PATCH/BALL SIZE IN KIBLER .54 COLONIAL

[KILTED COWBOY]

Just wondering y'all that have a Kibler colonial in .54 cal what are you using for patches balls and maybe flints for target shooting.
Chambers website says a 1"x 7/8" flint size
Rice website says powder charge starts at 60gr 2F to 90gr 2F and I assume 3F for primer charge.
Ball size 0.53 caliber
Patch thickness  .010-.012
Any reports from real world shooting?

[smallpatch]

All the Rice barrels I have use a .005" undersized ball, and .020" patch.
Load will have to be determined by you, based on lube and purpose.

[Huntschool]

I suspect 4ffffg is the priming powder to use. 

Other then that I would go with what smallpatch said although I have gotten one to shoot quite well with a .535 and .010 patch with 3FFFg powder. YMMV.....

It really doesn't matter what any one of us has done.  Your barrel is your barrel.  You need to play with the load, ball size, patch thickness and lube to find your own recipe.  If you are going to use the gun for everything from targets to deer and hogs down there in Tejas then you will need to work up several loads.  That 1 1/16 breech will hold a good charge of powder.  Those barrels are built stout and can take a bit more if you are so inclined.  Your Tejas deer are not like Midwest deer and can go down pretty easy.  Hogs, well they are hogs, and I like a stout charge to get though the shield if needed.

JMHO

[Daryl]

Guys here use the same recipe as Smallpatch, in their .54's no matter than maker, Getz, GM, or Rice.
All the guys I know using flint .54's use 4F for prime and 2F for the charge.
Powder charges vary from 75gr. for close targets to 50 yards, upping to 85gr. for 100 yards, to 100gr.
for all ranges, to 120gr. for all ranges. Most will hunt large game with 100gr. to 120gr.

[rfd]

more subjective stuff.  see what yer gun likes and listen to it rather than listen to me or others.

i prefer a .526 ball swathed in what some would call .015" tight weave cotton patching (seriously, who knows for *sure* what patch thickness really means, and at what measuring tool compression? that's beyond subjective, IMHO), tallow or oil saturated well into the patch weave, no hammer or short starter required, ramrod pushed down over a nominal 70 grains of swiss 3f, with the same tube powder used for the pan.  life is good, for me.

[Daryl]

I'm glad you are happy with your .014" smaller than the bore ball AND what some people might call a .015" patch.

KCowboy asked what ball and patch combination to use. 

Some of us attempted to give him some suggestions. some people agree with those suggestions, some don't.

Some of us are in the winner's circle at council fire, most every night at rendezvous - I've never seen ANYONE who has to wipe between

shots, in the winner's circle, except for when they have a pure luck shoot. Someone always wins who has never won before - great sport! 

Life is good.

[Frank]

Depends on the rifling. Round bottom rifling typically requires a thicker patch than the standard rifling in a Rice barrel.

[rfd]

I'm glad you are happy with your .014" smaller than the bore ball AND what some people might call a .015" patch.

KCowboy asked what ball and patch combination to use. 

Some of us attempted to give him some suggestions. some people agree with those suggestions, some don't.

Some of us are in the winner's circle at council fire, most every night at rendezvous - I've never seen ANYONE who has to wipe between

shots, in the winner's circle, except for when they have a pure luck shoot. Someone always wins who has never won before - great sport! 

Life is good.

as long as you realize that suggestions are opinions, and that there are lotsa variables that can only be dictated by the gun and its shooter and the shooter's intents with said gun.  as stated, a lotta subjectivity.

any else is silly narcissistic nonsense 

life is good! 

[Mike Brooks]

I love silly narcissistic nonsense. But I'd probably shoot an .018 patch and a .530 ball and no more than 70gr 3f. I'd start out around 60 gr. and hope it likes it. I'd probably call Rice and have a 1 in 48 twist put in a barrel of Kibler's profile in a perfect world....if I was Dictator of the world or something.

[rfd]

uh oh, mike's here and being stupid as usual, time to leave.     

