Coning: Inaccurate?

[Smokey Plainsman]

I am considering coning the barrel of a rifle in the works. Benefits are quicker loading and no short starter is needed. I’ve read short starters are not period correct for one thing. But some, in fact many, claim accuracy is damaged by coning. Uses for this gun are casual target shooting, small game hunting, plinking, and perhaps some woods walk offhand type contests.

Anyone out there with coned muzzles have any say on the matter? Also, what is the best tool for coning? I see threre are a few makers of coning tools out there.

Thanks!

[alacran]

Let me see. You are going to go to these woods walk how? Why worry about weather a short starter is period correct or not. Was coning a barrel period correct?
My experience has been that a load that can be started without a ball starter are not very accurate loads.

[alex e.]

Let me see. You are going to go to these woods walk how? Why worry about weather a short starter is period correct or not. Was coning a barrel period correct?
My experience has been that a load that can be started without a ball starter are not very accurate loads.

I'll tell the 3_4 deer I take each year that. They'll take comfort in it I'm sure.

[Turtle]

This is always a hot topic with opposite opionions. I have two comments. #1- I cone all my guns when I build them and have won several woods walks and harvested a lot of game-I push my patched ball out of my loading block directly down the barrel-slick- enough said. #2- the negative comments on coned barrel accuracy were all barrels not coned with Joe Woods conning tool-which I use. For me, it's a settled issue.
                                                     Turtle

[WadePatton]

Turtle, methinks you're onto something.

It's not what is is, but HOW well it is done. As well as how good the rest of the shooting system and shooter is.  Also what level of accuracy works for any particular marksman.

I like a ball starter so far, but have haven't toyed with cones much.

[smylee grouch]

In the past I have had two rifles with coned muzzles, one because I didn't know any better and the other because thats the way it came to me. Both shot min. of deer at 50 yds. and min. of box car at 100. I don't mind using a short starter if it means I can shoot a more accurate shot and if there is no documentation that they were never used I don't care. There probably isn't any documentation that they were never used also. If a shooter wants easy loading you can use a smaller ball or thinner patch, probably end up with the same amount of accuracy as using a coned muzzle.

[Mike Lyons]

PC kind of goes out the window on some things.  From what I’ve been reading and listening to, most  of the folks shooting rifles weren’t 60 - 80 years old shooting for fun.  Normal folks didn’t live that long and a rifle was as important as today’s vehicle. It was younger men strong from hard work feeding and protecting their family, neighbors and community.  They had so many children that they never hit the point of needing a little helping hand in starting a round ball.

[alacran]

It all depends as one defines as accurate. Minute of deer is not very impressive.

[45-110]

i bench shoot 2 rifles with coned muzzles at 100 yds.....never bother with 50 yds for dialing in out here in Montana. find with proper patching and heavy hunting powder charges i still generally use a short starter at the bench. in the field one could get away from the short starter though. to get 5 inch 100 yd groups requires a tight patch ball combo, one that does not blow the patch to shreds. so that said, my needs are different from others that worry about a 25 yard group.
still trying to shrink the group to say 3 inch, but not there yet in my Dimick rifle. a properly done very concentric cone for roundball shooting should not be a detriment to accuracy.
best kw

[rich pierce]

Let me see. You are going to go to these woods walk how? Why worry about weather a short starter is period correct or not. Was coning a barrel period correct?
My experience has been that a load that can be started without a ball starter are not very accurate loads.

There is some suggestion that coming a muzzle was period correct. Bob Leinemann’s new book on Moravian rifled documents enlargement of the bore at the muzzle on a pristine Christians Spring original barrel. I am currently freshing the rifling on a .36 swamped SMR which had significant, concentric, enlargement of the bore at the muzzle for about 2”.  I am about 5 shims in (0.0075”) to deepening the grooves and am just starting to deepen grooves all the way to the muzzle. I cannot see how this much could be due to ramrod wear. I’m not arguing one way or another on accuracy, but I do think there is good evidence that some relieving of the bore at the muzzle was done historically at least in some instances v

[Turtle]

I was on one PC woods walk where they asked you to dump your posibles bag and take only PC stuff(excepting eye and ear protection). Lots of plastic snuff containers with patches, plyers, plastic bags, and yes short starters. It nearly caused a riot-but I won. Most guys ended up bare ballin or not being able to load at all. I'm  Not sayin they should have run it that way or that they were right, but it sure was fun.

