13/16 barrel flintlock question.

[Daryl Pelfrey]

Should I be able to use a large lock like a siler andget it positioed where the pan will not fall to low on the side flat of the barre?
Ive got my stock and barrel  and  just not comfortable yet about lock placement. I dk not have the lock yet. If it were percusion I would be  confident and just go for it.  I didnt know if barrel size made alot of  difference.
  Thanks

[oldtravler61]

  Daryl not sure what style you are building. That makes a big difference what lock you need. But personally I like the Chambers late Ketland. But listen to the pro's on here before you order.

[David Rase]

In my opinion, the large Siler is a bit too big for a 13/16" barrel.  A small Siler or an L&R Bailes lock would be a better choice depending upon what style of rifle you are making.  Maybe a Chambers small Queen Anne round face, once again depending upon what you are building.  Full disclaimer, I have not built a rifle with a 13/16" barrel since the mid eighties.
David

[smylee grouch]

I also think the large Siler might be too big. I have used the small  Siler on at least two  13/16 barrel builds and those worked well for fit and performance.

[BarryE]

I used a large Siler on this rifle with a 13/16th barrel in 45 caliber.  I thought it worked OK.  It would be your judgement after seeing this and deciding if it was a successful application.

[smart dog]

Hi,
You can use a large Siler but you may find that the vent hole is positioned below the the top of the pan.  That is not a really big deal unless it is buried at the bottom of the pan. Also keep in mind, the vent hole does not have to be centered on the barrel flat. You could locate it a little above center to accommodate the large Siler pan. My first 2 rifles used 13/16" barrels and large Silers and it worked out OK.  Unfortunately, the lock may not be your biggest issue with that barrel. Generally the wrist architecture is not very good with such a skinny barrel unless you are very good at shaping the lock and wrist areas.

dave

[Daryl Pelfrey]

As long as I can keep the bottom of the pan from falling below the bottom edge of the side flat of the barrel. That was my big concern. So the Dale Johnson should work,,,, correct. Barry I think that gun looks great and the lock looks good. I'm building a Dickert style 40 cal. Any more comments are greatly appreciated.

[WKevinD]

If you have a TOW catalog copy and cut out the locks you are considering. Draw your barrel, web, and RR channel lines on your stock and see how they fit. It should give you a good enough idea so you can make your decision.

Kevin

[Mike Brooks]

As long as I can keep the bottom of the pan from falling below the bottom edge of the side flat of the barrel. That was my big concern. So the Dale Johnson should work,,,, correct. Barry I think that gun looks great and the lock looks good. I'm building a Dickert style 40 cal. Any more comments are greatly appreciated.

You can always position your touch hole above the center of the barrel. Might be best to use a 1/4" liner or none at all and cone from the backside.

[Daryl Pelfrey]

Thanks Burnt, thats how i do alot of things but its a good reminder.

[rich pierce]

That’s a skinny barrel for a Dickert style (15/16” at breech would be my minimum), but it ought to carry well. 

[Bigmon]

This is a 13/16" barrel with a large Siler.  Wish I had a closer detail of the area, but it is a little large, but works fine.
Ezcept it makes it near impossible to get a front lock bolt to work with out being low in the RR hole.


easy 20 line poems

[retired fella]

I use a large siler with a douglas 13/16 mountain style with one lock bolt.  has served me well for 30 years.

[stubshaft]

Many years ago Jack Garner made me a .50 Virginia with a 13/16" barrel and a large Siler.  Looks normal and shoots great.

[hanshi]

My .45 flintlock has a 13/16" barrel and a large Siler lock.  It makes a trim and attractive package that just looks right to me.

[Daryl Pelfrey]

Wwow Hanshi that looks just like the one i just finished exceptmines percusion. Im going to start on a flintlock version now with patchbox.What make and size flashole liner did you use ?