[Daryl]

It is interesting - suggestions bases on 40 years of "study", not just making noise and swabbing, become subjectivity.
This is what experience can do. This is a pattern of 5 shots, from a rifle not likely shot since it was made- in 1853.
This group was shot off the bench at a target paper 100 meters away. We guessed at what that rifle might like and
this is the result. Thus, subjectivity pays off if backed up by 'some' experience.
There was no "working up a load".  We simply used what we knew would work at least in a mediocre fashion.

 

[OldMtnMan]

I've never lost any game with my loose, swabbing load. Good enough for me.

[Joe Schell]

I woud just see what the gun likes. A friend of mine shot this group at 100 yards from a bench. I think hes shooting a .600 ball and .020 patch in a 62 cal, hopefully he'll correct me if im wrong. His gun also has a coned muzzle and he was shooting diamondback powder with no swabbing between shots.

[Daryl]

I've never lost any game with my loose, swabbing load. Good enough for me.

I've noticed, over the years, that the X-ring on an animal,
 even a little one is pretty big.  Most or at least many of us
  do our shooting on a range and generally shooting against
 other people.  Guilt edge accuracy is important to many of us.

Joe - 90gr. with mink oil would have been interesting to see.
Changing 2 things will skew the results. Decent group with Neetsfoot Oil.

[OldMtnMan]

I've never lost any game with my loose, swabbing load. Good enough for me.

I've noticed, over the years, that the X-ring on an animal,
 even a little one is pretty big.  Most or at least many of us
  do our shooting on a range and generally shooting against
 other people.  Guilt edge accuracy is important to many of us.

Joe - 90gr. with mink oil would have been interesting to see.
Changing 2 things will skew the results. Decent group with Neetsfoot Oil.

 If I aim at center kill zone. I better hit center. Being a still hunter a lot of my shots are running shots. Ask any dedicated still hunter and you'll see the high percentage of running shots are taken.
 I've been shooting offhand since my dad taught me in 1950. Anybody can get good at something if they do it that long. I've won my share of BP shoots and made a living at trap shooting. It's not my style to post pictures of my targets but from what i've seen posted on this forum i'd be winning your shoots. I have zero interest in bench shooting, so i'm talking offhand only.

Stop being so condescending Daryl. You aren't the only one who can shoot.

[Daryl]

Sry - did not mean to be condescending.

"It's not my style to post pictures of my targets but from what I've seen posted on this forum I'd be winning your shoots."

 
 

[OldMtnMan]

Let's forget it, Daryl. You caught me in a grumpy mood. 

[Steve Patterson]

I'm pretty new to this sport and it's not a kibler but this is what I am happy with for the moment:

535  Hornady RB with .20 precut dry pillow ticking, spit lubed with 80gr. Goex 3F at 40 yds in my pedersoli frontier works well for me. Primed 3 pushes out of one of those brass plunger type primers with the same powder.

I'm planning on playing with bear grease lube next.

[Marcruger]

"Depends on the rifling. Round bottom rifling typically requires a thicker patch than the standard rifling in a Rice barrel."

This (in my opinion) is hugely important.  There is a lot of difference between a .016+ round grove and a .012 flat groove. 

I like Daryl's formula.  I am using a 5-under ball and .018 super tight-weave canvas patching.  Tight loading for sure, but works without burning holes in the patching. 

Switching to Daryl's idea of wet-patching without wiping really helped me.  I was taught by a target shooter to wipe between shots.  I learned that all I was doing was making a mud-cake UNDER the powder charge.  If you don't wipe, and use a wet-patch, it puts the gradeau mud cake on TOP of the charge, where it all goes out the barrel on firing. 

My flint rifle does not shoot as well as Daryl's, it loads harder, and cleans up a bit worse, but going to his method sure improved things for me.  Thank you Daryl.

I hope this helps.  God Bless,  Marc

[OldMtnMan]

Using a wet patch is not new. It's been known for decades that you can shoot all day with no swabbing with wet patches. It doesn't matter if the load is tight or not.

The problem is wet patches are good for target work but not for hunting. In my case I won't shoot a different load for practice than I do for hunting. So, i'll use a load that's not as tight and swab. It doesn't matter if I have to swab or not for hunting. I've only got one shot to get it right.