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Author Topic: Southern Rifle signed A.D.  (Read 5849 times)

Offline Chris_B

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Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« on: November 17, 2018, 03:08:10 PM »
From the looks of this rifle I guess it is from the mountainous regions of TN or NC, I think I see some similarities
to the rifles pictured in Randal Pierce´s great new book...? Please correct me if I am wrong here.
Any ideas who that "A.D." might be?















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Kind regards from Germany, Chris

Offline louieparker

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2018, 03:59:24 PM »
Chris it could be Alfred Duncan . Louie
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galudwig

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2018, 04:22:52 PM »
That is a wonderful rifle! I really love the trigger guard. I don't ever recall seeing a spur like that on a forged guard of that style.
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Offline Hlbly

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2018, 05:25:28 PM »
Looks like Alfred Duncan to me.
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Offline louieparker

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2018, 06:08:40 PM »
Chris, Duncan worked in Sullivan county Tenn. That's in far north east Tenn. He must have had close ties to the Gross family of gunsmiths. As his work has some similarities. I suspect he worked with Jacob gross and maybe Alfred.. But he was older than Alfred. The construction of some of his guards are much like Alfred or vice versa.. The rear of the grip rail on your guard is near identical to Alfred's. I once did a bit of work on a Duncan rifle that I thought had the finest shaped butt stock (left side) That I gad ever seen on a Tenn. rifle, At least to my eye.
The spur on your guard is not often seen on iron Tenn. guards..
You have a very nice rifle...It may bring the greed out in a few of us...….Louie
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Offline Arnie Dowd

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2018, 06:13:32 PM »
Chris -  What a great rifle !  I'm sure that Louie is correct but you should let me buy it since it has a those initials !!  When are you going to come to the Tenn Show and bring some of your great rifles and that Banjo -  please for all of us.
Arnie Dowd
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Offline Arnie Dowd

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2018, 06:47:32 PM »
Chris -  on a more serious reply -  if you look on page 39 of Dave Byrd's 2nd book ( East Tenn Hog Rifles)  you will see a photo of Alfred Duncan's initials and they are identical to the initials on your fine rifle.   Your rifle also appears to have what is usually called a "Holston River / Valley" style cheek-piece. This style of cheek-rest was also used by Samuel Glover of Sullivan County (see page 62) and there is a photo of a Alfred Duncan rifle (Sullivan County) with this style cheek-piece on page 71 of David's first book, (Gunmakers of Buffalo Valley & Greasy Cove).  Also -  There is a photo of two Glover rifles with TGs very similar to yours in the same article in David's first book.
Hope this helps.
Arnie
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Offline Arnie Dowd

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2018, 06:49:51 PM »
Chris -  those TGs are in the 2nd book, sorry
Arnie
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Offline Chris_B

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2018, 07:26:53 PM »
What a lot of input, thank you all!
I will have to search the WWW if there is a chance to get these David Byrd books.
I am afraid my local booksellers won´t have them... ;)
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Offline Arnie Dowd

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2018, 08:27:44 PM »
Chris -  my apologies as (without thinking or looking at your last initial) I thought you were Chris H. in TX.  However you should still try to make it to the Tenn show or perhaps you have in the past.  If you too play a mean banjo, all the better. Did you actually find that rifle in Germany ?!  You still need to let me buy it   :)
Best Regards,
Arnie Dowd
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Offline Sequatchie Rifle

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2018, 09:38:19 PM »
It’s an Alfred Duncan Rifle. The patchbox is interesting. Would you post a photo of the inside? Thanks.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2020, 06:07:30 AM by Sequatchie Rifle »
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Offline Dennis Glazener

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2018, 09:56:21 PM »
Quote from: Chris_B on November 17, 2018, 07:26:53 PM
What a lot of input, thank you all!
I will have to search the WWW if there is a chance to get these David Byrd books.
I am afraid my local booksellers won´t have them... ;)

Chris
Look in our book forum and you will see ordering information and contact for David. If you need me t help drop me a PM. David is good to work with.

