Author Topic: Help with inlay attachment  (Read 942 times)

Offline BillF/TRF

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Help with inlay attachment
« on: July 10, 2019, 10:49:12 PM »
I tried attaching a german silver hunters star inlay to my buttstock with with locktite epoxy thinking that I didn't need to use nails or studs to hold it in place since I could hold it tight with a rubber footed C clamp and I didn't want to indent the inlay with hammer strokes.  Unfortunately  the star loosened up after a couple of months and came off.  My question: Could I reattach the star with superglue and would it be ok to apply over the hardened epoxy?  Thanks!

Online rich pierce

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2019, 11:27:07 PM »
Iíd nail it down. Epoxy already failed.
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Offline Scota4570

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2019, 01:16:26 AM »
IF you do not want to nail it. make teeth on the back of the inlay with a graver or other sharp pointy thing.  One of these vibratory engravers that people use to deface valuable antique guns work well.  If you can make them like little rasp teeth.  Dig out most of the old epoxy leaning enough in the corners to establish the depth.  The new epoxy will hold. 

You should not have to clamp it.  If you did that may have sprung the inlay causing it to pop later. 
« Last Edit: July 11, 2019, 08:48:01 AM by Scota4570 »

Offline TommyG

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2019, 01:22:57 AM »
Like Rich said, nail it.  I make 1/16" silver nails from wire stock you can get from Rio-Grande.  Heat the end until a small ball forms and quench then form(peen) the head in a steel block with a 1/16" hole and small countersink on one end, trim to about 1/4" long and put a few barbs on the shank using a chisel or utility knife.  Drill & countersink your pilot holes same size as the wire and install, flush off head with the inlay.  I wouldn't worry about deforming the inlay as you already have bed of epoxy in place to even out any imperfections on the inlet.

Offline Mike Lyons

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2019, 02:07:15 AM »
I have a couple different sizes of tiny brass pins that work.  I picked them up at the CLA show last year. If you need a few, pm me your address and Iíll send you some. 

Offline Goo

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2019, 05:21:58 AM »
West system 655-K plastic boat repair kit adheres metal to wood quite well.  It's available online type in first 7 words as your search terms. Phone won't copy past a link.
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Online Nemovir

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2019, 04:28:48 PM »
Like Rich said, nail it.  I make 1/16" silver nails from wire stock you can get from Rio-Grande.  Heat the end until a small ball forms and quench then form(peen) the head in a steel block with a 1/16" hole and small countersink on one end, trim to about 1/4" long and put a few barbs on the shank using a chisel or utility knife.  Drill & countersink your pilot holes same size as the wire and install, flush off head with the inlay.  I wouldn't worry about deforming the inlay as you already have bed of epoxy in place to even out any imperfections on the inlet.

silver will make it nicer. 

Offline flehto

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2019, 06:18:36 PM »
On the edges of even thin inlays, a "V" groove in filed in and it doesn't have to be very deep nor all around...just in a few areas. These grooves capture the epoxy  so just adhesion doesn't   have  to hold in place. The grooves are filed in w/ a triangular needle file.  In addition, I use nails because that's HC......Fred

Offline jerrywh

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2019, 08:57:31 PM »
Glue of any kind including superglue is as good as the preparation.  The inlay needs to be perfectly clean and should be sanded on the inner side to give it a tooth If done properly it will not cone out. Sterling oxidizes and needs to be sanded clean even if you don't see any oxidation it is there. It wasn't the epoxy that failed it was the hand that applied it.  No offense intended.
  PS for making nails I recommend .020 or .030 sterling silver wire. Cut it diagonally with a set of good flush cut nippers. You may need a small drill bit also to drill the holes. You  can find them at the hobby shop or Rio Grande jewelers supply.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2019, 09:07:33 PM by jerrywh »
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Offline T*O*F

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2019, 09:48:56 PM »
Inlays are like life.  If you don't nail it the first time, try nailing it the 2nd time.  You'll probably succeed.
Dave Kanger

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Offline BillF/TRF

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2019, 10:34:50 PM »
Thanks for all the replys!  I did scratch up the underside of the inlay heavily but Scota4570 is probably right, I clamped the inlay down but maybe took the clamp off before the epoxy cured and with the tips bent down, the inlay probably sprung back!  I do have some very small, 3/64" x 5/8" german silver nails and believe it or not , found a set of very small drill bits (dremel 1/32" to 1/8") at Walmart , and they work in my drill press! I'll drill some pilot holes in the inlay and stock, countersink, and use a large dowel (thanks Rich) to push them in.  I might use a few drops of CA just in case!

Offline Mike Lyons

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2019, 11:05:21 PM »
Inlays are like life.  If you don't nail it the first time, try nailing it the 2nd time.  You'll probably succeed.

I remember an old wise man giving me advice alone those same lines.  "Nail them all, you might miss a good one." 

Offline davec2

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2019, 07:06:11 AM »
Bill,

There are a lot of reasons why the inlay came out.  I won't go into a lot of information about CTE (coefficient of thermal expansion.....a property all materials have) that can often causes a bond failure like yours.  But here is another sure fire way to provide a solid attachment without nails or screws (that show). 

I often silver (or lead) solder pins on the back of an inlay (very small brad nails cut short work well), cut some slight notches in the pins with a jewelers file, and then drill holes to receive the pins in the bottom of the inlay cavity.  I often use AcraGlass to fill the holes and then insert the inlay with its pins.  I have also used melted pitch (very traditional material) and if you have ever tried to get a part you were engraving out of a pitch bowl, you will have a lot of confidence on the adhesion to the pins on the back of a well fitting inlay.

Also....sometimes instead of pins, I solder one or two tiny flat head wood screws on the back of the inlay.  Saves me the time of making pins and cutting notches.  Of course, the screws don't get turned in, they just have the threads that get held by the pitch or AcraGlass or epoxy.  Here are a couple of patch box lid inlays done this way....the fist one is cast silver and is carved in bas relief and stands proud of the surface.  The second one in brass, is filed flush with the surface after installation and then engraved.




« Last Edit: December 08, 2019, 01:39:35 AM by davec2 »
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Offline jerrywh

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2019, 07:58:02 PM »
It always Makes me mad to see davec2's work because it's so darn good.
Nobody is always correct, Not even me.

Offline Ed Wenger

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2019, 02:54:14 PM »
Yes it is, Jerry!  And thanks for the info Dave, I had never heard of the screw technique, thatís huge! 



          Ed

Offline smallpatch

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Re: Help with inlay attachment
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2019, 08:47:03 PM »
Ok, I know this isn't period correct, but guaranteed to keep them in place.
I solder a very small screw or two to the back of the inlay, then bore a hole where the screws are, mushroom the hole so it's larger on the bottom than the top, epoxy it in place.  Never gonna move.
In His grip,

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