Author Topic: Cherry sure is nice to shape (Read 3723 times)

rich pierce · « **on:** February 19, 2020, 07:54:52 AM »

Working on re-creating this gun. It’s an original I missed at auction that is probably a New England re-stock (in cherry) of a fusil ordinaire. Planing cherry is a pleasure. I can see why New England gunsmiths often used it.

Stophel · « **Reply #1 on:** February 19, 2020, 09:58:33 AM »

Wait til you start inletting... your opinion of cherry may change...

rich pierce · « **Reply #2 on:** February 19, 2020, 03:50:30 PM »

Chris, mebbe so. The barrel inletting went pretty well. Had to go easy on the vertical breech cuts but no worse than a recent red maple stock.

bob in the woods · « **Reply #3 on:** February 19, 2020, 04:29:09 PM »

You must have a really good piece of cherry.

Inletting and carving the stuff has caused me to take the Lord's name in vain at times.

rich pierce · « **Reply #4 on:** February 19, 2020, 04:44:37 PM »

Tom Caster should chime in. That cherry stocked Schreit rifle looks like it was made from a great piece of wood.

Tim Crosby · « **Reply #5 on:** February 19, 2020, 05:19:04 PM »

Man Rich, those are some great Pix, didn't miss much. I have used Cherry for furniture and piece to piece it can almost be like your using two different kinds of wood.

Tim

smallpatch · « **Reply #6 on:** February 19, 2020, 05:49:17 PM »

I must have run across nice pieces of cherry. The stuff worked like butter....... smooooooooooooth.

LynnC · « **Reply #7 on:** February 19, 2020, 06:02:30 PM »

Years ago I made my grand daughter’s rifle from a cherry plank and it was a pleasure to work. Next project will be a cherry stocked fowler from a plank i bought in Ohio. I hope it works as well.

FALout · « **Reply #8 on:** February 20, 2020, 05:38:38 AM »

Nothing smells better getting cut on a table saw first thing in the morning.

Most cherry is great to shape, carve, and scrape, only complaint is it’s never as dense as maple. Makes a light stock with great color but dents and scratches show up pretty easy.

Clint · « **Reply #9 on:** February 20, 2020, 07:08:23 AM »

Like any wood, the lower in the tree and the bigger the tree, the harder the wood. One of the reasons N.E. gun smiiths used cherry is that there is a LOT of it and the bark is poisonous to live stock. Farmers cleared cherry away from grazing areas and barnyards so a many N.E. furniture pieces were cherry, it's also first rate fire wood. When you inspect stock wood, look closely at the end grain. Tight growth rings show slow growth and hard wood ,wide rings give you soft wood. BTW I have seen the odd cut out on the back of German flint cocks and now French. The notch doesn't seem to have a purpose, do you suppose it is a hold over from dog lock habits?

Cory Joe Stewart · « **Reply #10 on:** February 21, 2020, 04:15:07 PM »

This is a neat looking project.

Cory Joe Stewart

t.caster · « **Reply #11 on:** February 21, 2020, 05:57:22 PM »

I want to see pics of your work, Rich! The piece I used was about 10-11 yrs. old. Shaping was very easy, but watch grain direction very closely and your chisels must be S C R A R Y S H A R P for inletting and do it SLOWLY!!! actually that is always good advise in any wood.
That will be a neat project!

rich pierce · « **Reply #12 on:** February 21, 2020, 06:02:03 PM »

Thanks, Tom. Trying to get more shop time but so many other commitments plus my day job. So this won’t be a build-along. That would be like watching paint dry.

Dave Marsh · « **Reply #13 on:** February 21, 2020, 07:53:02 PM »

Rich, I'm retired and I like watching paint dry......

Dave

fahnenschmied · « **Reply #14 on:** February 21, 2020, 08:14:22 PM »

The shape of this stock is very much like any other French military arm of the day. Why do you think it was a restock? This could be European walnut. I have made a stock from cherry, as it was the best thing I had to match European walnut for an old Zimmerstutzen I was restoring.

Hungry Horse · « **Reply #15 on:** February 21, 2020, 08:22:52 PM »

A friend and I began work on a couple of tradeguns some years ago. Mine was stocked in Madrone, and his was stocked in Cherry. I had no problems with my madrone blank, and eventually put a cherry finish on it. His blank gave him fits, mostly from chip outs, that seemed to happen every time he cut across the grain. The worst of it was everybody thought my gun was stocked in Cherry, and his in walnut, no doubt do to the stain choices we both made.

