Author Topic: Lyman GPR Quality  (Read 4901 times)

jambuster

  • Guest
Lyman GPR Quality
« on: October 25, 2019, 12:22:30 AM »
Well I bought a Lyman Great Plains Rifle two years ago and have never had the chance to shoot it. Every time I get it out something else comes up. I am going to try next weekend and I was just looking at how poorly the manufacturer assembled it. There is no finish on the stock (stain gets on my hand when I pick it up) and the stock is the poorest quality walnut I have ever seen used on a gun. The wood to metal fit is terrible. Those things are all bad but the thing that really bothers me is the flats on the barrel are slightly rounded and not milled flat. I have a friend with one bought back in the 80’s or 90’s and it is really well done. I’m sure it will shoot fine but I would have a hard time recommending Lyman to anybody else.
Also last year I had to send the original barrel back because of a recall. To Lyman’s credit they took care of this issue with no problems. However, the first barrel was done correctly and when I got the new barrel I was just very disappointed. I put the whole thing back in the closet and stopped looking at it. I really wanted a TVM Leman but I wasn’t sure I was going to shoot it enough to justify the cost. The Lyman rifle looked close to a Hawken and seemed reasonable. Really wish I hadn’t invested $650.00 in the Lyman.

Offline varsity07840

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 305
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2019, 12:27:49 AM »
Did you buy the rifle new, in the box or second hand? If second hand, it could be a poorly assembled kit gun.

jambuster

  • Guest
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2019, 12:37:50 AM »
New from Mid South Shooters Supply. I probably should have bought the kit version because I probably won't be happy till I fix these problems which means next summer I will probably clean the stock up and put on a real finish. Then  I will see if I can't file the "barrel flats" flat. Everything is mechanically sound I just think there is a serious lack of quality control at the manufacturer. This is a mechanically simple design  that is just poorly executed.It is a shame because there is not much in this price range that looks like a real Plains Gun. I shoot predators a lot but I have been trying to get back into "Traditional Black Powder" for the last couple of years. I may order a TVM in the spring......
« Last Edit: October 25, 2019, 01:07:56 AM by jambuster »

Offline Tilefish

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 173
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2019, 01:34:33 AM »
The quality years ago was pretty good now its horrible.My son bought one last year wood to metal fit was horrible. The lock would get stuck on half cock then randomly free fall pretty scary. Sent it back to them after three weeks they sent another gun still horrible metal to wood fit. Went to clean the barrel and there was a three inch section of the barrel the ramrod and patch would free fall before engaging the rifling again. That was the last straw just sent it back and went another route.
Chad

leadslinger62

  • Guest
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2019, 02:01:19 AM »
I have a older GPR, maybe from the 90`s, and a 5 year old Trade Rifle. The GPR is a percussion and still shoots excellent and the Trade Rifle is a Flinter and the lock sparks like Hellfire and is easy on flints and is accurate. I was going to buy a Deerstalker, but from all the negativity, ain`t gonna now !!

Offline mountainman70

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2393
  • USAF vet 1971-1972 malmstrom afb,montana
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2019, 05:43:44 AM »
Also check the breechplug casting closely. A fellow sent me pics of one of these nightmares, and the bplug had a hole  in the hook end that went in to the barrel bore. I also had one built in the 80-90s, was assembled  correctly ,looked like a plains rifle and was helluva gong beater. Sold it for more than I paid. Have a goodun. Dave 8) 8)

Online Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13167
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2019, 04:06:42 PM »
You get what you pay for.
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline Bob McBride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2828
  • TENNESSEE
    • Black Powder TV
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2019, 05:04:37 PM »
It wasn’t long ago $650 would get you a helluva nice factory gun. Most of these wouldn’t pry $100 out of my wallet. There are many a decent rifle built in the 60’s-80’s that can be had for $650 and be more HC and better made to boot.

Offline rich pierce

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18821
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2019, 05:33:42 PM »
Bob nailed it. Buy a 1970s rifle in great shape.
Andover, Vermont

jambuster

  • Guest
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2019, 06:12:44 PM »
The quality issue here is too bad because a new person to the hobby should be able to get a reasonably well built gun for $650.00 IMHO. Additionally they have been supplying this gun for 30 years or more . You would think they had the manufacturing down.

Online Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13167
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2019, 06:23:15 PM »
The quality issue here is too bad because a new person to the hobby should be able to get a reasonably well built gun for $650.00 IMHO. Additionally they have been supplying this gun for 30 years or more . You would think they had the manufacturing down.
$650? I pay $300 for a barrel, $200 for a lock and $200 for a piece of wood. That's $700 and I still need mounts and have to make the gun yet. For $650 I'm I'd be surprised  it even works.
 I believe back in the day those Lymans were made in the USA and weren't bad quality. Aren't they Eyetalian now?
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline J Henry

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #11 on: October 25, 2019, 06:41:47 PM »
  I have a GPR and it looks good and shoots real good, made in Italy and it is left handed 50 cal.

