New tool

[ltdann]

Recently,  I participated in discussion IRT to synthetic powders vs. "the real deal".  I've been using MZ Black from Alliant as my main charge, primarily because Goex is hard to come by and expensive locally.  MZ Black is cheap and performs well.

There was some discussion about perchlorates ruining the barrel, and MZ Black does have perchlorates, but no Sulphur.  It made me curious on how my .54 barrel was fairing after using about 5 lbs of MZ.

Then I stumbled upon this handy little gadget  https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MYTHWK4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 

This endoscope cost about the same as a Pfiel chisel and connects to your phone, allowing you to do an internal inspection of your barrel.  The one I bought has LED lights and is .33" in diameter so it'll go down most barrels.  It'll allow you to video or snap a picture as well.

Here's an example.



I always wondered what the touchhole looked like from the inside.

[T*O*F]

That's neat, but I'm more impressed with this one.  It can be connected to more devices including your computer via USB and it appears to have more features.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07DC3TMLH/ref=sspa_dk_detail_3?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B07DC3TMLH&pd_rd_wg=4Lnns&pd_rd_r=HPQMQPWBZRXEXDX0BQGW&pd_rd_w=8VYd7

[ltdann]

5 years ago, you'd have paid hundreds or thousands of $$ for that....

[Roger B]

And you can save thousands with our deluxe model and do your own colonoscopy!  Act now and we'll include our handy handbook; "Meet Your Amazing Colon"!  Requires enemas & laxatives (not included).
Roger B.

[ltdann]

I was thinking about the next time I dropped a bolt down into the engine compartment....the thing comes with a magnet and hook attachment.  But if you want to go the other way, sure...who am I to judge

[Hungry Horse]

The percolates collect anywhere there is an edge, or groove, to hold it. It is much more aggressive than sulphuric acid produced by black powder. It also tends to create deeper pockets in more tightly focused areas. Any slight leakage in breech threads, or drum threads, or touch hole liner threads, are very susceptible to deep pockets that eventually cause failure. Your colonoscopy tool won’t do you a bit of good there.
 The bore erosion will start as a light frosting, in the first two or three inches of the barrels breech, and will progress rapidly to a rough spot from there.
 I quit taking in modern muzzleloaders for repair ( the unmentionable type on this forum) because all the owners wanted me to fix their guns so they could shoot all the substitutes without destroying their guns. There’s a reason that stuff is so much cheaper. If it worked just like BP, it would cost just like BP after all the manufacturers are’nt in it for the warm fuzzy feeling they get from selling their product cheap.

 Hungry Horse

 

[ltdann]

Well, then.  I guess I'm stuck with the synthetics.  $35 a pound is more than triple the MZ Black.  I can order that stuff by the case without breaking the law and I don't have to drive 30 miles to the one shop that carries the GOEX.

I'll keep with my deep cleaning regime, and monitor the barrel with the bore scope.

[Eric Krewson]

I am a fan of the $12 shipped free endoscopes sold on eBay. I get great pictures from the one I have. It started taking really lousy, dark pictures and found it has a light intensity adjustment on the plug. I turned up the light and my pictures got much better.

When this picture was taken I found out I had a little pitting in my Rice barrel, I had been using Rem oil to protect the barrel which was a mistake.

[ltdann]

how far down the barrel is that? 

In my pic, there's some discoloration just forward of the touchhole.  It doesn't look like pitting or rust, not sure what it is.  It's about where I'd expect the top of the powder column to be, but nowhere else.

I've never been a huge fan of WD-40 in the past, but I've been using it my barrel since I clean with water and I don't know of anything else that displaces water.

[Hungry Horse]

WD40 is a great product. The ability to dissipate water is a real plus, but it does evaporate over time giving rust a chance to develop. Shoot it down with WD40 , and then give it a good shot of break free or some othe got rust prohibitor. Break free chain and cable foam is great for long term storage.

  Hungry Horse

[Daryl]

Recently,  I participated in discussion IRT to synthetic powders vs. "the real deal".  I've been using MZ Black from Alliant as my main charge, primarily because Goex is hard to come by and expensive locally.  MZ Black is cheap and performs well.

There was some discussion about perchlorates ruining the barrel, and MZ Black does have perchlorates, but no Sulphur.  It made me curious on how my .54 barrel was fairing after using about 5 lbs of MZ.

Then I stumbled upon this handy little gadget  https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MYTHWK4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 

This endoscope cost about the same as a Pfiel chisel and connects to your phone, allowing you to do an internal inspection of your barrel.  The one I bought has LED lights and is .33" in diameter so it'll go down most barrels.  It'll allow you to video or snap a picture as well.

Here's an example.



I always wondered what the touchhole looked like from the inside.

I think if your picture was actually in focus, you would see more damage than Eric shows in his picture.

[ltdann]

I guess Eric's $12 gadget is better than my $35 one, that's about the best I can do.

