Kibler Mountain rifle question

[Tim]

Hello to everyone,

Jim Kibler offers a rifling upgrade which is round bottom rifling.
Does the round bottom rifling offer that much benefit over the square
bottom rifling or should I spend that money on getting a higher grade of maple
For the stock? Maybe get the high grade maple with lots more figure.
I like the way that highly figured maple looks on these awesome looking rifles.
Any advice will be much appreciated.

Tim

[Frank]

I have had Rice barrels in both round bottom and square bottom rifling. I have not noticed any measurable difference between them. The round bottom requires a thicker patch. Some folks say they are easier to clean but I have not seen that to be the case.

I have the Kibler Mountain Rifle with the standard barrel in 40 caliber and it will stick them in one hole at 25 yards.

[moleeyes36]

I have Rice barrels in square bottom and round bottom rifling and I agree with Frank's assesment.  Use the money on pretty wood instead of round bottom rifling.

Mole Eyes

[hanshi]

I also have Rice round bottom barrels and square rifled barrels.  The rb bores do seem to clean up slightly quicker but for the extra money they cost I'd go for nice wood.

[Tim]

Sounds like the square bottom rifling and better wood
Is the way to go. I like the idea of that pretty maple with
Lots of figure. My Wife is telling me to make my mind up so
She can hurry up and send the payment in and get my name on the list.
Thanks Guys.

[Ky-Flinter]

You picked a good woman Tim.

-Ron

[Scota4570]

"Does the round bottom rifling offer that much benefit over the square"

NO.

I would suggest settling on one or the other. You will need different patches and balls for each even in the same caliber. 

I have a RB barrel in 45 caliber.  I tried it out of curiosity.  I do not like it.  Getting a combo that seals well is a problem for me.  IT is not as accurate as my other barrels.  To go to the opposite extreme, I have a rifle I made with a cartridge rifle barrel intended for 45-70.  It is extremely accurate. 

It is my observation that accurate does mean the same thing to every one. 

Benched,  I can not get 1" groups at 50 yards with the RB barrel.  I can with the cartridge barrel. 

If hitting a melon off hand at 50 yards is "accurate" it does not matter what you choose.   

[Tim]

You picked a good woman Tim.

-Ron

Yes I did and she tells me that often.
She knows I like guns and she is very supporting
When it comes to me wanting my toys.

[Stoner creek]

You picked a good woman Tim.

-Ron

Yes I did and she tells me that often.
She knows I like guns and she is very supporting
When it comes to me wanting my toys.

Bring her to the CLA show in Lexington next year! Tell her to remember to bring the checkbook  .

[Tim]

Wait a minute now. Don’t want to overdo a good
Thing...lol I would love to come to that show and meet you guys and
Learn from the Pros.

[Tim]

So many decisions to make. The idea of having a .40 caliber rifle
Sure appeals to me especially for target shoots and such.
Alabama allows one to hunt deer with a .40 but the .45 seems a
Better choice for that.

[Eric Krewson]

I have a bunch of friends who hunt deer with a .40 round ball here in N/W Alabama, they kill everything they shoot at. They do meet up at a friends range and shoot almost every Wednesday so they know their guns well.

They did a lot of experimenting with 170 gr .40 pistol bullets out of their rifles to get more umph for deer. One guy with a 42" 13/16 1 in 66 GM barrel got very tight groups at 50 yards by patching his bullets with butter paper. He also killed deer out ot 80 yards effectively with this load. I think he was shooting 60 or 70 grains of 3F powder.

They all found the butter paper tightened their pistol bullet groups to minute of deer accuracy.   

[Craig Wilcox]

Thanks, Eric!  Now I got ta find a source for "butter paper".  An old bachelor like me takes about three months to go through a pound of butter!
Maybe some of my Amish friends have some?  Nah, they make their own butter.

I'll find a source somewhere.  Maybe sneak in the grocery store after midnite - they be surprised to find sticks of butter in the cooler.

[Eric Krewson]

My friend says there is a thin layer of plastic on the butter paper, he says it is easy to seperate from the paper.

[Craig Wilcox]

Eric - so you can peel and discard that plastic?  Hope so, because I probably wouldn't want to get melted plastic in the barrel.

