Real Wrought Iron

[Ryan McNabb]

Does anyone know if the Real Wrought Iron Company in England has a US distributor?  I'm waiting to hear from the company but thought I'd ask.

Has anyone used their iron?

Also, does anyone know of a source for either 1008 or 1010 mild steel in flat bars suitable for barrel skelps?  I'm having a hard time finding this.  1018 is everywhere, but not 1010.

Thanks

[Ben I. Voss]

Ryan, check with admiral steel for 1010. They do sell it, but not sure if they have the size you'll need.

[Acer Saccharum]

I've sent a note to my favorite supplier.

Acer

[Acer Saccharum]

Ryan, some leads from my supplier:
Albany Steel maybe. Talk to George at Albany  1-800-342-9317

or

Chapin and Bangs in Bridgeport Ct.1-203-333-4183 Fran or Rose
those are tough to find

Let us know how it goes. Are these steels better for forge welding than 1018?

[JCKelly]

There is absolutely nothing to compare with real, actual wrought iron for forge welding. Wrought iron already contains its own flux.

When forge welding steel one must use something for flux. Check with the experienced blacksmiths here.

High carbon steel, for example 1095, tolerates less overheating than does low carbon steel or wrought iron, before it burns. Some 19th century guy had a magic process for forge welding cast steel (call it 1095, if you will) without burning. What he did, minus the 19th century terminology, was to decarburized the surface a bit. That is, he heated it up in air so that some of the carbon oxidized out of the surface. Then he had a low carbon steel surface to heat in the forge, which low carbon surface could better take a welding heat with less chance of burning.

When steel, or iron, is "burnt" in the forge, well, it is a spectacular show & the iron is now useless for anything but remelt scrap.

That "Real Wrought Iron" website is fascinating. The last iron puddled in the US was near Pittsburgh in 1961, probably by the A.M. Byers company. For good reading get thee to abeboks.com and look for "Wrought Iron, its manufacture, characteristics and applications",  by James Aston and Edward Story.

Between 1018 & 1010, speaking strictly as a metallurgist no practical experience with either, I would prefer the lower carbon 1010. That little lower carbon should be marginally less likely to burn.

Oh, and I do know how to burn wrought iron. Burnt my first iron right after I made may first & only forge weld in wrought iron.

Had an old boss, welding guy, who didn't like aluminum killed steel for forge welding. That would be industrial, big machine, forge welding. The aluminum content--and this is just a few tenths of a percent aluminum--made for a "dry weld" I don't know what he used for flux. He did know his stuff. He was about 65 years old in 1970.

[Ryan McNabb]

Thanks very much!  I've burnt wrought iron up too.  It can certainly be done in a heartbeat.

I got a message back from Real Wrought Iron and they don't have a distributor here.  They will ship you as much as you want from the UK, though.  Stuff appropriate for barrel skelps is about $30 a foot, plust whatever the shipping will be.   

Thanks very much for the tips on 1010.  I know it's as near to "carbon free" as mild steel gets.  There is also 1008, and I'm working on that too.  It seems that these super low carbon mild steels are used mostly for shim stock - I can get all of it I want in a .050 thickness!  ( ;DA little too thin...)

[rick landes]

There is absolutely nothing to compare with real, actual wrought iron for forge welding. Wrought iron already contains its own flux.

When forge welding steel one must use something for flux. ....

Borax powder will work as a flux. Also powder laudry soap will work if borax not available.

[jerrywh]

When I was blacksmithing I used pure white sand mixed with calsinde borax 50% for flux.  warning --- too many borax fumes will poison you.

[ottawa]

check and see if you can find some old wagon wheel rims they are usually wrought iron that's what Ive been told and that's what is said to be used for barrels forged at the toad  gun shop into barrels I'm trying to get the nerve up to try i my self i have 2 rims that the previous owner of my house left behind . had to kick and scream before the wife would let me keep them LOL

[Habu]

When I was blacksmithing I used pure white sand mixed with calsinde borax 50% for flux.  warning --- too many borax fumes will poison you.

As a child hanging around the blacksmith shop, one of my chores was to gather beer bottles in the alley out back, smash them to powder, and mix the glass with an equal volume of borax.  I later worked with a bladesmith who used straight 20-Mule Team borax as flux.  Straight borax is better, that molten glass hurts when it hits you! 

[Dave B]

I have it on good authority that you want to avoid using wagon wheel Iron for barrel skelps. It is very poor quality in stucture. I have never attempted to forge weld a barrel but will eventually as one of my goals is to make one from complete forge welded tube to final rifled barrel. I was talking with Flintriflesmith about this very thing and I have seen alot of old iron rims around and thought to use some of this iron. I guess if you got enough of it you could work it into a useable skelp by forge welding sections together to work out the bad spots.

[rich pierce]

Found a wrought iron horseshoe in a creekbed yesterday.  Could really see the grain.  Has a lot of rust but I'll see if something can be made of it.

[Jerry V Lape]

Dave B has learned the same thing I was told by several knowledgable people about wrought iron.  It was made in several grades which related to the amount of forging it had undergone to refine it's structure.  Wagon wheels were lowest grade - not exactly what you want for gun barrel environment.  Forging apparently works the impurities to the surface  where they can be ground off and burned off in the reheats. 

[David G]

Ryan, have you had a chance to check on any of the blacksmiting websites for the wrought iron? I know I saw some for sale within the past year but I just can't remember the site I'm not exactly sure what grade it was but I'm pretty sure it was'nt the low end. If I'm not mistaken it was from a bridge and was being offered from within the US. If I come across it again I'll let you know.

[doug]

    It occurred to me that anchor chains made in the 1800's were wrought iron.  Trouble is finding them.  I know of one piece locally but don't dive any more and it is also located very close to a ferry dock.  Also would need a 50' boat with a husky winch to lift it to the surface.  30 years ago or so I helped salvage the anchor and about 6 feet of the chain.

cheers Doug

[Leatherbelly]

   Lots of old bridges were wrought iron(railroad)

[northwoodsdave]

We had a very old local hardware place go out of business several years ago.  They had a large number of old rivets, and our local Amish population was lined up to buy them.

The rivets were malleable iron, and thus ideal for forging.  The Amish knew that, and I guess most people just shook their heads and wondered why these folks were so excited about old rivets!

Dave

[jr]

http://elliscustomknifeworks.hightemptools.com/wroughtiron.html
This place may have wrought chain links that might be worth checking out. I'm gonna check into it myself asap. also.

[KentSmith]

I'd suggest you talk to Brad Emig if you want some good wrought iron. 

[Ryan McNabb]

I'm going to call Brad.  I've bought iron from him before.  I have been talking to Real Wrought Iron and their minimum shipping price (not including the price of the iron) is 270 pounds, and we're about $1.50 to the pound.  Iron bars suitable for skelps are about $35 a foot.  Just in case anyone's curious.

[jmforge]

The wrought iron that you get from anyone involved in the custom knife biz is likely to have the MAXIMUM amount of contaminants because we like it that way.  When etched, the slag gives you kind of a damascus effect.  I'm not sure that would be a good thing for forging a rifle barrel.