Hungry Horse

rich pierce · « **Reply #16 on:** February 21, 2020, 08:28:40 PM »

Quote from: fahnenschmied on February 21, 2020, 08:14:22 PM

The shape of this stock is very much like any other French military arm of the day. Why do you think it was a restock? This could be European walnut. I have made a stock from cherry, as it was the best thing I had to match European walnut for an old Zimmerstutzen I was restoring.

I originally thought “French” and when somebody pointed out it is stocked in cherry my blinders fell off. I agree on overall architecture and parts. However:
1) it is stocked in cherry
2) no bayonet provision
3) no barrel bands as was found on the early fusil ordinaire
4) comb architecture at the front is finer than any military gun or trade gun.

There were extensive discussions on this gun both here and on Facebook groups.

Stophel · « **Reply #17 on:** February 22, 2020, 02:49:05 AM »

I once saw a similarly cherry-restocked French gun. This one rather older, like 1680's, with the bulbous finials on the triggerguard. Round faced lock. Heavy breeched, 4 foot+ barrel. Presumably restocked in New England in the 18th century.

yulzari · « **Reply #18 on:** February 22, 2020, 08:06:45 PM »

Perhaps it has the original stock? Assorted fruit woods were used in European stocking as well as the (far more common) walnut.

I have just bought a 6cm thick centre of the tree 3 metre length of seasoned cherry slab from my local French sawmill for use in making stocks. No remarkable figure but plenty of wood free of shakes and cracks etc to make four full length stocks with a short one and a couple of pistols too if needed.

rich pierce · « **Reply #19 on:** February 23, 2020, 04:07:01 AM »

Quote from: yulzari on February 22, 2020, 08:06:45 PM

Perhaps it has the original stock? Assorted fruit woods were used in European stocking as well as the (far more common) walnut.

As my Uncle Harold used to say, “Could be.” Unaltered cherry-stocked French gun’s are unknown here, but this could be a one-of-a-kind, I suppose.

Stophel · « **Reply #20 on:** February 23, 2020, 04:39:41 AM »

New Englanders apparently had ample contact (or rather, conflict!) with the French in Canada, and they seem to have really taken to the French style of guns, as so many New England guns are stocked in very French style.

P.Bigham · « **Reply #21 on:** February 23, 2020, 07:09:56 AM »

Maybe a dumb question but I read that ship masts were haverested and shipped back why couldn't gun stocks. ?

rich pierce · « **Reply #22 on:** February 23, 2020, 07:34:56 AM »

All possible but there are no documented cherry stocked French guns found here. Let’s imagine that there’s a very small chance this was stocked in France in cherry and ended up here. It is about a .69 caliber barrel, right size for French muskets. OTOH French guns made for civilian trade tended to be about .62. So, we have a French fusil ordinaire musket barrel, lock, and furniture on a cherry stocked non-military gun.

If made this way in France, what is it, and for whom was it made?
Why does it have a fusil ordinaire (military) lock and barrel on a civilian gun? It’s civilian because it does not have the barrel bands, no provision for a bayonet.

Ok, if it is civilian but stocked in cherry in France, why the unusually fine comb termination not seen on fusils de chasse (or other French guns of this period)?

A great many French arms were captured at and following the battle of Louisbourg in 1758. A good many New England fowlers have French military locks and some, like this one, feature furniture from French military guns.

My story for the one I’m building is that the New England maker got the parts off a broken fusil ordinaire captured after the decisive Louisbourg battle. Surely the British forces kept all the intact ones, but somehow many parts made it into the hands of New England gunsmiths. Black or open market?

fahnenschmied · « **Reply #23 on:** February 25, 2020, 06:25:16 PM »

All the French army patterns I know - 1717, 1728, 1746 etc, have mouldings filed across the tail of the lock - this one does not have it. Also, every French army musket I know of has the lock maker name or initials on the outside of the plate, but I suppose they could be filed away. And the cock has a notching at the base that none of the regulation patterns have. Almost like how the scandinavian muskets are cut for a dog catch. I don't know much about the naval patterns of muskets, perhaps some of those had similar locks without mouldings, but what else has the base of the cock cut away like that? And why?

rich pierce · « **Reply #24 on:** February 25, 2020, 06:54:46 PM »

Don’t have my books handy. Track sells an early banana shaped lock with a cutout on the cock. Different though.

To follow up on the “New England-ness” of this gun see Flintlock Fowlers by Grinslade NE 24 and NE 25.

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Author Topic: Cherry sure is nice to shape (Read 3723 times)