Dennis
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Offline Chris_B

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2018, 11:37:53 AM »
Now here is the inside of the patchbox. That lid spring still operates absolutely smooth.
@ Arnie: No need to apologize. I kind of feel honored to be mistaken for a Texan who plays the banjo so well (which I do not...) 8)
My apologies now: I am afraid I will never part with that rifle. And no: Unfortunately you do not find guns like these over here,
this one came from Ancestry Guns, MO.
@Dennis: I will try to contact David Byrd in the next days and will let you know should there be a problem. 

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Kind regards from Germany, Chris

Offline Arnie Dowd

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2018, 06:56:07 PM »
Chris -  Of course I knew the answer and I pretty sure you knew I was just kidding with you.  Your very fortunate to have this fine rifle in your collection.  If you have others, please post them.
Arnie
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Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2018, 08:36:33 PM »
Oh, my, Galudwig, and I, totally agree on this gun. The furniture in general, and the triggerguard are blacksmithing artistry. Other than the iron instead of brass furniture, and the distinctive Southern Mountain styling, the workmanship is as good or better than that of more famous gunsmiths.

  Hungry Horse
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Offline bgf

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2018, 03:13:07 AM »
Good one!  Does/did the tang extend the whole length of the comb?  I'm probably just seeing a photo artefact, but it looks like it might.
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Offline Chris_B

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2018, 07:29:12 AM »
Quote from: bgf on November 19, 2018, 03:13:07 AM
Good one!  Does/did the tang extend the whole length of the comb?  I'm probably just seeing a photo artefact, but it looks like it might.

It did, unfortunately the last part of it (which was very narrow) running to the buttplate is missing.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2018, 08:45:22 AM by Chris_B »
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Offline Chris_B

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2018, 07:35:33 AM »
Quote from: Arnie Dowd on November 18, 2018, 06:56:07 PM
If you have others, please post them.
Arnie

Fortunately I have some.
I already posted my flintlock signed *J*K*, my squirrel rifle and "2 Italian beauties".
Recently I received a fine Virginia rifle from Jim, maybe will open a topic on that one, too...
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Offline bgf

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2018, 02:47:00 AM »
Quote from: Chris_B on November 19, 2018, 07:29:12 AM
Quote from: bgf on November 19, 2018, 03:13:07 AM
Good one!  Does/did the tang extend the whole length of the comb?  I'm probably just seeing a photo artefact, but it looks like it might.

It did, unfortunately the last part of it (which was very narrow) running to the buttplate is missing.

Thanks!  Sorry the metal is gone, but the existence of the full extension is a fine feature on such a rifle, anyway.  It is one of those things that for me at least can make the best "Upper East Tennessee rifles" the equal at least of any other style in difficulty of execution points.  Did it run straight into buttplate return or did it flare any?  I guess I'm asking for another picture of the top of comb, please  :)!   I still have relatives in Sullivan county and have from the days these rifles were built, so I'm personally interested.
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Offline Chris_B

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #19 on: November 20, 2018, 07:31:18 AM »
Quote from: bgf on November 20, 2018, 02:47:00 AM
Did it run straight into buttplate return or did it flare any?  I guess I'm asking for another picture of the top of comb, please  :)!   

Obviously it did run almost to the buttplate return, maybe stopped 1/4" or so before it, I will have
to take a closer look later and make that picture, too.
Guess I will be able to do so tomorrow or the day after, pretty late home from work these days....
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Offline WadePatton

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #20 on: November 20, 2018, 06:09:25 PM »
Great gun here, nothing I can add but that I'd love to see a few more pics.

Thanks for sharing.

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Offline Sequatchie Rifle

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #21 on: November 21, 2018, 11:12:37 AM »
Thanks for posting the photo of the patchbox. Great architecture. You have a very nice rifle.
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Offline Chris_B

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #22 on: November 21, 2018, 11:25:06 AM »
some details







« Last Edit: November 30, 2018, 12:25:11 AM by Ky-Flinter »
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Offline bgf

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #23 on: November 21, 2018, 11:56:47 AM »
Vielen dank!
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Offline Chris_B

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Re: Southern Rifle signed A.D.
« Reply #24 on: November 21, 2018, 12:41:55 PM »
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