Make sure you have a good bevel on the piece you are going to inlet. Doesn't need to be dramatic, just a few degrees.

I have found the best success with laying the piece down and scribing a line around it with a sharp point or knife. Be sure to scribe the line close to the bottom, or inward, part of the bevel. I.E. The line should be just a smidge inside the outermost edge of the piece to be inlet, along the slightly reduced inner edge due to the bevel if that makes sense.

This scribe line then gives your chisel two things:  a line to sit in as you stab in, and a well defined line with which to choose the right curvature of chisel. If you pick achisel and lay it in that scribed line, it needs to fit. If it doesn't, choose another chisel. If you don't have the right curve, choose a very narrow flat chisel and make several overlapping stab cuts.

For me, as a lower than average inletter, establishing a clean initial inletting line is the key. From there, I am likely to scrape the edge of the inlet to expand it, rather than stab a new cut. Takes me some time, but I find it is cleaner at my skill level.   This is especially true if your bevel on the inlet piece is not too steep. I think an error I made initially was to do a steep bevel, which makes your initial stab cut somewhat irrelevant.

I hope that helps,

Norm.
Cheers,
Chowmi

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Offline Chowmi

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2018, 10:36:41 PM »
One thing to add as well:

When you stab in, make sure the cutting face is perpendicular to the wood. Easy with straight chisels, more nuanced with gouges. If you lay the gouge back at an angle, you will create a gap.

Norm
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Chowmi

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Offline Kary

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2018, 11:38:35 PM »
The gaps can be somewhat fixed with a few different remedies, one is dirty beeswax, a second is epoxy that is mixed with sawdust from the previous stock work, the third would be wood putty that can be dyed to match. None of these will make a perfect fix, but it will help. That being said, I'd for sure practice some on Inletting before going any further on your rifle or you may end up with a mess. My first was somewhat of a mess as well, I learned a lot on how to fix my mistakes. Don't give up!! Good luck and keep us posted.

Offline Chowmi

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2018, 11:59:23 PM »
Haven't ever tried it myself, but have seen a million posts saying don't use epoxy with saw dust.
I think the reason is obvious. It will look like plastic with sawdust.
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Chowmi

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Offline Kary

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2018, 12:28:45 AM »
 Chowmi, I'd say under the circumstances, that any fix would look better than none...
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 12:29:58 AM by S.kenton »

Offline Chowmi

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2018, 12:43:44 AM »
Chowmi, I'd say under the circumstances, that any fix would look better than none...

I did chuckle at that.
My overall thinking was to wait and see what it all looked like at the end, and then talk about fixes. 
One step at a time...,

No experience on my part with epoxy, simply echoing previous advice.

Norm. 
Cheers,
Chowmi

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Offline Ky-Flinter

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2018, 01:04:45 AM »
The JB Weld company has a product called WoodWeld.  It's an epoxy and it will take stain.  Pretty good stuff.  No need to add sawdust.

-Ron
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 01:05:38 AM by Ky-Flinter »
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Offline Frank

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2018, 01:38:48 AM »
Your forestock is still square so you should have plenty of wood to take off for repairs. Chisel off some small pieces to fill the gaps on your lock inletting and epoxy or superglue them in place and re-inlet. Always stain before you epoxy any replacement wood.  Just using straight epoxy or sawdust will still look like $#@*. Always use wood from your stock to make repairs.

Offline okawbow

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2018, 01:44:31 AM »
Please don't use any kind of putty or sawdust mix to fix those gaps!

Cut some slivers of wood from a cut off or inside the barrel channel and fit them into those gaps use yellow wood glue to glue the side away from the lock. You can pre stain the area and sliver with water based stain first and the glue joint will barely show.
As in life; it’s the journey, not the destination. How you get there matters most.

Offline Clark Badgett

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2018, 03:34:06 AM »
I keep packs of maple and walnut veneer sheeting just for this very thing. The kind without adhesive. I also keep my scraps if I need bigger pieces. I ain't no inletting guru myself.
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Offline rich pierce

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2018, 03:45:31 AM »
Well, if you're having trouble inletting then fixing defects is going to be that much harder.  Goal #1 is to get higher competency inletting by hands-on instruction with your tools.
Andover, Vermont

Offline little joe

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2018, 04:59:12 AM »
Go for it The only way to get better is ask questions and hands on a piece of wood. Only talking for myself but some of my stocks have went in the $#@* can for several reasons.

