Can you "handy-cap" a bp competition

[alacran]

On my previous post I mentioned categories, based on gender and age. If you have enough shooters you can categorize based on equipment, flintlock, caplock, smoothbore.  It is is silly to handicap a shoot where only 15 people show up to shoot.  I always have fun at the shoots I go to. I joke with the other shooters and visit. Only time I am serious is when I'm on the line actually shooting. I agree with Molly some NMLRA shoots are not only dry but boring.
At the AZWINS shoot last month I shot the trail walk with someone I've known for a long time and an absolute stranger. After a couple of the 25 targets we shot, anyone watching would have thought we were lifelong friends. We had a good time harassing each other. We still shot very well.

[Mike Brooks]

Anybody can become a good shooter. When I started out shooting flintlocks I was absolutely awful. with more practice than you can imagine , in about three years I started placing near the top and stayed there for many years. In fact, in 1986 I tied a national record at F-ship. I haven't been to an organized shoot in years. If I did go I certainly wouldn't expect to win and would be embarrassed if I was given a participation trophy because my feelings might otherwise get hurt. I like to shoot, I like the competition, I like the people I shoot with. It's a social event.
 I shot cowboy for three years, 3 weekends a month, every month. Placed last or second to last EVERY match. I enjoyed EVERY match I shot. i'm now shooting some bullseye matches. I'm doing it with classic old S&W revolvers. The winners are using slicked up fancy semi autos. I come in last every time. I don't care, I'm having a blast just being there shooting with the guys. I will NEVER win and I don't care.

[Don Adams]

There will always be those folks that want to compete and they practice their skills and they want to measure their skills against others. There are those of us -(yes me included) that just find it fun to shoot with others and have a good time and rib each other every now and then. No two school of thoughts are wrong.  To each there own.
To even out the playing field for prizes - would be a blind target.  Take the 6 bull target cut the targets and glue them on a piece of paper and turn it over against the back stop. One bull per paper target.  Only the blank paper is shown - you can place the targets anywhere on the piece of paper and mount them down range before anyone gets there.  The shooters would be assigned a target.  You can number them. They shoot their target maybe 5 shots.  They could miss the bull all together actually.  Unless they purposely move their shots around the target to hopefully get a scoring target.

[OldMtnMan]

There will always be those folks that want to compete and they practice their skills and they want to measure their skills against others. There are those of us -(yes me included) that just find it fun to shoot with others and have a good time and rib each other every now and then. No two school of thoughts are wrong.  To each there own.
To even out the playing field for prizes - would be a blind target.  Take the 6 bull target cut the targets and glue them on a piece of paper and turn it over against the back stop. One bull per paper target.  Only the blank paper is shown - you can place the targets anywhere on the piece of paper and mount them down range before anyone gets there.  The shooters would be assigned a target.  You can number them. They shoot their target maybe 5 shots.  They could miss the bull all together actually.  Unless they purposely move their shots around the target to hopefully get a scoring target.

Don, that would be pure luck to win. Should a shoot be pure luck? Might as well pick numbers out of a hat.

[snapper]

I think some are missing the point.  Molly is giving a pie away as a prize.  It is to be fun thing, that anyone can win.  It is not like they are shooting to be the Inter Galactic Champion.  Which I won a couple of weeks ago BTW, does not matter that there were only 5 people shooting.  I am still the IGC!   

Fleener

[OldMtnMan]

I'm too competitive to shoot like that. I'd give the pie away anyway. I don't eat sweets.

I'm already too sweet. 

[Don Adams]

There will always be those folks that want to compete and they practice their skills and they want to measure their skills against others. There are those of us -(yes me included) that just find it fun to shoot with others and have a good time and rib each other every now and then. No two school of thoughts are wrong.  To each there own.
To even out the playing field for prizes - would be a blind target.  Take the 6 bull target cut the targets and glue them on a piece of paper and turn it over against the back stop. One bull per paper target.  Only the blank paper is shown - you can place the targets anywhere on the piece of paper and mount them down range before anyone gets there.  The shooters would be assigned a target.  You can number them. They shoot their target maybe 5 shots.  They could miss the bull all together actually.  Unless they purposely move their shots around the target to hopefully get a scoring target.

