finish for stock

[idruthrbfishin]

Hello, new to the forum, I apologize if this is in the wrong category.  I'm building a Lancaster style rifle, Siler lock, GM barrel, chose black walnut for the stock.  I'm wondering what the proper or traditional finish would have been for this rifle?  Not really interested in the "varnish" type finishes like Tru-Oil.  Thinking of a 50/50 mixture of boiled linseed and turpentine.  What should I use for a period correct finish? Thanks in advance.

[Clark Badgett]

Real boiled linseed oil. Not the kind in a can, but actual heat cooked oil with lead oxide added.

Dan Pharris can go into great detail on this, if he notices this thread.

[John Shaw]

This is a good question. I've heard or read that varnish was used as well as linseed oil. I doubt that either one was used exclusively.

[Scota4570]

Period correct is a  varnish type finish.  Thinned spar varnish is a viable choice.  I would not use true oil, it builds to slow.  Do not use BLO and turpentine.  It will take forever to get gummy, especially in winter.  It does not ever really dry.  It takes forever to get any thing resembling a finish.

There are lots of guys who use pet formulas and procedures, including me.  I now stain, then seal with shellac. For  finish I use BLO with japan dryer, thinned with real turpentine.  After the grain is filled I use a mix of BLO , bee's wax, and turpentine (slackum).  I usually ad black iron oxide powder to the slackum.  The process is fast an looks old timie.    This is graduate level stuff for guys who like to re-invent the wheel. 

Put that out of you mind until you have lots of experience.  Threads covering home spun finishes go on for pages.  That just means there are lots of ways to get a reasonable result. 

I would suggest you call Chambers flintlocks or Jim Kibler and get some Permalin.  For stain use iron nitrate aka aqua fortis.  Hardware store stains are useless on maple. 
   

[Goo]

Sunlight helps cure linseed oil, put it in sunlight after applying.

[Mike Lyons]

Kiblers iron nitrate with Tried and True varnish gave me this color on walnut.




Few more coats of Tried and True varnish  and some antiquing gave me this.

[Joe S]

As already noted, linseed oil and turpentine does not make a good gun finish.

If you want a traditional finish, I'd recommend brown varnish. Here's a link to an article on traditional varnish that Eric Kettenburg published some  years ago:https://www.muzzleblasts.com/archives/vol5no2/articles/mbo52-1.shtml

I use brown varnish exclusively on my guns, and for other projects as well. If making your own varnish interests you, PM me and I'll send instructions.

[Stophel]

This reminds me, I gotta get some linseed oil boiled up.  I'm out of just about everything.

I don't like surface varnish finishes.  I still don't know what to do about varnishing over carving...  On a carving-less gun, varnish is easy.  Lots of nice detailed carving... not so much.

[Scota4570]

Boiling the oil does not make BLO.  BLO has dryers added.   

IF you want to make a drying version of BLO add additional Japan dryer and turpentine.  Making it thinner will help avoid pooling and gumming on the surface.  It is a good idea to warm the stock before you apply the oil.  By doing so you force air out of the grain.  As it cools it will suck the thinned finish in to the pores and fill the grain better.  Putting a cold stock in the sun after applying finish will bow bubbles in the finish.  Anyway, the factory made BLO with dryers and thinner  added, when applied very thin will harden it a day or so, at least in my warm dry climate. 

OP disregard this and get Permalin.  These threads always seem to get off track. 

[Stophel]

By the way, for those contemplating boiling linseed oil....  While adding turpentine to the oil and boiling it may seem like a good idea, and it may even make a better finished product, absolutely do NOT boil oil with turpentine in it.  DON'T DO IT. 

If your oil catches fire when boiling (and sooner or later, it will), it's just oil, you can probably blow it out, and if not, simply put the lid on the pot and the flame is out, no big deal.  If there is turpentine in the oil, it's six foot flames of raging death.  You're definitely not blowing it out.  John Wayne couldn't put it out with dynamite.  Turpentine is exceptionally flammable.  It has a low flash point and is more dangerous than gasoline.  Do not get turpentine anywhere near any source of heat.

[WadePatton]

Dan Pharris has old posts on here were he goes into great detail how to properly process raw linseed oil into a nicely working product.

Some concoct their own varnishes.

Others use polymerized tung oil, which has great qualities. 

Mike Miller uses shellac.

Some use beeswax-I've been pleased with mine, very easy to patch/blend repairs.

