OK, how do I get out of this one?

[Curt Larsen]

I fitted the trigger guard to the Haines I'm building and set out to put the pins in.  The problem is that the forward tang on the TG is a bit short so I had to drill through thin lower lock panel.  I used a 1/16th drill to keep the hole small and used some to the 1/16th steel stock that MBS is selling.  The drilling went well and came out just as I wanted.  I then decided to try out the 1/16th pin stock for a fit to the TG.  I tapped in an 1.5" or so piece of pin stock with a small hammer  Now I can't get the pin stock out and can't get the TG out for my final work on the bottom of the stock and wrist.  I've tried getting a grip on the pin with vice grips and pulled and tried to turn it to break it free from the the hole in the TG tang but I'm afraid that the pin stock will break off with an inch still in the hole.  I've tried to drive it out from the other side with a short piece of the same pin stock.  That hasn't worked either.  Now I have a dilemma.  Do I just leave the TG in and cut off the pin stock in the lower lock panel or try to drill it out from the other side with a 3/32nds drill?  That will make the hole in the narrow lock panel bigger and defeats my original purpose.  I'm also afraid to try to drill it out from the opposite side with a 1/16th drill because the thin flexible bit will probably wander when it hits the hard pin stock that is stuck in the TG tang.  So what to do, any ideas?

Curt

[Larry Luck]

Sounds like the pin is binding.  Try using one of the Irwin Quick Grip type clamps to compress the tang, which may unload the pin to allow it to be removed.
I generally use the clamps when I set the pins to make sure the triggerguard is firm to the stock, and it helps secure the pins.
Larry Luck

[billd]

I do similar to Larry with a small c-clamp.  Pad the jaws

Bill

[northmn]

I have an inexpensive 1/16" pin punch you can generally get at a hardware store for such situations where they can be driven out from the other side.  The pin stock does not usually work.  Works great for future disassembly of pinned barrels.  If you put it in uder clamps you may need to clamp to get it out, but a pin punch should puch it out.

DP

[Dave Faletti]

Try pushing the trigger guard in as if seating it.  Try knocking the pin out then.    If you had it clamped in place when you drilled the holes it could be acting like a spring and pushing sideways on the pin.

[Acer Saccharum]

If it's a soft pin, the end of the pin will mushroom, so don't pound on it.

[George F.]

Boy Curt, you have a real problem, At least it has broken off in the wood. Maybe, if you work with a pin punch from the side plate side, that way you won't wreck the lock side of the lock panel.  ...Geo.

[54ball]

 If all else fails you could try freeze shrinking the pin.  Heating the pin may work too but be careful.
 Idea #2  Use a varabile speed reversable drill.  Chuck it in and gently try to spin it out. Go forward then reverse.  Go slow. 
 

[Curt Larsen]

OK IT WORKED!!  I tried Larry's method and reclamped the triggerguard.  Acer was right.  When I tried to drive the pin out with pin stock from the other side it did mushroom.  I filed that down and tried again and that must have loosened it.  I got a new grip on the pin with the vice grips and it came right out.  Thanks guys, now I feel a but . . . .you know. 

Curt

[Ed Wenger]

Hi Curt,

Glad you got the pin out!  Not that it will help now, but you can silver solder an extention onto the tang to make it longer, that way you can drill the pin in the lock mortise.  Just make sure you get a nice fit with the two parts being soldered...

                       Ed

[rdillon]

Hi Curt,

Glad you got the pin out!  Not that it will help now, but you can silver solder an extention onto the tang to make it longer, that way you can drill the pin in the lock mortise.  Just make sure you get a nice fit with the two parts being soldered...

                       Ed

Thats the way I do it.  I want my pin plenty high so the bottom of the stock doesn't break out if the trigger guard is hit hard or the gun is dropped.  Also, with the pin high enough you will hide the other end behind the side plate.  In my opinion it just looks nicer.

[Roger Fisher]

Hi Curt,

Glad you got the pin out!  Not that it will help now, but you can silver solder an extention onto the tang to make it longer, that way you can drill the pin in the lock mortise.  Just make sure you get a nice fit with the two parts being soldered...

                       Ed

I agree!   I have built more than one the following.   (Although I wondered at the time if I was screwing up 'again')  drill into the stock in the lock mortise just forward of the bottom of the bridle.  Did not go all the way thru.  Left a good head on the finishing nail.  Had the guard clamped against the stock to drill.  Needle nose plier to remove, as I squeeze the extension against the stock bottom with my fist! Hides both ends of the pin.  Works slicker than snot on a doorknob.    The next guy that gets these rifleguns  will have to study the set up a mite .

[T*O*F]

Another easier method than vise grips is to use the chuck of your electric drill, if there is enough protruding to grab it.  Tighten the pin in the chuck and you will have a 2 hand gripping surface that will pull the pin straight out.  Vise grips always gnarfle whatever you're pulling on.