[Dphariss]

Should I be able to use a large lock like a siler andget it positioed where the pan will not fall to low on the side flat of the barre?
Ive got my stock and barrel  and  just not comfortable yet about lock placement. I dk not have the lock yet. If it were percusion I would be  confident and just go for it.  I didnt know if barrel size made alot of  difference.
  Thanks

A small Siler will work on much larger barrels than this. Large siler is OK but for this barrel I would use a smaller lock. This is what would be a C weight swamp today with a small Siler. Don King rifle from early 70s. its your choice. But larger is not better unless its needed to recreate a certain rifle. With a 13/16 barrel you will end up with a larger rifle than necessary.


Dan

[bob in the woods]

Something to think about in a light weight rifle .   Lots of target shooters here prefer the small Siler because you have less mass , so less lock induced movement when firing.

[Dphariss]

Something to think about in a light weight rifle .   Lots of target shooters here prefer the small Siler because you have less mass , so less lock induced movement when firing.

This is another factor many do not think about. In a light weight firearm, especially pistols, movement of the firearms induced by cock fall and especially the frizzen coming a stop can increase group size unless the firearm/shooter is supported by a rest.

Dan

[Bob Roller]

Something to think about in a light weight rifle .   Lots of target shooters here prefer the small Siler because you have less mass , so less lock induced movement when firing.

This is another factor many do not think about. In a light weight firearm, especially pistols, movement of the firearms induced by cock fall and especially the frizzen coming a stop can increase group size unless the firearm/shooter is supported by a rest.

Dan

Years ago, Lynton McKenzie and another man built a replica of a 16 bore rifle made by Fenton.
It had a lock much smaller than the current L&R small Manton and the idea was just what Dan
mentioned.Lightning fast ignition and no felt jolt from the lock.I made up one of these tiny locks
after that for a local man.The parts internally were not useable but the external parts were
and it took about 3 days to get that little lock working.
We hope all who see this and those who don't had a Merry Christmas and we wish all a Happy and Prosperous 2019.
Bob Roller

[Daryl Pelfrey]

So it sounds like a small siler would possibly be faster than the large silver and less movement of the gun when firing. I was always under the impression that a large silver was faster and gave better ignition. So would the small look ok on the Dickert? I kinda had my hind set on a Dale Johnson lock. Decisions 😕

[Mike Brooks]

So it sounds like a small siler would possibly be faster than the large silver and less movement of the gun when firing. I was always under the impression that a large silver was faster and gave better ignition. So would the small look ok on the Dickert? I kinda had my hind set on a Dale Johnson lock. Decisions 😕

Been watching this for days so lets' get to the crux of the apostrophe….13/16" is too small for a Dickert styled rifle, you need to rethink what you're doing but that probably isn't going to happen. So, it really doesn't matter what you put on it as long as it makes you happy and it's a good quality lock.
 I'd dump the whole works , barrel and stock, and get yourself a good "C" weight swamper and an early styled Lancaster pre carve or plank more appropriate for a Dickert. I think Chambers has some nice offerings if you want to go the precarve route. The Johnson lock is fast as is the late ketland ( for a late period gun) by Chambers. You need to draw yourself out a full size pattern of your gun and see how everything is going to look and fit. I never cared much for large or small silers, probably used less that a dozen on the 360+ guns I have built. Nothing wrong with them, they're just boring.

[bob in the woods]

Since you're building a .40 cal , I think the " C " weight swamped barrel is overkill, but still, if you really want to build a "Dickert" , I'd rethink the project .  A 13/16 .40 barrel would be far more appropriate for a later style rifle.

[hanshi]

Wwow Hanshi that looks just like the one i just finished exceptmines percusion. Im going to start on a flintlock version now with patchbox.What make and size flashole liner did you use ?

Daryl P, unlike what seems to be the majority opinion, I tend to like larger locks.  The rifle previously pictured has a shorter 36" barrel.  I wanted a short, handi rifle with a reliable lock.  I'm kinda "ignernt" about liners but can tell you it's a ss liner, the larger one if that makes any sense.  I have a couple of guns with the little liner.  Matt Avance built that rifle and it required about a one year wait.  The second rifle I acquired was a .50 X 42" rifle.  I'll go ahead and post my .36 with a SMALL Siler and 38" X 3/4" barrel.  This skinny little rifle is astonishingly accurate.

[bob in the woods]

Totally different style rifle, which was the direction I was suggesting