Offline Kary

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2018, 05:36:15 AM »
Well, if you're having trouble inletting then fixing defects is going to be that much harder. 
That is one of the reasons I suggested a simple and easy fix, yes it may not look 100% perfect, but epoxy, stainable wood glue, and other mentioned fixes may be a fix that the OP can do. Then on the next build he could seek out a tutor for guidance.

Black Hand

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2018, 05:57:41 AM »
Chowmi, I'd say under the circumstances, that any fix would look better than none...
I've read where people planed down the area, glued on a matching piece of wood and re-inlet the piece again.
Unfortunately, those gaps will only become more noticeable once the lock-panels are shaped...

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2018, 06:12:54 AM »
S Kenton, he’s got a lot more inletting to do. It’s an essential skill.
Andover, Vermont

Offline Kary

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2018, 06:47:00 PM »
Agreed.....but even if Inletting us learned.. then applied to the rest of this particular build, he will still wanna try and fix the gaps in the lock plate area.. that was the point of my earlier posts I guess.   ;)

Offline PPatch

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2018, 06:55:38 PM »
Well Uncle A, I'm glad you're enjoying the process and learning. I wouldn't do any more stock shaping until you have the lock fully inlet, the triggers in and your tang bolt and trigger plate screw completed. You will need that stock blank to remain as square as possible to do all those things. Also, I would never use sawdust or epoxy to attempt to hide those inletting goofs, that should be done with wood that you remove from somewhere else on the blank.

We learn as we go along, it is a process.

dave
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 10:36:31 PM by PPatch »
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Offline Bigmon

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2018, 08:44:25 PM »
Just a thought?
Get a larger lock, or have a welder enlarge the edges??
I know its allot more work than just doing it better the first time, but I been right where he is and left it as is, and regretted it until I did something for a remedy??
Just hang in there and keep trying.
Main thing is make everything functional.
You could always distress the entire gun an make it appear as allot of originals do that have been used and repaied, replaced parts, patched etc.
Just make it function and that will help until you get better at it

Offline smallpatch

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2018, 09:23:58 PM »
IMHO,  there are two ways to fix this.  Plane off entire area, and glue in a piece of wood, re inlet.
Or, start over with a new stock.  First is cheaper, second I'd better.
please take this as helpful advice, not criticism.  We ALL make blunders.  My first required a new barrel as a fix. Cut dovetail in the waist too deep.
As we learn, we get better at hiding/fixing them.
How's the rest of it look? Is it worth saving?
In His grip,

Dane

Offline Don Stith

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2018, 12:50:07 AM »
AS Rich asked, At least tell us roughly where you are located. A lot of improvement can be gained with just a little first hand instruction. If in an easy drive of a more experienced builder you might get an invite.
Don

Offline Bill Raby

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2018, 06:46:23 AM »
Several good solutions mentioned already so I won'y bother repeating. What I learned from my first build is that there are no hard parts. But there are a lot of parts that can take a very long time. So slow down. Look at it this way. Soon as it is finished you are going to have to blow another $800 to $1000 on parts for the next one. If you are using the cheap chisels you need to bury them in the garden and get the good ones. Then learn how to make them very very sharp.

ddoyle

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2018, 08:05:15 AM »
Good for you for doing it! No matter how you feel about it your more of a gun stocker then 99.9 % of the population. 

Just a thought but if you buy a nice plain maple blank and take on the barrel inletting it will teach you everything you need to know by the time you are ready to inlet the lock. Kit guns are great but they catapult you too far into the process and they rob you of developing the skills you need to complete the kit! Working slowy over a period of time on the barrel inlet strengthens your hands and teaches you how the wood works and how your chisels like to be treated.

Good on ya for having a project on the bench. Eventually it becomes fun, just get over the initial hump.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2018, 08:11:32 AM by ddoyle »

Uncle Alvah

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Re: Pecking away at my rifle.....
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2018, 11:08:15 PM »
Where are you at?  Somebody ought to be able to give you a quick inletting lesson.


I live near the Coast in North Carolina, just outside of New Bern, to be more precise.