Don, that would be pure luck to win. Should a shoot be pure luck? Might as well pick numbers out of a hat.

It could be pure luck - but the prize is a pie and I would find it fun just to shoot and see how close I got.  More fun shooting than pulling a piece of paper out of a hat.

Closest to the bull wins. If it was for big money - then yeah, you would want to see the target. 

[OldMtnMan]

You don't know how much some people like pie.

[Daryl]

When my wife was shooting with us, she was pretty good, never complaining about shooting with or against the boys.

In the buck and doe matches, she'd off times beat you with your own rifle (even Taylor's old .62 Hawken), thus, I have to

agree with Mike about becoming better. Of course, I have to admit here, that it helps if you can load tight fitting loads. She

was a whole 120 pounds back then and had no trouble. 'Course, she got to wrassle with me.

To keep shooters interested in the mean time, maybe a luck shoot now and then will help. Not sure.

[bgf]

Molly,

Can you handicap a BP competition? Yes.  Simple? Not so much.

Several years ago I was a member of a ML club that held a monthly shoot that used a handicap system.  The match program was 4 targets, the NMLRA small bull and large bull at 25 yards, and the same 2 targets at 50 yards, 5 shots on each target, for a total possible 200 points.  Cash from a portion of the entry fees was paid out based on handicap scores.  In addition, 1 ounce .999 silver coins were awarded for the high scratch (non-handicap) and high handicap scores. When you won silver, you couldn't win silver again for 6 months.

At a shooter's first match, their handicap was calculated using the following formula.
200 possible points minus  the shooter's actual 4 target score multiplied by 80%.
If my scores on the 4 targets totaled 150 points, my handicap would be 40.
200 - 150 = 50 x .80 = 40  This amount would be added to my scratch score at the next monthly shoot.

We kept a record book and averaged each shooter's scores for the previous 6 matches they attended.  This cut down the possibility of sand-bagging.

-Ron

I also participated in this shoot.  It was pretty fair, but some of the better shooters resented that they couldn't win as often as they wanted to and we eventually discontinued it. 

In general, I think people are happy shooting if there is variety and a chance to win.  I've dreaded the monthly offhand match for years, even before I became an awful offhand target shooter !  It is just tedious and monotonous all the time.  Also, I've seen that often the "better" offhand shooters are less than flexible when it comes to other types of matches., so need the routine  Of course, many are just good at everything...so at least if you're always getting beat,  it is something different every time .

I personally hate drawing shooters prizes or targets of chance, but some folks like "winning" even if it's pure luck.

[Mike Brooks]

I didn't know there was a pie involved. I think I'd just cut up and eat the pie before the shoot even starts.

[Molly]

After mindful deliberation and considering all suggestions here is the plan.

We will have "classes"

1.  50 cal and up at 50 yards off hand.
2.  40/45 cal from rest at 50 yards.
3.  32/36 cal from rest at 30 yards.
4.  under 32 cal from rest at 25 yards.
5.  Pistol class off hand 15 yards.

5 shot limit must be taken in a span of 5 minutes.  If a shooter only get 4 shots in the time limit so be it. 

Total individual results.  Highest total wins the class.  Shooters can enter as many classes as the want but only win in one. 

A randon drawing for the pie from the class winners.  OR  The winners get one shot at a small pink marshmello bunny at 25 yards.  Shoot until you miss.  Miss and your out.  Last shooter standing wins.

Not exactly a handicap but then most of the better shooters shoot 50 cal.  Guess who has a 32 and a 25 cal!

[smylee grouch]

Sounds like it might be a fun shoot but more fun if it were Rhubarb.   