Offline Bob McBride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2828
  • TENNESSEE
    • Black Powder TV
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #12 on: October 25, 2019, 07:58:39 PM »
The quality issue here is too bad because a new person to the hobby should be able to get a reasonably well built gun for $650.00 IMHO. Additionally they have been supplying this gun for 30 years or more . You would think they had the manufacturing down.


Oh, they have the manufacturing down all right. When a t-shirt was $15 and we lived in the shadow of the factory we moaned under the weight of it all. Now t-shirts are $5 a dozen and the factories are full of ghost hunters filming shows I can watch in my itchy, ill-fitting, screamer-of-a-deal, white t-shirt. YMMV.

Also, just like anything else, a new person can get a well built gun for $650, he just has to be able to navigate the hucksters. I forget who said it, maybe Ford, but it’s a thing I try to live by, “Don’t buy anything that is advertised, because if it is worth what they ask and necessary you’d already have one”. It’s not necessarily practical to follow that explicitly but it’s a good rule of thumb to bring to mind whenever you contemplate a purchase. That being said, most people don’t ‘contemplate’ much anymore I hear.

 IMHO.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2019, 08:22:50 PM by Bob McBride »

jambuster

  • Guest
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #13 on: November 14, 2019, 03:44:01 AM »
Got out today and finallly shot my gun.  Even though it doesn't look as good as it could it did shoot well. i was using 90grains of Graff fffg  , Hornaday .530 ball, Remington #11 cap , TC prelubed patch  .015".
I could only shoot two rounds and then it became very difficult to load. A quick swab with CVA barrel blaster and I was back in business. The barrel seemed smooth and clean up was very easy

Going to try again Friday. Seems good so far.

jambuster

  • Guest
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #14 on: November 14, 2019, 03:52:54 AM »
One more thing ! I am finally back shooting traditional black powder rifles and it was loads of fun.

Jambuster

Smokey Plainsman

  • Guest
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2019, 01:55:33 PM »
Meh, sounds like a typical GPR to me.

Cosmetically they are pretty ugly, but they’re tough and dependable guns with a reputation for good accuracy. More correct styling than many other imported guns. I’ve since sold my GPR because it had some design qualities I didn’t care for (awful microscopic Allen head cleanout bolt that bottoms on the nipple threads, patent breech which is a hassle to clean, etc.) but it was a good shooting gun and would make a fine beater gun for hunting.

Offline Daryl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14970
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #16 on: November 25, 2019, 10:07:38 PM »
When cleaning cap-lock guns, I remove the nipple, stick that end of the barrel in a bucket of cold tap water, and pump water into and out of the bore
to clean it.  I then remove the barrel, wipe it dry, then using 4 to 5 doubled flannelette patches, I dry the bore, then spray WD40 into the bore until
it runs out the nipple seat, then patch that out, wipe down the barrel, replace the nipple, replace the barrel on the gun & store  the rifle muzzle down
so any excess oil from the breech area can drain out. Here, with a humidity of about 50% average, there is no further rust prevention needed.  In your
 climate, rust preventive requirements might be different.
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline Jerry

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2019, 06:52:37 PM »
The only Lyman GPR that I ever owned shot so well. I set it up with a Lyman rear peep sight with adjustable aperture and a globe front sight with inserts. With that set up, it compensated for a lot of my short comings. Still have trophies, plaques, and signed targets from those days. Enjoyable times!

Offline Bob Roller

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9301
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #18 on: December 09, 2019, 03:04:28 PM »
The quality issue here is too bad because a new person to the hobby should be able to get a reasonably well built gun for $650.00 IMHO. Additionally they have been supplying this gun for 30 years or more . You would think they had the manufacturing down.

Sounds to me like the lowest bidder has struck again.

Bob Roller

jambuster

  • Guest
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2019, 10:22:37 PM »
Well Bob I guess you are trying to say you get what you pay for or the GPR is just a cheap gun. Maybe so but clearly not everyone can a afford a custom or simi custom gun . There are much cheaper options than the GPR out there ; Traditions products for instance. There are numerour accounts of these shooting aa well as my GPR DOES. I was just expecting more for $650 and wasn't looking to buy a show piece.

