Author Topic: Tapered Ram rod  (Read 4325 times)

Offline Huntschool

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Tapered Ram rod
« on: October 23, 2018, 06:42:09 AM »
Just a quick question.  How many folks have built and/or are building with a tapered ram rod, i.e. 7/16 at the front tapering to 3/8 at the front thimble..... or some such.....

I like the heft at the front on almost all my guns.  The plains style rifles, of course, have bigger appointments but the long rifles, smooth rifles and some fowlers have thinner rods......

Just asking.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2018, 06:29:39 PM by Huntschool »
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Offline smylee grouch

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2018, 06:58:56 AM »
I try to use a tapered rod on all my builds and if you can get one of Acers ramrod tapering tools you will love it as it really does work great and is fast.

Offline Chowmi

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2018, 07:21:51 AM »
I am building a Christian's Spring rifle with a tapered ramrod, and ramrod pipes that are of progressing inner diameter.  I made all the pipes, and used drill bits of the correct diameter as my mandrels. 
The result is subtle, but pleasing to the eye when you see the ramrod in the gun. 

If I remember correctly, some of the fancier rifles from that shop have graduated ramrod pipe diameters.

Jack Brooks has a classroom section on his website in which he describes making a ramrod pipe forming tool with 3 different diameters.  The link is here:

https://www.jsbrookslongrifles.com/theclassroom.htm

Scroll down a ways, and you will see it. His description is based on an original Isaac Berlin rifle, but he mentions that it is not uncommon. 

I also used Acer's (Tom Curran's) tapering tools to taper the ramrod.  I simply started at the end that goes into the ramrod pipes and scraped away until it would pass through the first pipe.  Then, like inletting a part, I scraped until it would go through the second pipe.  I continued to scrape up and down the length until it had a close fit on all three rr pipes and went all the way in. 

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Norm
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Offline Pukka Bundook

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2018, 08:43:20 AM »
Yes, always tapered.

Offline thecapgunkid

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2018, 12:27:41 PM »
I just did one on an  attempt at an early Dickert Rifle.    Starting at the base of the rod and working my way back from the base of the rod in 6 inch or so intervals, I drew a waist with a red marker around the middle of each section I wanted to work on.  Then I shaved back toward the base and gradually rotated the rod  until the entire waist had been shaved off.  I tried to keep the marker dead center on the section over which I worked.   But each pass went down toward the base on each of the intervals in order to build the taper.  I tried to keep the marker waist braced solidly on the  end of my bench so I could stop it from bending.   I ended up with maybe fifteen passes or so, from about mid way down the rod. 

I did not make my thimbles because it is too easy to buy them, but inlet the rear thimble first because I tend to be inept and that thimble can quickly become an obstruction to smooth entry of the rod into the stock.  .  I this case, because of a 32" barrel length and transitional look I wanted, I put the larger thimble up front.  I tried inserting and  and sanding in between each pass and the end product  produced an even and gradual taper.  The base end tapers beyond 3/8 inch, and the threaded tip goes on that.  I like a wooden end on the tip, and can get the rod down to where a couple of parallel grooves at the tip aid in pulling out a firmly seated rod.

I have one of those holed tools you put in a vice, but can't seem to control it the way I can by shaving.  Haven't used the shavings to start a campfire yet, though.

I had to strop or sharpen the knife in between each turns completion, and holding the knife and bracing the rod ended up being a touchy-feely thing that I had to try out and adopt.  If your knife is sharp and held at the angle you learn is best, even passed will keep the rod round.   

From now on I'll do all my rods this way.

Offline Mauser06

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2018, 02:42:10 PM »
I put my last rod in the drill and used sandpaper.   Made quick work of putting a taper in....and sanded it at the same time. 

I like tips on both ends of my rods on hunting guns. Both tips are drilled and tapped so I can use various accessories. 

I installed a 3/8" tip and a 5/16" tip.     I will probably make another rod for that gun and use something in between 5/16 and 3/8 for the small end.  No reason for it to be that skinny as I used 3/8" pipes and have a full hole to match. 


The sanding worked quickly though. 

Offline moleeyes36

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2018, 02:54:54 PM »
I always use a tapered ramrod.  Tom Curran (Acer) makes this tool that I find handy for the job. https://thosmachine.wordpress.com/2009/07/19/ramrod-scraper/

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Offline rich pierce

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2018, 05:53:18 PM »
Always. Did one on Sunday. I start with a spokeshave, go square then octagon the rasp round then use Acer’s scraper tool.
Andover, Vermont

Offline Jeff Durnell

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2018, 09:31:03 PM »
Ok, bear with me please... stupid newb question time... What are the reasons for tapering them?