All these finishes go way back and can be argued correct and viable wood finishes when used as those who find great success with them do it.  There will be naysayers of each variation.  Good luck sorting the discussion.  There's rarely a "one-thing" perfect correct answer to anything.

[Stophel]

For a pretty easy (NO boiling required) historical type varnish finish, get a quart of the Tried and True "Varnish oil".  Now, I have found that it is simply too soft still to be a surface varnish (not enough resins), so, resins can be added.

This is a very unscientific recipe, and you'll have to experiment to find what is just right.  I just happened upon a pretty good formula right off.  Pour out (or use up!) about a quarter or so of the can of Tried and True.  In a glass jar, pour in some turpentine (about the same amount that you poured out of the can) and add rosin.  Stir it up, and keep adding rosin until it won't dissolve any more.  This will take several days or even a week or more.  When the turpentine is "full", pour it into your can of Tried and True and mix it up good.  Now you have a varnish that will be hard enough to use as a surface finish.  If you get it too hard when dry (not likely) you can add some more oil.  If it's still too soft, simply add some more rosin.   Practice with it before you commit to finishing a gun with it.   I've had shockingly good success with this as a finish.  I've done modern pistol grips and other stuff with it too, and it holds up quite well.

For a purely in-the-wood oil finish, nothing on the surface, here's another relatively easy way to go.  Get the Tried and True "Danish oil".  This is a good quality pure linseed oil that is "pre polymerized" (apparently stand oil???) to a small degree.  Apply this in THIN LIGHT coats.  Allow it to sink in and make sure to wipe ALL excess oil off the surface.  With each LIGHT application, put it in the sun to dry.  Sunlight is absolutely crucial and necessary.  Do this over, and over, and over, and over again to fill the grain (some people use sanding dust to help fill the grain.  I don't, but you may find it helpful to hit a chunk of walnut wood on a sander and collect the dust to rub into the open pores of the stock along with the linseed oil).  When it finally gets built up near the surface, put a coat on relatively heavy, leaving it to stand on the surface.  Put it in the sun and let it nearly dry, then cut it off the surface with burlap, across the grain with a shoe shine motion.  A small amount of turpentine on the burlap may help some, but don't use too much.  THIS is the "hand rubbed" part of a hand rubbed linseed oil finish.  It requires a LOT of elbow grease.  When it's all finally off the surface, every nook and cranny, put it back out into the sun to fully dry, dry, dry.  You will probably have to do this one or two more times to get the grain completely filled with a smooth surface.

As with any linseed oil based finish, the applications need to be LIGHT (none of this "flood and soak" stuff), and each coat needs to DRY in the SUN.  Full sun for at least a day on all surfaces.  I can tell when it's dry by the smell difference.  When in doubt, leave it in the sun for another day or two... or three or four.

[Marcruger]

Mike Lyons, that rifle is sure coming along nicely. Have you got it assembled yet?  God bless, Marc

[Mike Lyons]

Thanks Marc.  I still have the ramrod to finish.  The lock is engraved and everything is all rusty.  I should be able to shoot it next week. 

Some of the original rifles I’ve had the opportunity to handle have a very heavy varnish on them.  Some even have red tints added.  If you get one of the KRA disks,  they have color pictures of original rifles.  It will be easier to mimic the color that you’re after.  Here’s a group of walnut from my current build using chambers, Tried and True, True oil, waterlox, iron nitrate, my vinegaroon etc.  I did a couple dozen test pieces before I picked one out. 

[dogcatcher]

Here is some more period correct info about finishes.  http://www.williamsburgartconservation.com/historic-varnishes-and-resi.html

[KentSmith]

I have found that 1 part good artist quality linseed oil, 1 part turpentine and one part spar varnish not poly makes a reasonable oil varnish. If the tur is let sit in the sun and exposed to the air a good time all the better. I think this comes close to Chambers product which would be easier to use if more expensive. Otherwise just buy  it from Mr. Chambers on his site.

[John Shaw]

In 50 years of trying to come up with the best finish I've come to rely on Alvin Linden's method the most, linseed oil and varnish. I give the stock a good soaking with linseed oil thinned with Naptha and Japan dryer added. I let it dry for at least two weeks, a month or two is better, and then coat it with varnish or polyurethane applied with a cloth and rubbed off as soon as it sets up. A blue Scott shop towel works well. For a shinier finish if I want it I polish the last few coats off with a soft cloth. The odd thing is that some of the finishes I've spent the least amount of time on come out looking the best.

JS