Offline MuskratMike

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2191
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #20 on: December 16, 2019, 05:18:16 AM »
If this is a new factory built rifle (regardless of where you bought it), call or e-mail Lyman. A couple of years ago I bought one of their G.P. Pistols in cap lock. While the fit and finish were mediocre at best it shot well and functioned fine. They are known as a customer friendly company, with enough photo evidence and documentation you might be surprised by what they are willing to do to help you. It's worth a try.
I have since sold the pistol (cheap) to a club to raffle off and had a custom made pistol built. However not everyone have the resources to do so.
Post what happened when you notified Lyman of the quality issues.
Merry Christmas (yes I said Christmas)
The "Muskrat"



"Muskrat" Mike McGuire
Keep your eyes on the skyline, your flint sharp and powder dry.

457121

  • Guest
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #21 on: December 18, 2019, 02:33:28 AM »
My Lyman GPR has many of the same fit/finish issues as jambuster and tilefish. Every barrel flat has end mill swirl marks the full length of the barrel. The first time I tried to pull the ramrod out of the rifle the brass end came off in my hand. The whole rifle is trimmed in iron so it's odd to me that the ramrod had brass ends. The stock and ramrod finish looked like brown paint. It's like some kind of stain/oil mix that was given one sloppy coat. I was kinda shocked at the poor fit and finish and took it back to where I bought it. They brought out 1/2 a dozen others from the stock room and we opened them up to compare. None were better and some were worse! The rifle is a shooter though and I've since reworked the stock and metal. The kits are only about $100 cheaper than the assembled rifles and what you get is about a $100 assembly job.

Offline Notchy Bob

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 252
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #22 on: December 19, 2019, 06:35:21 AM »
I have since sold the pistol (cheap) to a club to raffle off and had a custom made pistol built. However not everyone have the resources to do so.

Merry Christmas (yes I said Christmas)
The "Muskrat"




I don't want to hijack the thread, but that's a nice pistol, MuskratMike!  Is that from Lowell Haarer?

Back to the Lyman issue:  I bought a Lyman Great Plains Pistol from Dixie Gun Works maybe 20 years ago... I'm not sure, but it was a while back.  I'm pretty happy with the fit and finish, for a production gun.  My only issues were that the rear sight notch was too narrow (no daylight on either side of the front sight), the shapeless lock bolt inlay (if you don't use the belt hook), the ugly snail, and the grip is not very ergonomic.  I've often thought an outfit like Pecatonica River could come up with an aftermarket replacement stock with a better and more traditional grip design and better wood.  I doubt that will ever happen, though.  I've had no problems with the gun, and the lock, trigger, and barrel are fine.  These imported production guns will never measure up to the quality of custom guns, but you get what you pay for.  I believe a pistol like MuskratMike's will cost you around $1600.00.

However, you fellows have given the impression that maybe Lyman's quality has deteriorated.  If I were to buy a GPR, I would most likely look at used ones of an older vintage.  Track of the Wolf and the Gun Works usually have several, and they will give you an honest description of the guns they have for sale.  The online gun markets like GunBroker and Guns America usually have dozens of them at any given time.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob
"Should have kept the old ways just as much as I could, and the tradition that guarded us.  Should have rode horses.  Kept dogs."

from The Antelope Wife

Offline MuskratMike

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2191
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #23 on: December 19, 2019, 06:58:51 AM »
Notchy Bob: you have a good eye. Yes it is 1/2 of a matched pair rifle/pistol I had Lowell Haarer make for me . The pair are featured on his web page under "recent projects" or look at my post under contemporary builders from November 27th. I have got to the age where I would gladly have fewer numbers if I can increase quality. Hardly have the time to shoot the ones I have now.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2019, 10:50:42 PM by MuskratMike »
"Muskrat" Mike McGuire
Keep your eyes on the skyline, your flint sharp and powder dry.

Offline Craig Wilcox

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2440
Re: Lyman GPR Quality
« Reply #24 on: December 19, 2019, 07:39:40 PM »
Over the years, I have built several of their kits.  I think the first was a Kentucky pistol (!) in .45 cal.  This was back in the early '70's, and the kits were really fun, quick builds.  Every thing on all 5 of the kits fitted and shot beautifully.
But I have seen some newer kits, and was not impressed by fit at all.
Pedersoli seems to provide decent kits, although they are a bit pricier.  Built one of their "Bounty Hunter" .45's, with a 16 3/8" bbl.  That one, the barrel was so long that I checkered the forestock so it could be shot with two hands.  Excellent accuracy with that rifled barrel - was shooting 1" groups at 50 yards.  Had great wood, also.
Craig Wilcox
We are all elated when Dame Fortune smiles at us, but remember that she is always closely followed by her daughter, Miss Fortune.