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2018, 09:55:02 PM »
Reasons for tapering:
Originals on large caliber early longrifles were usually tapered.
Tapered rods do not get stuck in the ramrod hole when wet.
Rods that are fat on the business end are super strong for the first few inches where they need to be, when starting a ball.
Andover, Vermont

Offline hanshi

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2018, 10:31:06 PM »
I 'm not a builder but I do my own ramrods from round blanks.  I shave them until the small end fits in the stock without any binding.  Sometimes I put on a tip made from antler.
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Offline Daryl

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2018, 10:49:14 PM »
My English-type .69's rod is 30" long and .500" on the front end, .415" on the small end.



My .50 A. Verner-styled rifle's rod is 48" long and .440" on the big end and .300" on the small end.


Daryl

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Offline Karl Kunkel

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2018, 12:31:40 AM »
Tapered rods also clear the forward lock bolt more easily.
Kunk

Offline Mark Elliott

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2018, 04:47:53 AM »
I taper all my rods to 5/16" and always use an 11/32" ramrod drill.   It leaves as much wood as possible inside the forearm, and hopefully, less wood on the outside.   It is a little extra margin of error. 

Offline Goo

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2018, 05:13:56 AM »
I always make my own RRods because i need longer than standard and i dont like grain runout .These dowel cutters come in three sizes i mount them to a piece of wood at the distance apart that my RR thimbles change size. They work like a pencil sharpener.   Cut your square stock then chuck it up in a big hand drill and feed through the cutters.  There is some minimal scraping and clean up . The shavings can be saved for the BBQ grill
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Offline flehto

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #15 on: October 24, 2018, 03:55:34 PM »
I don't intentionally taper my RRs...they're taken down until they fit and then a little bit more so when exposed to moisture, they don't "freeze up".....mostly the dias that go into the  stock are .010 smaller than the 3/8 dia of the RRs   that are  used......Fred

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #16 on: October 24, 2018, 10:01:09 PM »
Goo:  I have a set of those cutters (3) and really like how they work.  When I'm using them, I have a support nailed to my bench into which the turned end feeds and it keeps the rod from getting into a rhythm flop.  Mine are set up to turn the strip just a bit oversized.  They create a crazy volume of shavings.

The last time I used them, I made a batch of ash arrow shafts for my warbow, pictured on another thread.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2018, 10:02:24 PM by D. Taylor Sapergia »
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Offline Huntschool

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #17 on: October 25, 2018, 07:14:32 PM »
While we are on the subject of RR's,  does anyone "soak" their hickory rods in kerosene......  I heard about this way back when.

Anyone ?????
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Offline JW

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #18 on: October 25, 2018, 07:39:23 PM »
While I'm not a builder myself, I've tapered several ramrods (replacements or backups) whilst sitting on the porch with a pocket knife/razor. Not quick, but I wasn't in a hurry.

As far as soaking in kerosene is concerned, I believe that will serve one main purpose: make your ramrod smell like kerosene.

I know folks claim that by soaking in kerosene they can bend their rod in a full circle without breaking. I don't know about you, but I'm not planning on doing any hula hooping with my ramrods. I'd rather it be straight grained and sturdy with as much natural flex as is affordable in hickory or ash.

Offline Daryl

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #19 on: October 25, 2018, 08:34:37 PM »
If anyone has seen people loading a long rifle with one of those black nylon "noodle rods", I suspect a soft hickory rod would act similarly. You'd have to choke up on it, seating the ball in 2" pushes as the rod has NO longitudinal strength.

Finch the hickory rod as if a rifle stock (stock finish) and be done with it.
Daryl

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Offline Huntschool

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #20 on: October 25, 2018, 10:03:13 PM »
The "wet noodle" thing is exactly what I figured.....
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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #21 on: October 25, 2018, 10:54:43 PM »
"I know folks claim that by soaking in kerosene they can bend their rod in a full circle without breaking"

I have heard this also, but never had anyone who would do it!!

Doc

Offline Karl Kunkel

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #22 on: October 26, 2018, 03:36:52 AM »
Do a search, there was a thread on the subject of kerosene soaking about a year ago.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2018, 03:37:51 AM by Karl Kunkel »
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Offline Goo

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #23 on: October 26, 2018, 04:24:12 AM »
Goo:  I have a set of those cutters (3) and really like how they work.  When I'm using them, I have a support nailed to my bench into which the turned end feeds and it keeps the rod from getting into a rhythm flop.  Mine are set up to turn the strip just a bit oversized.  They create a crazy volume of shavings.

The last time I used them, I made a batch of ash arrow shafts for my warbow, pictured on another thread.

Hi Taylor,  I first saw those cutters on a you tube video with the midway guy making a replacement ebony ram for an english double gun.   I use a large varible speed drill and go real slow, the drill motor gets pretty hot works it hard.   
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Offline ed lundquist

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Re: Tapered Ram rod
« Reply #24 on: October 26, 2018, 03:46:01 PM »
Can someone post a picture of the cutters or a link to the youtube or maybe a name?  I have some cutters I might be able to modify if I can see an original. Thanks.