[Mike Brooks]

Too many rules... Although it would be fun to shot the bunnies.

[Bob Roller]

Snappers idea (luck shoot is a good one) good shooters shoot more and then some more, works for everyone that does /Ed

Competing in shooting matches was a lot of fun but other interests got in the way
and the last time I actually shot against another shooter was about 14 years ago
when I used a long range muzzle loader at 500 meters against a breech loader and won.
It was knock down targets.
Years ago I heard one of the guys shooting the 500 yard match at Friendship say "If
I get beat out of LAST place there will be a foot race or a fist fight" .

Bob Roller

[Daryl]

Could always have a 3-shot match and all the good shooters have to shoot a hunting load (150gr. +) from a 14 or 12 bore rifle.

Not many will hit with the second & third shots.

[Molly]

I wonder why?

 

[Davemuzz]

It is not like they are shooting to be the Inter Galactic Champion.

I think you're wrong.......I think it IS an Inter Galactic Championship shoot.

Why?  'Cause Molly only bakes Inter Galactic pies!!

[David Price]

Several years ago my good friend John Richardson and I went to a woodswalk at Eric Bye's club in Vermont.  We all had to supply a blanket prize and put it on the blanket before the shooting started.  All the prizes were quite good, but when John  placed a wooden, not so straight,  wiping stick  on the blanket every one looked around in amazement .  John was normally a very generous man so I couldn't believe he would supply such a lousy prize.  There was a very young first time shooter there that day.  and of course he was the last one to take a prize off the blanket.  He stepped forward and picked up his prize without complaining at all.  At that moment John spoke up and said, wait a minute I didn't put all my prize on the blanket.  He then handed the boy a large ham, block of cheese, and two pounds of black powder.

John passed away a couple of  years ago.........I miss him

[Molly]

Even though I did not know him, I would say...John was a class act!

And yes, Dave, this pie is the mother of all pies.  People would walk for miles just to get a wiff of it cooling on the window sill.  Why I once had a passer by offer me his new BMW just for a slice.  I have so many Blue Ribbons from county and state fairs that my hubby had to add a room in the basement just to put them in.  Apple is always in demand but the all time local favorite is goose berry.  Rhubarb is good but I'd just as soom have my rhubarb warm in a bowl than mess around with a crust....too runny.  There is a rumor going around that some bench rest shooters are going to try to create a distraction and then one of them will sneak around, find the pie and take off.  BUT, little do they know I have arranged for an armored Brinks truck to deliver it.


                                                                                                             

[snapper]

Molly

Perhaps you should tell us where you live so we can stop in for a visit?  We would call first of coarse.   Got to give you a chance to have a nice warm pie ready. 

Heck I would even trade you pies since I make the best Chocolate Pecan pie spiked with whiskey.

Fleener

[Molly]

That pie sounds good, however...

I prefer my whiskey in a glass with P-cans and chocolate on the side. 

But I'd still try it.

[OldMtnMan]

You sound like a lot of fun Molly.

[snapper]

my world famous Chocolate Whiskey Pecan Pie

I woke up in the middle of the night years ago with this idea and ended up acting on it.

2/3 cup sugar
1/3 butter
1 cup corn syrup  sometimes I used some sorghum or honey as part of the one cup.
1/2 t salt
3 eggs
1 cup pecan halves or broke pieces.  I do both or either at times
1/4 cup whiskey
2T of baking coco powder
small hand full of coconut

heat oven to 375, mix everything together except the pecans.  Put Pecans on the bottom of the pie crust, pour mixture over the top of them.  Bake for 40 to 50 min.

This is not as sweet as most pecan pies.  The bitter coco helps knock down the sweetness a little.

I cheat and buy my crust already made from the refrigerated section of the store.  Pillsbury does a good job.  Yes I know my mom's crust made with lard are to die for, but I dont keep lard around and I dont make my own crust...


Fleener

[Robby]

You could try the Tonya Harding school of handicapping.

Robby