Author Topic: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)  (Read 7041 times)

Smokey Plainsman

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Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« on: December 06, 2019, 02:21:14 AM »
Does anyone out there make there ramrod longer than the barrel? My gun seems like it has a short ramrod channel because the rod that came with it when inserted into the bore is almost perfectly flush with the muzzle. Or maybe thatís normal? When loaded with ball and powder, thereís not going to be much more than an inch of ramrod sticking up.

Iím going to build a replacement ramrod and am thinking of making it roughly 2Ē longer than the current rod, just to have some more length to work with when seating the ball that last little bit to ensure itís totally against the powder.

Now it seems Iíve seen some original guns (which may or may not have original rods) where the ramrod sticks out from the front of the muzzle. Does anyone here build their ramrods like this? Iím going to do so.

-Smokey

Offline JEH

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2019, 02:56:14 AM »
I have made them longer before because of the convenience of getting ahold of them like you mention. But one dark morning I threw one of my flinters in the rifle holder on my four wheeler heading out to the south 40 to do a little deer hunting, the stuck out rod caught on the shed door opening and ripped the upper thimble out of the stock! Wrapped some tape around it and went anyway and cussed all morning! They are all about muzzle length now

Offline mtlonghunter

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2019, 03:28:29 AM »
Check the ramrod hole to see if it can be drilled deeper. I usually drill them all the way to the lug on the trigger guard. Which  makes  them a little longer than the full barrel length.

Offline MuskratMike

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2019, 05:06:05 AM »
A couple of thoughts:
1. If you take the rifle out hunting with a too long ramrod you will hang it up on brush, maybe not today it will happen.
2. Put a ramrod adapter on the end of the ramrod that will accept a threaded jag, ball puller, scraper but still not exceed the barrel length.
3. Looks bad. Do you ever see a beautiful Lancaster with a too long ramrod? No you don't.
4. If the rifle was made correctly you will have enough rod protruding to set your charge.
5. It's a ramrod not a bayonet!
"Muskrat" Mike McGuire
Keep your eyes on the skyline, your flint sharp and powder dry.

RoaringBull

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2019, 05:23:03 AM »
I use a brass ramrod in my flintlock. Adds weight for better balance and makes loading a little easier. Plus it wont bend or break. And it extends out just a bit past the barrel. Maybe the length of the jag. I've never snagged it on anything. And it makes it easier to pull out from under the gun.

Offline Cades Cove Fiddler

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2019, 06:11:37 AM »
 ;D ;D ;D... nothing wrong with the rammer sticking out past the barrel,... I have longer rammers in all my Tennessee rifles, because all originals I used to see had them,... Tennessee hog rifles look right with them,... wrong without,... my rods usually stick  out 4" or slightly more past the muzzle,.... CCF

Smokey Plainsman

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2019, 06:56:35 AM »
Thank you, friends. It appears there is a bit more wood that could be removed in the channel.

I assume I remove the barrel and lock and then use a hand drill with the proper sized wood bit and just enlargen it some?

Offline mtlonghunter

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2019, 08:47:26 AM »
If you're going to drill the hole deeper , take the thimbles off as well. I've had the drill rod catch them and bend them if the drill whips a little out of alignment. I would also use a hand brace not an electric drill.

Offline mtlonghunter

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2019, 08:48:50 AM »
Don't remove the barrel , it supports the wood.

Smokey Plainsman

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2019, 10:02:17 AM »
Itís a half stock rifle with a screw-on under rib.

Offline JBJ

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2019, 05:06:28 PM »
Amen, CCF!
J.B.

Offline Pukka Bundook

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2019, 05:30:54 PM »
Like CCF says, (Rammer sticking out in front of muzzle)  they look kind of right on a Tennessee mountain rifle, but to me Awful on anything else!!

Never (and I use that word knowing we normally shouldn't!) seen on British or European guns.
With powder and ball or shot & such, a ramrod that is flush with muzzle when barrel is empty, will work OK for seating a ball etc.
For cleaning a screw-on jag is all that's required.

Offline nemovir

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2019, 06:00:00 PM »
Mine is even with barrel, but the ramrod is about a finger higher than the stock to get a better grip. 

Offline redheart

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2019, 06:59:42 PM »
Hey Smokey,
Maybe a member lives near enough to you that has the proper bit to deepen your ramrod channel.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2019, 07:03:04 PM by redheart »

Smokey Plainsman

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #14 on: December 06, 2019, 07:39:14 PM »
Hey Smokey,
Maybe a member lives near enough to you that has the proper bit to deepen your ramrod channel.

I live in Las Vegas so maybe not :(

Finding traditional black powder shooters here is tough, sadly. Iím guessing Iíd need a really really long bit, eh? So I should use a hand brace drill? I canít use my electric one?