Why do you think it's damaged?  That's the only place on the barrel there's a "shadow", no spots of red rust anywhere that I can see.

The barrel's less than a year old...it's a range firearm.  I doubt it's had a charge remaining in the barrel more than 30 minutes...ever.

My cleaning regime is cold water flush, patch dry , ballistol, patch dry and then wd-40.  If that's not doing cleaning enough,  I don't know what to else to do.

[Hungry Horse]

I think you fail to comprehend that non black powder substitutes can create damage very quickly. The slower red rust to slight roughness, to deeper pitting, is the process black powder goes through. This is not necessarily the case with the substitutes. The frosting, that morphs into slight roughness, and then to real pits, is the chemicals in the burning powder etching your bore, not the slower rusting process.

  Hungry Horse

[rich pierce]

A lot of the muzzleloaders that are ruined by black powder substitutes have been used by newbs who do not understand and practice what we consider normal cleaning procedures. Insisting that someone else’s bore must be damaged without inspecting it would seem to require paranormal abilities.

[Mike Brooks]

I think you fail to comprehend that non black powder substitutes can create damage very quickly. The slower red rust to slight roughness, to deeper pitting, is the process black powder goes through. This is not necessarily the case with the substitutes. The frosting, that morphs into slight roughness, and then to real pits, is the chemicals in the burning powder etching your bore, not the slower rusting process.

  Hungry Horse

I was given a couple bottles of this imitation powder and decided to use it for my shotguns in Cowboy Action Shoots. What a mistake. My frosted bores went to heavily pitted bores in short order. NASTY stuff.

[ltdann]

This percholate thing really befuddles me.  I understand that it can be corrosive, like older primers.  But cholorates are highly water soluble.  It would make sense that flushing with water would and a timely, rigorous cleaning regime would stay in front of this?

[Eric Krewson]

This is what my scope is capable of if everything is in focus, Bill Large barrel.

[ltdann]

what's the brand/model of that borescope?  That's so much better than mine.

[ltdann]

you have the same shadows about where the top of the powder column would be...is that where you found pitting?

[Hungry Horse]

An older gentleman in my gun club used modern substitute powder in his new muzzleloader. He was one of those guys that shoots one day and cleaned for three days, every gun he owned was like new, no matter how old. The breech of his gun became rough for no reason, and began to pit. I believe this happens during ignition, and all the cleaning in the word won't stop It. I had a similar problem when I decided to shoot up some free Pyrodex in my revolver.
 So, while  your counting your savings, you better add in the cost of a barrel or two.

  Hungry Horse

[ltdann]

Trust me, I'd love to use Goex at the price everywhere else in the country.  I believe it's a more consistent and energetic powder.   Believe me, I get it.

The one guy in the county that sells it, knows it and charges accordingly.  I'd love to order a case at case prices but not allowed here...limit one pound or 5 pounds, depending on who's reading the law.  The last time I asked for 2 lbs, the guy about ran me out on a rail.

******* just did a search, Powder valley Inc. is carrying Goex now @ $16.95/lb and will ship in 5 lb lots.

Guess I'll burn up the cheap stuff as the damage is already done and switch.

[Eric Krewson]

You will get reflections from the breechplug that look like pitting but aren't. Look at your USB plug and see if there is a little wheel on the side, if there is you may only have to turn your light intensity up to get much better pictures.

All the E-Cheapo endoscopes on eBay are about the same, when I looked for one just like I ordered I see hundreds of similar ones. I only have a PC not a smart phone so I had to find one made to plug into a PC.

I just checked eBay, you can get the things for less than $5 now.

[Dennis Glazener]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Endoscope-7mm-Inspection-Camera-For-Android-PC-Laptop-Borescope-Waterproof-6-LED/372264420506?var=&hash=item56acb0449a

Prices are so cheap I am afraid to order one. With my luck it would not work!
Dennis

[ltdann]

You will get reflections from the breechplug that look like pitting but aren't. Look at your USB plug and see if there is a little wheel on the side, if there is you may only have to turn your light intensity up to get much better pictures.

All the E-Cheapo endoscopes on eBay are about the same, when I looked for one just like I ordered I see hundreds of similar ones. I only have a PC not a smart phone so I had to find one made to plug into a PC.

I just checked eBay, you can get the things for less than $5 now.

Mines got the little light adjustment as well, and If to bright automatically turns itself down.   The brightness isn't the problem, I think its the "focal length", mine is 1-3".

It'll certainly pick up rust, I ran it down an old CVA percussion that I picked up at a swap meet years ago.  Probably haven't look at that for almost two years and there was a light coat of rust in the rifling.  Cleaned it immediately.

[Daryl]

Found this from Buffalo Arms add in my in-box.

https://www.buffaloarms.com/black-powder?utm_source=August+2018+Flyer&utm_campaign=firearms+flyer&utm_medium=email