[jerrywh]

From now on. here is a suggestion. Buy a # drill that is a couple of thousands over the size of the pin your going to use and drill the hole in the trigger guard our .002 oversized. What I do is make my pins pointed on the end and my punch concave. This helps to prevent the pin from muchrooming and keeps the punch from slipping off of the pin.   Mistakes are good. They make you think.

[J.D.]

IMHO, leaving  "try pins" extra long, with an "L" shaped  handle makes getting them out much, much easier.

Just a thought for next time. 

[jerrywh]

From now on. here is a suggestion. Buy a # drill that is a couple of thousands over the size of the pin your going to use and drill the hole in the trigger guard obout .002 oversized. What I do is make my pins pointed on the end and my punch concave. This helps to prevent the pin from mushrooming and keeps the punch from slipping off of the pin.   Mistakes are good. They make you think.

[Don Getz]

Come on you guys...think.    He already has the hole drilled, thru the wood and the guard.   After I drill the hole, I will
remove the guard and take the drill and roll it around in the hole, making it larger....no need for another drill a few thousands larger.  You guys are overcomplicating it, just get the hole in the guard slightly larger so that the pin will go
thru it easily, then reassemble....................Don

[Rich]

Rather than make the hole larger in the guard, taper the very end of the pin (the end that goes through the guard) and round it off.

[Dphariss]

Clamp TG with mild pressure to see if this loosens the pin.
It is possible that the drill made a hole that makes the pin a press fit in the hole in the TG? This is why I tend to measure pin stock with a mic and/or try the pin in the hole before installation.
Is it soft pin stock? If so and its tight you could mushroom the driven end. I always use piano wire.
You might try heating the TG to see if this will loosen the pin.
These things can be real hair pullers.
If all else fails sacrifice the TG and buy another, its the cheapest part. Drill into the guard to break it loose from the lug then deal with the part left in the stock. Or drill the body to get it loose then silver solder in a piece to fill the hole and form a new lug.
To prevent this in the future silver solder an extension on a low lug to raise the pin hole location. Or set the guard deeper and shape to match.

Dan

[jerrywh]

I only use 1/16" pins in stuff and the small drill bits break easy when wallowing them in a hole. If I used bigger pins I would wallow the hole out. As far as that goes I try to keep the trigger pin within the lock cavity and don't go all the way thru the stock with the pin or the hole. I make a head on the pin that swivels into a recess in the edge of the lock cavity. You have to take the lock out to remove the trigger guard pin. I don't like those pin holes showing.

[davec2]

Personal preference - I don't like pins for trigger guards much at all.  This method may not be historically correct, but I use an internal screw on the front end of the guard and a hook on the rear end.  Just aft of the end of the ram rod hole I drill a hole through the stock from inside the barrel channel and into the trigger guard front inlet.  I silver solder a bolster onto the trigger guard into which the screw passes holding the front end of the guard in place with no visible fasteners.   The rear end of the guard gets a soldered hook that fits into a recess in the wood.  No visible attachments at the rear end of the guard either.  No stuck pins, no damaged wood pushing pins in or out.  No wood screws.

[Jim Filipski]

After I drill the hole, I will
remove the guard and take the drill and roll it around in the hole, making it larger....no need for another drill a few thousands larger.  You guys are overcomplicating it, just get the hole in the guard slightly larger so that the pin will go
thru it easily, then reassemble....................Don

I'm with Donny on this one but I do one more thing I slightly countersink any pin holes from both sides in any metal part then slightly open the hole as Don mentioned. I have seen this light countersinking on a number of original parts. I think it may help redirect the pin a tiny bit if it is off or if the part is slightly out of place. Who knows , I just always do that (and also round point my pins)
Jim

[Acer Saccharum]

Come on you guys...think. 
.......Don

Don, you ask an awful lot of us sometimes.  I do like your direct git'r done approach. In my opinion, this would be real close to 'how it was done' back in the day.

I also like Jerry's headed trigger pin trick and Davec's guard attachment. Neat ideas for certain situations.

Acer

[Jim Filipski]

Speaking of Jerry's headed trigger pin: I recently ran across this in of all things a 1st model bess from India.
Thought that was slick. Jerry must be teaching everybody great tricks! 

[Dphariss]

What Don said is the easy way.

Takes a few seconds. Works good.
I use oversize drills/reamers too. Using a #52 drill for the metal will give a close running fit on a true 1/16" (.0625") pin. But if you drill the wood oversize the pin will loose unless you
I also spin the pin in a drill and polish it with wet or dry paper to size it. It depends on the project.

I am not a big fan of 1/16 pins. They have their place but the potential for run out holes and problems removing pins increases.  IMO using soft pins is silly when piano wire is available. They are hard to mushroom or bend but hard to cut as well. Its in the same class as soft screw heads. But thats just me.

Dan