[45-110]

what i installed years ago is a brass peg on the side of my antler handled patch knife that i use to start the ball, (hold blade and push handle) no need to carry a clumsy short/long starter. the coning sure makes it easier.

[Acer Saccharum]

If you're a chunk gun shooter, I can't imagine you'd want to cone a muzzle.

For deer, and in the woods? Cone it!

[scottmc]

I'll try to be brief....built a Gillespie rifle around 1990.  Straight green mtn. Barrel.  Shot great at 50 yds.  Coned it and it shot like craps at 50.  Cut an inch off end of barrel and it shot great again.  I like accuracy for target shooting and hunting so I'd  go with no cone.

[bob in the woods]

I don't cone , but rather, file grooves in the lands which angle back to the bore. This allows much additional space to accommodate a patch at the muzzle and helps ease the load into the bore.  I've seen some historical evidence of this method, and it hasn't affected the accuracy of my rifle one bit

[Acer Saccharum]

I don't cone , but rather, file grooves in the lands which angle back to the bore. This allows much additional space to accommodate a patch at the muzzle and helps ease the load into the bore.  I've seen some historical evidence of this method, and it hasn't affected the accuracy of my rifle one bit

This I believe in, and do it on my own rifles. It helps organize and distribute the patch evenly around the ball as it starts down the muzzle.

[shortbarrel]

you cone the muzzle and then rifle the cone. i have watched my brother do it a few times. my twin brother and me are 83 years old today. hope we can at least make 10 more.

[smylee grouch]

I think Bob and acer make a valid point but also alot of the debate about it works/or  not boils down to an individual's definition of what accurate is. Every one will have a somewhat different opinion. A before and after test would show the results on paper.

[Smokey Plainsman]

This is always a hot topic with opposite opionions. I have two comments. #1- I cone all my guns when I build them and have won several woods walks and harvested a lot of game-I push my patched ball out of my loading block directly down the barrel-slick- enough said. #2- the negative comments on coned barrel accuracy were all barrels not coned with Joe Woods conning tool-which I use. For me, it's a settled issue.
                                                     Turtle

I’ve heard of Joe Wood’s tool, as well as one from Ed Hamburg.

What makes Wood’s tool ideal, and do you have before and after results?

[hudson]

Coning has come up before it is questionable if it will ever be settled. If don properly it shouldn’t hurt accuracy for me I believe it helps. As I do it I turn a stud a snug fit in the bore. The barrel is place in the lathe and dialed in from both ends using the stud (yep a long wait for a lathe with a big enough hole through the spindle). A proper designed coning tool should work as well. Have used several different angles and found little difference. My barrels are choked and coned. Using a tight ball/patch, the cone helps starting and the short started pushes it just past the choke.

[flinchrocket]

I have a Rice 54 cal that I coned with Ed Hamberg's coning tool and it shoots just fine. I wouldn't be afraid to use it on another barrel. Just follow the instructions.

[SingleMalt]

I've coned many barrels and never noticed any effect on accuracy.  I use Joe Wood's coning tool and follow the instructions to the letter.

[draken]

I've found that using a larger patch resulted in improved accuracy with both of my rifles with coned muzzle.  The reason is(I think)  the ball sometimes winds up off center on the patch because the tip of the ramrod is less likely to be centered on the ball while it is still in the cone.

Sounds confusing I guess but it improved my shooting.

[shortbarrel]

learned a lot about old wrought barrels by buying them. about half were coned,on the breech end anywhere from four threads up.

[scottmc]

In talking with Randall Pierce last week at the Smokey Mountain Heritage Center, he mentioned that his research has revealed that about 2/3rds of the southern mountain guns He's checked were coned, surprisingly.