Really 'preciate you telling me about that - would have been dreadful to find out the hard way!

[Eric Krewson]

Peal and discard according to my friend, I haven't done it myself.

[Marcruger]

My experience is that the flat bottom rifling is much easier to get to shoot well than round bottom.  I believe the issue lies in some builders making the round bottom grooves too deep to seal easily (or at all).  You get in a fight between a patch thick enough to seal, versus how much ball & patch combo you can drive down the bore.

I have not seen that round bottom barrels are easier to clean.  I think that is because they are harder to seal, and therefore blow more fouling by the patch and make more mess.  Again, just my experience.  Of course, Daryl's wet patching method would help with that a lot. 

At this point in my life, if a builder said "Here's one of my round bottom barrels, and here's one of my flat bottom ones.  My flat bottom is twice as expensive", I would still pay the extra to get flat bottom. 

I hope this helps. 

I do have experience with a friend's Tip Curtis rifles with Colerain round bottom rifled barrels.  The rifling is shallow, and is easy to seal and shoots very well.  Not contradicting my above message, it is just that Colerain's shallow round bottom rifling method works.  Credit where credit is due. 

Best wishes and God Bless,   Marc

[Eric Krewson]

I have a square bottom Large and GM barrel, both shoot better than my round bottom barrels and with a wider variety of loads.

My round bottom rifled barrels shoot well but you have to find exactly what they like, it appears you have very little load leeway with round bottom rifling in my limited experience.

I can cram anything down the Large and GM barrel and they will still shoot consistently.

[Marcruger]

I too have a square bottom GM that seems to shoot anything well. Pity they stopped making swamped barrels.

[alacran]

I have shot a Keebler .45,  affectionately known to its owner as the "Elf".  I t shoots well, but I find it too light and whippy for offhand shooting. I think a .40 barrel would help mitigate that. If that is legal for deer in your state that is what I would buy. A .32 would probably have the right weight for me.

[Tim]

I decided on the .40 caliber with the Extra Extra Extra
Fancy Maple stock. Thing is, I’ve got to decide how to
Finish the iron and wood before the rifle is ready.
Sure wish I could learn how to carve and also how to
Build and install a patch box before the rifle is ready.
Been watching this video on YouTube and I like the looks
Of this patch box.

[G_T]

Installing a patchbox, and carving, are two different things!

Get a patchbox that interests you, and just practice inletting it into scrap wood. It doesn't hurt the patchbox, particularly small steel ones. When you feel like you've got it, go ahead and inlet it into the SMR.

Carving IMHO breaks down into two sets of skills (or three; there is layout of course). The first and I think simplest is molding lines. They are not hard to do. If you want them, I'd start there. Look up how, or ask, and you'll get lots of quality help. The rest of carving is more involved. Note - often molding lines use different tools than regular carving. You don't need much to do it.

Gerald

[Bob Roller]

You picked a good woman Tim.

-Ron

Yes I did and she tells me that often.
She knows I like guns and she is very supporting
When it comes to me wanting my toys.

Indeed you did pick a good woman as did I almost 50 years ago.
I once showed Brenda a picture of a BIG railroad gun being observed by
Field Marshal Rommel and told her I was going to see if I could find one.
She wanted to know what I was going to do with the tracks and locomotive'it took to move that thing.

Bob Roller

[Tim]

You picked a good woman Tim.

-Ron

Yes I did and she tells me that often.
She knows I like guns and she is very supporting
When it comes to me wanting my toys.

Indeed you did pick a good woman as did I almost 50 years ago.
I once showed Brenda a picture of a BIG railroad gun being observed by
Field Marshal Rommel and told her I was going to see if I could find one.
She wanted to know what I was going to do with the tracks and locomotive'it took to move that thing.

Bob Roller

Well Bob, What did you do with the tracks and locomotive?

[Tim]

Help! There is a voice in my head that’s telling me to
Change my mind and get the .45 caliber rifle
Instead of the .40 caliber.
I would love to hear from folks who shoot both
And hear some pros and cons of either.
Is the .40 a better choice for range and woods walks?