If anyone could give a little more instruction thatís be appreciated. Thanks guys!!

Offline Craig Wilcox

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #15 on: December 06, 2019, 07:41:41 PM »
Get a brad-point bit of the correct diameter from one of the suppliers - MBS is north of you in Idaho.  Use a brace, if you can find one, or a good 1/2" drill that will rotate very slow, about 50 rpm or so.
Drill about a 1/2" or so, and clear chips, then do it again until you achieve the depth you want.
Most of us have a ramrod that is the length of the barrel from the face of the breech plug to the muzzle.  When you insert the RR, if it stops and sticks out a bit - something is in there!  Might be a live charge, might be an insect - check it out.  And when you load, have a little mark on the rod so you can identify a normal load.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2019, 07:47:16 PM by Craig Wilcox »
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Offline Notchy Bob

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #16 on: December 06, 2019, 10:22:24 PM »
I've seen photos of hunters from the southern Appalachians with ramrods sticking out beyond the muzzle.  There is a famous one of a barefoot kid with a rifle longer than he is tall.  However, I agree with the majority (above) who believe a rod protruding beyond the muzzle will be a pain... It will find things on which to snag.  If your rifle is empty (unloaded) and you put the ramrod in the bore, and you have anything at all there to grab and pull it out, the rod is long enough.  Your load height will increase the amount of protrusion, as will a jag.  Just for loading, you can use a plain old 3/8" ramrod blank, with no finish and no ferrules or anything else on it, if you just want extra length.  Cut the dowel to any length you like.  It will work fine as a ramrod.  We discussed cleaning rods, range rods, and ferrules in a separate thread.

Deepening the ramrod hole in the rifle seems pretty radical to me, especially if you are not properly equipped for it.  There are a lot of ways for that project to go south in a hurry.

I would respectfully suggest you get a range rod to bring with you and go try that rifle out, and not change anything until you are certain that's what you need to do.  Let us know how it goes.

Best regards,
Notchy Bob
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from The Antelope Wife

Offline StevenV

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2019, 11:29:14 PM »
Smokey if your ramrod sticks out about 1' at best past your muzzle, that is the way it is supposed be. We use "hunting jags" (roughly 3 1/2" long)  gives you plenty to grab on to. We never take the wooden ramrod out of the gun except to reload in the woods while hunting. Wood is not good for the end of your barrel anyway, get a metal , Stainless preferable with a barrel protector to use when shooting your gun.



Steve

Offline hanshi

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2019, 12:07:54 AM »
As previously mentioned ramrods on Appalachian rifles are commonly longer than the barrel.  I am not aware of this being the case with other "styles".  The only problem I've ever experienced with a longer than normal wood rod is having the tip catch and break off rendering the rod too short.  Mine are generally muzzle length.  My .32 SMR has the rod sticking out about 1-1/2" from the muzzle.  I didn't plan this when I made the rod; it just turned out a little longer. 
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Offline heelerau

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #19 on: December 07, 2019, 12:27:25 AM »
I actually lengthened the steel ramrod on my sporterized Potsdam smoothie as I could not get the ram rod out without a lot of fuss.
Keep yor  hoss well shod an' yor powdah dry !

Smokey Plainsman

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2019, 01:14:45 AM »
Thanks, all. Here is a picture of the ramrod all the way down in the barrel:



My original plan was to use a tapered threaded tip for a separate tow worm and ball puller. This is a PC method from my research, and using the bare end of the rod to load. I do not want a modern brass jag. HC/PC is the ultimate goal. I already have a solid brass range rod but for a field/hunting rod I plan to use the underbarrel hickory rod.

What is meant by ďbreech faceĒ? Is that the very bottom of the bore, or the seam where the back of the barrel meets with the breech that can be seen from the outside?

If you mean the later, it appears my rammer is about 3/4Ē short and the ramrod hole in the stock would be too short then?

Thanks!

Offline flinchrocket

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #21 on: December 07, 2019, 02:55:49 AM »
where is the end of that rod in relation to to end of the barrel when it's stored in the thimbles and hole?

Smokey Plainsman

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #22 on: December 07, 2019, 03:26:51 AM »
where is the end of that rod in relation to to end of the barrel when it's stored in the thimbles and hole?

Flush with muzzle where it normally should be.

Offline flinchrocket

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #23 on: December 07, 2019, 03:41:44 AM »
it may be that the ramrod is hitting the lug on the front of the triggerguard.

Smokey Plainsman

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Re: Longer Than Barrel? (Ramrods)
« Reply #24 on: December 07, 2019, 03:51:47 AM »
it may be that the ramrod is hitting the lug on the front of the triggerguard.

Where should the lug be? Iím looking down the hole, Iím not seeing brass.